# Bill Maher: "We SHOULD blame China." **URL:** \ **Category:** The Quarantine Zone\ **Tags:** covid-quarantine\ **Created:** [April 11, 2020, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550 "2020-04-11T05:15:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/21 "2020-04-11T12:40:30Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > And the WHO should be defunded. In fact, the United Nations should be defunded. I’m not for revoking membership for piddling little differences, but a grossly totalitarian state should not have a voice in the future of the free world. Full stop. We can have difference on the death penalty and gun control, but if you have a national firewall to prevent your people from reading stuff on the internet, or throw people in jail for criticising the government, the you are right the fuck out of any conversation on world policy. You are confused about the purpose of the UN. It is not a deliberative legislative body to create world policy. It is a forum that realizes that international coordination and peacemaking is important, and every nation should participate regardless of their own internal policy. I’m not really happy that Russia and China have permanent seats on the security council. But the US is also not perfect. It’s better that we sit at a table and talk things out with other nations present, than sit in our respective nuclear bunkers and try to guess what the other party is thinking. If your idea of a stable world order is a hegemony of a US-led military/democratic coalition, maybe you should stop supporting a party that wants to tear this down to see what happens when every country goes it alone. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/22 "2020-04-11T12:50:30Z")
" Syphilis originated in America" is a bit of a stretch. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/23 "2020-04-11T13:16:37Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > " Syphilis originated in America" is a bit of a stretch. It’s the literal, geographic, historically documented scientific truth. Or do you think syphilis came from somewhere else? ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/24 "2020-04-11T13:49:49Z")
No, it came fom “the Americas” hundreds of years before “America” was a thing but if you really want to dig in your heels, knock yourself out. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/25 "2020-04-11T13:51:17Z")
This is being brought up more and more that the Chinese government should be held accountable and maybe even financially liable for this. Some articles: [USA Today. Time to Put China on Lockdown](https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2020/04/07/time-put-china-lockdown-dishonesty-amid-coronavirus-pandemic-crisis-column/2954433001/) [National Review: How to make China Pay](https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/04/how-to-make-china-pay/) [The Atlantic: China is Avoiding Blame by Trolling](https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/03/china-trolling-world-and-avoiding-blame/608332/) [Washington Times. Should China Pay the Bill?](https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/mar/23/should-china-foot-the-bill-for-coronavirus-pandemi/) [MSN.com. Should Cina be held Liable?](https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/opinions-china-should-be-legally-liable-for-the-pandemic-damage-it-has-done/ar-BB12oS9V) [ [URL=“[China And WHO Should Be Held Accountable For Allowing The Spread Of The Coronavirus Worldwide - Thailand Medical News](https://www.thailandmedical.news/news/china-and-who-should-be-held-accountable-for-allowing-the-spread-of-the-coronavirus-worldwide)”]Thailand Medical News. China and WHO Should be Held Accountable]([US lawsuits seek to pin coronavirus blame on China - Nikkei Asia](https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Coronavirus/US-lawsuits-seek-to-pin-coronavirus-blame-on-China)) There are alot more but they are behind pay walls. ---
**Author:** ![Tigers2B1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc29f/32.png) [@Tigers2B1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tigers2B1)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/26 "2020-04-11T13:56:17Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > This is being brought up more and more that the Chinese government should be held accountable and maybe even financially liable for this. > > Some articles: > > [USA Today. Time to Put China on Lockdown](https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2020/04/07/time-put-china-lockdown-dishonesty-amid-coronavirus-pandemic-crisis-column/2954433001/) > > [National Review: How to make China Pay](https://www.nationalreview.com/2020/04/how-to-make-china-pay/) > > [The Atlantic: China is Avoiding Blame by Trolling](https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/03/china-trolling-world-and-avoiding-blame/608332/) > > [Washington Times. Should China Pay the Bill?](https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/mar/23/should-china-foot-the-bill-for-coronavirus-pandemi/) > > [MSN.com. Should Cina be held Liable?](https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/opinions-china-should-be-legally-liable-for-the-pandemic-damage-it-has-done/ar-BB12oS9V) > > [ > > [URL=“[https://www.thailandmedical.news/news/china-and-who-should-be-held-accountable-for-allowing-the-spread-of-the-coronavirus-worldwide](https://www.thailandmedical.news/news/china-and-who-should-be-held-accountable-for-allowing-the-spread-of-the-coronavirus-worldwide)”]Thailand Medical News. China and WHO Should be Held Accountable]([US lawsuits seek to pin coronavirus blame on China - Nikkei Asia](https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Coronavirus/US-lawsuits-seek-to-pin-coronavirus-blame-on-China)) > > There are alot more but they are behind pay walls. So now we have permission? ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/27 "2020-04-11T14:02:30Z")
> [@Tigers2B1](#): > > So now we have permission? To what? sue the Chinese government or the WHO? Already being tried but [this article by Bloomberg](https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2020-03-24/can-china-be-sued-over-the-coronavirus) says you cant. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/28 "2020-04-11T14:21:06Z")
Syphilis was originally known (in Europe) at 'The French Disease). And its exact origin is unknown). > **[History of syphilis](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_syphilis)** > > The first recorded outbreak of syphilis in Europe occurred in 1494/1495 in Naples, Italy, during a French invasion. Because it was spread by returning French troops, the disease was known as "French disease", and it was not until 1530 that the term "syphilis" was first applied by the Italian physician and poet Girolamo Fracastoro. The causative organism, Treponema pallidum, was first identified by Fritz Schaudinn and Erich Hoffmann in 1905. The first effective treatment, Salvarsan, wa Many well... ---
**Author:** ![Tigers2B1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc29f/32.png) [@Tigers2B1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tigers2B1)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/29 "2020-04-11T14:24:26Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Can someone explain under what method China has the WHO under its thumb? I believe the WHO director implied or actually said that Taiwan was a province of China. In any event to take a look at this YouTube — there’s a lot of tension between Taiwan and this guy. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/XYA5EtbyjII/maxresdefault.jpg "Gravitas: Why the WHO chief is fighting Taiwan | Wuhan Coronavirus") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYA5EtbyjII) ---
**Author:** ![Tigers2B1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc29f/32.png) [@Tigers2B1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tigers2B1)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/30 "2020-04-11T14:31:20Z")
WHO officials “response” to a question about Taiwan’s lack of membership. BS. Very telling – [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/UlCYFh8U2xM/maxresdefault.jpg "Senior WHO official dodges questions about Taiwan’s WHO membership; praises China") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UlCYFh8U2xM) ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/31 "2020-04-11T15:07:56Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > No, it came fom “the Americas” hundreds of years before “America” was a thing but if you really want to dig in your heels, knock yourself out. It came from “the Americas”, but you don’t think that makes it American? And what’s your definition of when “America was a thing”, officially? The new world was named “America” around 1500, IIRC. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/32 "2020-04-11T15:10:52Z")
Good luck suing China. Maybe Judge Judy can hear the case. ---
**Author:** ![Tigers2B1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc29f/32.png) [@Tigers2B1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tigers2B1)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/33 "2020-04-11T15:25:38Z")
University of Southampton analysis indicates that if the Chinese government would have acted three weeks earlier then 95% of the viruses spread would have been avoided. If China would have acted two weeks earlier 86% of the spread would have been avoided. [https://www.southampton.ac.uk/news/2020/03/covid-19-china.page](https://www.southampton.ac.uk/news/2020/03/covid-19-china.page) ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/34 "2020-04-11T15:29:19Z")
“Blame China” doesn’t even really mean anything. We can blame individuals there all we want, but I’m more interested in the actions of people who are actually answerable to me. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/35 "2020-04-11T15:39:43Z")
But part of Bill’s point is that we should also be pointing fingers at their cultural practices that harm us all, even if it’s politically incorrect to do so. > [@CarnalK](#): > > Can someone explain under what method China has the WHO under its thumb? > > > 🇺🇦Hong Kong World City☔️ @HKWORLDCITY ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/36 "2020-04-11T15:46:26Z")
> [@Ruken](#): > > “Blame China” doesn’t even really mean anything. We can blame individuals there all we want, but I’m more interested in the actions of people who are actually answerable to me. No, it does mean something, and that’s an odd statement coming from someone always claiming to make statements based on scientific evidence. It appears fairly clear from the evidence that Patient 0 was in Wuhan, that the cause of it was a zoontic virus that was likely due to the wet markets in exotic animals that the Chinese authorities underplayed or misunderstood the seriousness of, and which AIUI have now been banned. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/37 "2020-04-11T15:53:55Z")
Unfortunately the ban seems not to have lasted: [https://thehill.com/policy/international/492109-bipartisan-senators-call-on-china-to-close-all-wet-markets](https://thehill.com/policy/international/492109-bipartisan-senators-call-on-china-to-close-all-wet-markets) > [@](#): > > China in late February announced a ban on wildlife trade and consumption and wildlife markets. But according to Graham and Coons, “[d]espite these statements, wet markets in Wuhan and throughout China are back in operation after the recent shut downs.” > On Wednesday, a group of more than 60 bipartisan lawmakers called on the World Health Organization (WHO) to issue an immediate global ban on wet markets. I’m sure they’ll get right on it. ---
**Author:** ![Tigers2B1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc29f/32.png) [@Tigers2B1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tigers2B1)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/38 "2020-04-11T15:55:50Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > No, it does mean something, and that’s an odd statement coming from someone always claiming to make statements based on scientific evidence. It appears fairly clear from the evidence that Patient 0 was in Wuhan, that the cause of it was a zoontic virus that was likely due to the wet markets in exotic animals that the Chinese authorities underplayed or misunderstood the seriousness of, and which AIUI have now been banned. In fact this is the third covid 19 like virus to come out of those wet markets. SARS, the avian flu, and now covid-19. There has been some reporting that China has reopened its wet markets once again. But of course the authoritarian government over there has kicked out a lot of Western reporters — so who knows. ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/39 "2020-04-11T16:14:50Z")
> [@Tigers2B1](#): > > In fact this is the third covid 19 like virus to come out of those wet markets. SARS, the avian flu, and now covid-19. There has been some reporting that China has reopened its wet markets once again. But of course the authoritarian government over there has kicked out a lot of Western reporters — so who knows. I think this is Bill’s point from the OP. In China, they have cultural practices (wet markets) that appear to be the source of these disease outbreaks in humans. The Chinese government closed these down after the SARS outbreak, but somehow somewhere sometime after that reopened and became normalized again. This is an area where the Chinese government SHOULD take blame - they had/have the power to close these down, and did not (they’re able to shut down places of worship and censor the internet, ferchrissakes). If you think about it that way, this whole mess may have been avoidable if China had no wet markets. Blame should not be placed on Chinese people living in China or anywhere else - the government in China should own this mess. ---
**Author:** ![Isamu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/7c8e57/32.png) [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2020, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550/40 "2020-04-11T16:31:57Z")
“You can’t yell at someone for breaking a rule you just made up.” I’ll try to remember that the next time the legislature makes a new law. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-maher-we-should-blame-china/851550.md?page=3)