# Bill O'Reilly again... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 12, 2004, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416 "2004-12-12T05:45:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/61 "2004-12-12T07:59:03Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > He said it was a “_predominantly_ Christian country.” Excuse me. > > O’Reilly essentially told him that it was too bad and that if he didn’t want to be _proselytized_ that he should go to Israel. It was an insult to all Jews. Ok, you are starting to get it right. He did tell him that if the caller didn’t want to be _proselytized_ he should go to Israel. The key here though that the caller has a different idea than most about constitutes _proselytizing_ than normal people do. These things also seem to affect the caller much more than a normal person. Given that it is basically impossible for the caller to avoid Christian holidays and what he views as_proselytizing_ Christians in the U.S. it logically follows that the caller should think of relocating to protect his delicate sensibilities. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/62 "2004-12-12T07:59:58Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > **Diogenes** , you never did acknowledge that most of the caller’s complaints were based on college experience and not grade school experience like you were pretending to be the case. That makes it a little different. The caller didn’t say that it was “mostly” based on college. Even so, the amount of energy that evangelicals put into stalking prospective marks is pretty creepy and quite tiresome. I couldn’t walk across campus without getting handed a pamphlet or encountering some idiot standing and preaching in the middle of the square. They talk _ceaseless;y_ about how “Christ is the ONLY way to Heaven.” There are also campaigns directed specifically at converting Jews. They’re sick of it as well they should be and they shouldn’t have to go to Israel to be left alone. They’re just as American as Bill O’Reilly is. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 8:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/63 "2004-12-12T08:02:20Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > Ok, you are starting to get it right. He did tell him that if the caller didn’t want to be _proselytized_ he should go to Israel. The key here though that the caller has a different idea than most about constitutes _proselytizing_ than normal people do. These things also seem to affect the caller much more than a normal person. Given that it is basically impossible for the caller to avoid Christian holidays and what he views as_proselytizing_ Christians in the U.S. it logically follows that the caller should think of relocating to protect his delicate sensibilities. No. He has exactly the right view of how insensitive and obnoxious a lot of Christians can be when it comes to the holidays. I doubt they even realize they’re doing it half the time. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 8:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/64 "2004-12-12T08:05:15Z")
> [@yosemite](#): > > The caller said that exchaging gifts was **setting kids up to be converted**. Loony. Not loony. Correct. It’s proselytization. It’s an attempt to convert children. The caller is exactly right. > [@](#): > > Look, I understand that one can get fed up, and I can certainly sympathize. But if this person didn’t want to sound like a loon, they could have expressed themselves differently. When they said loony things, O’Reilly, as is his way, said some impatient, poorly-thought out things back. Because the person was a _loon_. Loon loon loon. Not to defend O’Reilly—I don’t give a crap about him—but I see this as basically a badly-worded reaction to a whiny loon. The person was extraordinarily patient and rational and CORRECT. The only loon in that conversation was Bill “the insane bigot” O’Reilly ---
**Author:** ![yosemite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/3ab097/32.png) [@yosemite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yosemite)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 8:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/65 "2004-12-12T08:10:24Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > Not loony. Correct. It’s proselytization. It’s an attempt to convert children. The caller is exactly right. The caller set it was **SETTING KIDS UP TO _BE_ CONVERTED**. Like, the kids were at risk to **be** converted. That’s loony. > [@](#): > > The person was extraordinarily patient and rational and CORRECT. Loon loon loon. ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 8:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/66 "2004-12-12T08:15:23Z")
So **Diogenes** , what do you think should be done about all this? We have Christians running freely on college campuses passing out leaflets and inviting people to Bible studies. We have covert Christian symbols like Christmas decorations posted in plain view on public and private property. We have children giving gifts to other children with subtle conversion messages to those not of the faith. 1. So, what would you do to correct the situation both publically and privately? 2. What should Jews do if they are as offended as this guy? 3. What should Bill O’Reilly have said to the caller? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 8:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/67 "2004-12-12T08:15:59Z")
I see no qualitative difference between saying that Christians are _attempting_ convert kids and that they are “setting them up for conversion.” It’s the same statement. And it’s true. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 8:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/68 "2004-12-12T08:21:46Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > So **Diogenes** , what do you think should be done about all this? We have Christians running freely on college campuses passing out leaflets and inviting people to Bible studies. We have covert Christian symbols like Christmas decorations posted in plain view on public and private property. We have children giving gifts to other children with subtle conversion messages to those not of the faith. > > 1. So, what would you do to correct the situation both publically and privately? Nothing. Just keep it out of public institutions, don’t use my tax money and stay the fuck away from my children. > [@](#): > > 1. What should Jews do if they are as offended as this guy? Do exactly what this guy did. Let Christians know how it makes them feel. Stand up fir themselves. Tell the stalkers to fuck off once in a while. The way to fight free speech is with more free speech. 3) What should Bill O’Reilly have said to the caller? [/QUOTE] "You are correct, sir. You make a good point. I didn’t know how obnoxious we appeared to non-Christians. I am an asshole. I apologize… [Buzzzzzzzzzzzzzz] …What are you wearing?" ---
**Author:** ![yosemite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/3ab097/32.png) [@yosemite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yosemite)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 8:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/69 "2004-12-12T08:25:24Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > I see no qualitative difference between saying that Christians are _attempting_ convert kids and that they are “setting them up for conversion.” It’s the same statement. And it’s true. No, one is “trying” while the other is usually considered to mean "putting them at risk for . . . " No reasonable person thinks that seeing other people exchange gifts (or getting a gift yourself) is putting them at _risk_ for being converted. It takes far more than that to put someone _at risk_. Only a thin-skinned loony would think otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 8:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/70 "2004-12-12T08:31:18Z")
I don’t interpret the caller as having any genuine fear of conversion, just that he’s sick of the harassment. ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 8:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/71 "2004-12-12T08:32:26Z")
**Diogenes** , there is another strong piece of evidence that this guy is a true loon. It is the fact that he got on the O’Reilly show to begin with. You know that callers aren’t chosen randomly. A great way to get on is to sound as out there as possible to the screeners especially if you call is about something like this where there are many other people with reasoned, moderate opinions. A crazy person is easy for O’Reilly to shoot down and is very entertaining to the audience. They got what they wanted here and more. ---
**Author:** ![yosemite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/3ab097/32.png) [@yosemite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yosemite)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 8:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/72 "2004-12-12T08:37:20Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > I don’t interpret the caller as having any genuine fear of conversion, just that he’s sick of the harassment. Well, I take the caller’s own words at face value. He says that exchanging gifts or singing carols is _setting kids up to be converted_. Why did he say that if he didn’t mean it? Note that he didn’t say, “ **trying** to set kids up,” which would imply an attempt (perhaps a futile one), though that also is borderline loony because it’s still pretty far-fetched. (More likely that people just _don’t think_ about other people’s feelings.) He said, **"setting kids up.**" Like there is a real attempt to convert, and like there is a real risk that kids _will_ be converted. Loony. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/73 "2004-12-12T16:27:57Z")
“Setting kids up for conversion” was just a clumsy way to to say “proselytizing.” I think you guys are grasping at straws. You need to find a way for the caller to be “loony” so you can save Bill O’Reilly from being a scumbag. I’m not buying it. The caller was totally correct and regardless, there is no excuse for telling Jews to go back to Israel. And it’s not a Christian country. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/74 "2004-12-12T16:59:39Z")
They are grasping at straws? I suggest you look in the mirror Diogenes, you are the one putting words in Bill’s and the caller’s mouth in order to prove your ridiculously wrong point. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/75 "2004-12-12T18:09:18Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > I’m not buying it. The caller was totally correct and regardless, there is no excuse for telling Jews to go back to Israel. He never told Jews (plural) to go BACK to Israel. He told one Jew that the only way to not be bombarded with Christian messages was to go TO Israel. It was a stupid comment, because there are plenty of Christians in Israel. But you are completely twisting O’Reilly’s words. You are, in fact, lying here. Everyone is calling you on it, too. > [@](#): > > And it’s not a Christian country. Another lie on your part. What is the \*\*\*predominant \*\*\*religion in this Country, **DtC**? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/76 "2004-12-12T18:19:42Z")
It’s irrelevant. O’Reilly said that the US was founded on “Judeo-Christian values.” That’s a lie (and he spouts this "Christian country bullshit constantly on his tv show, it’s not just this one exchange). The ADL agrees with my take on this. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/77 "2004-12-12T18:29:21Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > O’Reilly said that the US was founded on “Judeo-Christian values.” That’s a lie (and he spouts this "Christian country bullshit constantly on his tv show, it’s not just this one exchange). And most people have acknowledge that the Judeo-Christian thing is incorrect. Whether or not O’Reilly has said this is a “Christian nation” at other times is irrelevant. You are claiming he said it THIS TIME, which he did not. His meaning was crystal clear. This is a PREDOMINANLTY Christian nation, which it is-- the predominant religion in this country is Christianity. It would actually be pretty easy to Pit O’Reilly for his views on religion and governmnent. Unfortunately, you picked a terrible example. Why not acknowledge your mistake here and find a better example? > [@](#): > > The ADL agrees with my take on this. Proves nothing. They’re in the business of agreeing with stuff like this. ---
**Author:** ![JeffB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeffb/32/188_2.png) [@JeffB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JeffB)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/78 "2004-12-12T18:29:32Z")
> [@manhattan](#): > > What, you don’t get May 8th off for Hayak’s birthday? Actually, [Hayek’s](http://www.imdb.com/gallery/ss/0285823/Ss/0285823/MX-20.jpg?path=pgallery&path_key=Hayek,%20Salma) birthday is September 2, and yes, I do get off. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/79 "2004-12-12T18:32:40Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > And most people have acknowledge that the Judeo-Christian thing is incorrect. Whether or not O’Reilly has said this is a “Christian nation” at other times is irrelevant. You are claiming he said it THIS TIME, which he did not. His meaning was crystal clear. This is a PREDOMINANLTY Christian nation, which it is-- the predominant religion in this country is Christianity. > > It would actually be pretty easy to Pit O’Reilly for his views on religion and governmnent. Unfortunately, you picked a terrible example. Why not acknowledge your mistake here and find a better example? > > Proves nothing. They’re in the business of agreeing with stuff like this. It’s irrelevant to O’Reilly’s defense that it’s a predominantly Christian country. That does not make it ok for him to tell Jews to go back to Israel if they don’t want to be harrassed. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416/80 "2004-12-12T18:37:36Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > That does not make it ok for him to tell Jews to go back to Israel if they don’t want to be harrassed. He never told anyone to got BACK to Israel. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-again/279416.md?page=5)