Bill Cosby attacks some in black community again

I know exactly where that is!

I’m a female, so I don’t know 'bout Club Nikki. Maybe we can go to Club 559 instead (Is that place still there?! I haven’t been down there in ages).

Most definitely! Although you’re a few years older than me, we definitely came up in an age when you did not have worry that much about what music your kids were listening to. Back in the day, hip hop had an edge, but it was harmless. “Roxanne, Roxanne”, “La-Di-Da-Dee”, “Brass Monkey”, and “My Adidas” was what we were jamming to. I remember my mother having a fit because I called up a radio station requesting Billy Ocean’s “Get Out of My Dream”, where the sexual innuedo is there, but not obvious (at least to a ten-year-old). Nowadays, kids are singing stuff like “back that thang up”, and their mothers are singing right alongside them. So I feel you 100% on that.

Last Christmas, I heard my neices arguing about what it was Kelis was singing about in that horrid milkshake song. I wanted to say something, but I wasn’t sure what to tell them!

I agree with you that public condemnation CAN be good (a change of mind since yesterday, when I first posted in that IMHO thread). Maybe Cos will encourage others to have tough (or tougher) love as well. But the public condemnation can’t come from some Ivory Tower for it to be effective. Unfortunately, even though Cos walks the walk, he is quite Ivory Tower. He’s older, for one, and he is not a part of the community–the “hip hop generation”, if you will–that he has a problem with. Condemnation has to come with love and respect, even if it comes from disgust and frustration.

I’m glad we have someone like you in the educational system. I’ve lost a little of my cynicism now. :slight_smile:

That’s simple math, and misleading. There’s roughly 8 whites in this country for every black. When factoring for this (per capita) blacks are disproportionately represented. It’s worth noting that the majority of crimes that blacks are convicted of are crimes against other blacks. In statistics tallied by victims, blacks are identified by their black victims disproportionately. While some prejudice exists and no doubt some innocent [black] men are still sent to jail, the problem of black crime is endemic.

Absolutely outstanding post.

Proabably the best thing for everyone would be if blacks would agree to periodically draft an action plan and progress report that would show the larger community that we are at least trying. I think that whites would be less frustrated with our screw-ups if they were assured that we as a community had a clear direction and goal, rather just running in every direction seemingly doing the wrong things on purpose. I’m not sure how feasible it would be to set up a federal commission that grades individual blacks on their behaviour and accomplishments, but it’d be a good way for blacks to get concrete societal feedback on their actions.

Or everyone could just mind their own business and worry about their own lives - maybe even lending a hand to his ailing bretheren once in a while if he’s feeling charitable. Whatever works.

[celestina scratchin’ her head]

pizzabrat, now I don’t know you, so I’m not sure if you’re being sarcastic or serious about an “action plan and progress report” that would help white folks "be less frustrated withour screw-ups. . . " This seems to miss the whole point of what Cosby is saying. His concern is with apathy and self-destructive behavior not with how frustrated non-blacks are with self-destructive behavior. I’m not trying to be mean or anything, but I find your post, particularly your notion of establishing “a federal commission to grade blacks on their behavior and accomplishments” to be offensive in the extreme, completely unrealistic, and the furthest thing from a solution to the problems facing African Americans. I could just imagine how up in arms white folks or Asians, Native Americans, Latinos, or any other group who engages in self-destructive behavior would feel if someone suggested what you did in your post for them.

Is your notion of a progress report or action plan to be done so that non-blacks can check up on blacks, or would it actually aid blacks? What would such a plan look like?

And this idea of a federal commission to grade blacks is completely out in left field. Come on now. Anytime I hear folks say let’s set up a committee to investigate X problem, that means they just going to sit on they a**es and spend a whole bunch of money killing trees. The government can’t agree on how to solve the Social Security crisis, how to deal with the economy, slow job growth, the shitstorm Bush & Congress have stirred up in Iraq that we goin’ have to pay for, and the list goes on. Do you really think they’re going to treat the self-destructive behavior of blacks, a percentage of whom live not too far away from them in DC, with any modicum of seriousness or practicality?

As far as Cosby’s comments go, I think he has the right to get up and say what he likes to whomever he likes. Correct me if I’m wrong, but can’t he do that because the First Amendment of the Constitution empowers him to do so? He certainly ain’t the first to say what he’s said. He’s part of a long and varied line of prominent black folks like Tupac, Queen Latifah, Arrested Development, to name a few rappers. Oh, I don’t have time to get into a list of other black folks what’ve given similar wake up calls to blacks about self-destructive behavior.

For what it’s worth, I’m going to throw out a couple of ideas to help us all think of a way to deal with self-destructive behavior because I don’t care what color, creed, culture, religion, and so on you are. If you’re an American, then you bear an equal responsibility for helping other Americans. For so long we’ve been throwing blame around, and that has gotten us nowhere except divided, uncommunicative, distrustful, and walking in circles.

  1. Everyone in America needs to educate him/herself on and come to an understanding of black and non-black contributions to the history of America. School curriculums can set this up, and the folks what are out of school can take classes or read up on their own. Now I know there’s no way to regulate this, and I know it’s a logistical nightmare to even think how schools are going to set this up because they are having difficulty teaching students in general. But still, I can hope, can’t I?

  2. Schools, parents, churches, social institutions in every community need to take the time to reinforce the reality of being an adult to children. I don’t buy the argument that they’re too young to handle information about contraceptives or STDs because they have access to resources that talk about sex and irresponsible behavior anyway. All they got to do is turn on the tv, go on the internet, go to the movies, or just walk outside. Show them the consequences of what having a baby are. Get them to figure out how they’re going to support children without an education that can lead to decent wage earning prospects that are legal. Educate them about basic economics of dealing with credit cards, balancing checkbooks, making major purchases of cars, or taking out college loans. Give them scenarios where having a good credit rating can aid them in getting jobs and making major investments like purchasing a house down the line.

One thing that disturbs me is how blacks and non-blacks know so little of American history and how pivotal a role blacks have played in it. I think that this moreso than anything else has contributed to the self-destructive behavior Cosby and others complain about. Maybe it’s because it’s the 4th of July and I’m just thinking about history–or maybe I’m just a nerd and I can’t stop thinking about history–but every step of the way from when the first African set foot on American soil as an indentured servant or enslaved person, black folks have fought, struggled, suffered, and died all in the pursuit of “life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.” Some fought and died in the Revolutionary War. As enslaved people, our ancestors risked certain mutilation, torture, and possible death to learn how to read. During Reconstruction and beyond, they dealt with the terrorist actions of the KKK and in general non-black apathy to their plight to try to gain economic, social, and political parity with whites, and if they managed to gain economic parity, many were lynched for their efforts. They fought in just about every major war America’s engaged in to still be rewarded with second class citizenship and/or a lynching. Historically, they’ve had little to no redress in the American judicial system. I could go on, but I won’t because this post is gettin’ too long, and I’ve got stuff I’ve got to do. Suffice it to say, black history is rich and revealing, and I fervently believe that America as a nation and blacks who engage in self-destructive behavior will not not progress until all Americans embrace America’s painful, ugly, past, understand it, and then try to not to repeat it.

I do want to address briefly something that monstro said about how she’s offended when other blacks take her to task for black self-destructive behavior. I know I haven’t walked in your shoes, and believe me I’m not judging you, but I don’t understand why this should upset you. I guess I just see things a different way. If a teacher/friend/parent scolds me for not doing a good job, then I react by wondering if their scolding is justified. If it is, then I get my act together and try to do better. If it isn’t, then I just laugh it off and keep on keepin’ on because I’m not the one at fault. I grew up hearin’ my momma tell me that if I’m black, I’ve got to be twice as smart as white folks and work extra hard because white folks are going to look at my skin color and think I’m stupid. When I had teachers who did just that–mind you, they were unjustified–my momma came down on them, and when she was finished I didn’t have no more trouble from them. Granted, I didn’t go to public schools, and I’ve never had life and limb threatened if I made an A on a test or a paper, but if I caught flack for being smart, then I just dismissed those folks as not being a friend to me. I just don’t understand why students think it’s such a terrible thing to want to get an education and to do well. Oh well. Still, I think I’ve said all this to say that you can’t control what anyone, black or white, thinks about you. However, what you can control is how you react to it. Don’t let it get you down. Life is too short. I think that I’d rather have someone set the bar high so that I can respond to teacher expectations, rather than have them sit back and expect less. But then I’m biased because I’m one of those black teachers who have high expectations of herself and of her students. :slight_smile:

Are you disagreeing with me? And how?

celestina, it was a joke. My point was that everything would fix itself if everyone stopped worrying about “the black problem” and started worrying about their own problems. Yes, some black people have problems, but why do they all have to be consolidated into a whole “black community problem” for irrelavant strangers to discuss? Earlier posters lauded Cosby for publicly condemning self-destructive blacks, and I’m wondering what the point is.