# Bill O'Reilly: Fucking tides, how do they work? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 4, 2011, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150 "2011-02-04T15:01:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/21 "2011-02-04T16:14:47Z")
The thing that really pisses me off is that he really plays into the meme that people who believe in God at scientifically illiterate, which isn’t true. Plenty of geologists, astrophysicists, and astronomers believe in God _and_ hold to the scientific theories of the origins of our solar system. But no, old Billy has to go on and on about how tides prove God exists. Fucking douche. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/22 "2011-02-04T16:15:04Z")
> [@Giles](#): > > That’s not true: the Earth and Moon orbit around a central point that is inside the Earth. That’s even more so with the other planet-satellite systems in our solar system. The Pluto-Charon system is unusual because the relatively large size of Charon puts the central point outside the surface of Pluto. Is the point whether the center of gravity is within one planet? > [@](#): > > Charon doesn’t orbit Pluto so much as Pluto and Charon rotate about a common fixed point between them. This doesn’t read that way. It’s a completely arbitrary distinction in any case. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/23 "2011-02-04T16:16:35Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > The thing that really pisses me off is that he really plays into the meme that people who believe in God at scientifically illiterate, which isn’t true. Plenty of geologists, astrophysicists, and astronomers believe in God _and_ hold to the scientific theories of the origins of our solar system. But no, old Billy has to go on and on about how tides prove God exists. Fucking douche. Sure. Just a far far smaller percentage than the scientifically illiterate. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/24 "2011-02-04T16:19:15Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > Is the point where the center of gravity is? > > This doesn’t read that way. Every system of bodies “rotate about a common fixed point between them.” A pebble rotating around Jupiter does not orbit the exact center of mass of Jupiter, but a point between the two centers of mass. In that case, it might be a couple of angstroms away from Jupiter’s center of mass, but still technically not at the center of mass. Earth and Luna’s fixed point resides within the Earth. That makes Luna a true satellite of Earth. Deimos and Mars’ fixed point resides within Mars. That makes Deimos a true satellite of Mars. Pluto and Charon’s fixed point is NOT inside Pluto. That makes Pluto and Charon two bodies that rotate about a common point, a point not inside either of their bodies. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/25 "2011-02-04T16:22:31Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > Is the point whether the center of gravity is within one planet? Yes, that’s the distinction **Bricker** and I are making. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/26 "2011-02-04T16:24:32Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > It’s a completely arbitrary distinction in any case. It might be arbitrary, but it’s PRECISELY the definition found in the [IAU’s Draft Resolution 5 for GA-XXVI, Footnote 2:](http://www.space.com/2742-iau-planet-defintion-draft-resolution.html) > [@](#): > > For two or more objects comprising a multiple object system, the primary object is designated a planet if it independently satisfies the conditions above.\*\* A secondary object satisfying these conditions is also designated a planet if the system barycentre resides outside the primary. Secondary objects not satisfying these criteria are “satellites”.\*\* (emphasis mine) ---
**Author:** ![Duke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Duke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/27 "2011-02-04T16:25:22Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > I’ll get you a paper and some carbons for your written apology. Done so. But why is it even an issue? As has been noted in this thread, some planets have no satellites, Earth has one, Mars has two, others have several. Sure, Earth is the only one with one, but calling it unique and special is like throwing a die six times and declaring that the fifth throw was unique and special because it was the only one to show a three. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/28 "2011-02-04T16:27:55Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Every system of bodies “rotate about a common fixed point between them.” I’m aware, considering that’s what I just said. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/29 "2011-02-04T16:29:47Z")
> [@Duke](#): > > Done so. But why is it even an issue? As has been noted in this thread, some planets have no satellites, Earth has one, Mars has two, others have several. Sure, Earth is the only one with one, but calling it unique and special is like throwing a die six times and declaring that the fifth throw was unique and special because it was the only one to show a three. I appreciate your continuing to find cites to make my point, It’s quite generous of you. Quoting form the link you just gave: > [@](#): > > A commonly accepted cutoff point by the vast majority of scientists for deciding between a planet-satellite or double-planet system is based on the location of the barycenter of the two objects (that is, the center of gravity). If the barycenter is not located under the surface of either body, then one may refer to the system as a double-planet system. In this case, both bodies orbit about a point in the free space between them. \*\*By this definition, Pluto and Charon would be seen as a double dwarf-planet system, whereas the Earth and Moon would remain defined as a planet-satellite system. \*\* ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/30 "2011-02-04T16:31:40Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > I’m aware, considering that’s what I just said. OK, so your only point of contention is the distinction of whether the barycenter is below the surface of the planet or not? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/31 "2011-02-04T16:36:01Z")
> [@Duke](#): > > Done so. But why is it even an issue? As has been noted in this thread, some planets have no satellites, Earth has one, Mars has two, others have several. Sure, Earth is the only one with one, but calling it unique and special is like throwing a die six times and declaring that the fifth throw was unique and special because it was the only one to show a three. Not only is Earth the only planet with only one satellite, but the ratio of mass between Earth and its satellite is orders of magnitude closer than between any other planet. Why is this relevant? Because we’re talking about tides. Now, Pluto and Charon also have a similar mass ratio, but don’t make the cut because the barycenter of the Pluto-Charon system resides outside either body, making them, by commonly accepted criteria and Resolution 5’s explicit language, NOT an example of a planet and satellite system. I missed your actual apology, by the way, unless “Done,” was meant to be it… in which case, thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Duke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Duke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/32 "2011-02-04T16:36:18Z")
ETA: Damnit, we need to stop editing like this. I knew allowing post-editing was going to be a bad idea someday, just like miniskirts and linotype. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/33 "2011-02-04T16:38:09Z")
> [@Duke](#): > > ETA: Damnit, we need to stop editing like this. I knew allowing post-editing was going to be a bad idea someday, just like miniskirts and linotype. It was better when streetcar fare was just a nickel. ---
**Author:** ![Duke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Duke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/34 "2011-02-04T16:38:32Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Not only is Earth the only planet with only one satellite, but the ratio of mass between Earth and its satellite is orders of magnitude closer than between any other planet. Why is this relevant? Because we’re talking about tides. > > Now, Pluto and Charon also have a similar mass ratio, but don’t make the cut because the barycenter of the Pluto-Charon system resides outside either body, making them, by commonly accepted criteria and Resolution 5’s explicit language, NOT an example of a planet and satellite system. > > I missed your actual apology, by the way, unless “Done,” was meant to be it… in which case, thank you. Well, yes it was. Tried to stuff the carbon papers through the internets, but it didn’t work. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/35 "2011-02-04T16:39:37Z")
> [@Duke](#): > > Well, yes it was. Tried to stuff the carbon papers through the internets, but it didn’t work. 🙂 You can just fax 'em over. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/36 "2011-02-04T16:41:22Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > OK, so your only point of contention is the distinction of whether the barycenter is below the surface of the planet or not? I thought you were saying that it was unique that the center of one planet was not what was being orbited as well as that the center of mass resides outside Pluto. We’re on the same page now. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/37 "2011-02-04T16:51:59Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > We’re on the same page now. Fun Fact: You can find the center of mass of that piece of paper using the instructions on the website Duke linked to. ---
**Author:** ![born\_too\_late](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ba9def/32.png) [@born\_too\_late](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/born_too_late)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/38 "2011-02-04T16:54:32Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > 1. This actually isn’t true since Pluto has one moon. Technically, Pluto has [three moons](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moons_of_Pluto). ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/39 "2011-02-04T16:56:28Z")
> [@born\_too\_late](#): > > Technically, Pluto has [three moons](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moons_of_Pluto). I’ll be damned. Didn’t know that when I woke up this morning. ---
**Author:** ![Dallas\_Jones](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dallas_jones/32/3277_2.png) [@Dallas\_Jones](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dallas_Jones)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2011, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150/40 "2011-02-04T17:47:22Z")
Well, at least O’Bill knows that there ARE tides. A fairly significant number of inland tourist don’t seem to know about tides. It was probably taught in the ‘Boring Stuff I’ll Never Use’ part of science class. They park their cars near the water’s edge and the Pacific eats the car, or they walk out to play on the rocks and have to be rescued by the Coast Guard when the water comes in or they just plain drown in other ways that would be amusing if there weren’t actual lives involved. There are many warning signs posted about dangerous sneaker waves, etc. but what they really need is a large sign saying “This is not a pond! Where the water line is now is not where it will be an hour from now!” Or something like that. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bill-oreilly-fucking-tides-how-do-they-work/570150.md?page=3)