# Billy Joel's Piano Man **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** music\ **Created:** [February 9, 2000, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084 "2000-02-09T20:30:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2024, 9:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/61 "2024-08-20T09:17:02Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > “Making love to his tonic and gin” — I always took that to mean that guy didn’t have a wife to go home to. His only relief is to drink. I think this has been minimized, but it hits home. Never mind why. But songs about bars and lonely guys are nothing new. I’m reminded of a Harry Chapin song, “A Better Place to Be”: _It was an early morning barroom, and the place just opened up,_ _And the little man came in so fast, and he started at his cup,_ _And the broad who served the whiskey, she was a big old friendly girl,_ _Who tried to fight her empty nights by smilin’ at the world,_ _And she said, "Hey Bud, it’s been a while, since you been around,_ _Where the hell you been hidin’, and why you look so down?"_ ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2024, 9:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/62 "2024-08-20T09:36:55Z")
> [@Spoons](#): > > To me, a “younger man’s clothes” would mean what I wore, back in the day. Which would look ridiculous on me now. And no, I will not be more specific. It’s leopard-skin spandex, isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2024, 10:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/63 "2024-08-20T10:00:49Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > This doesn’t sound like the kind of bar that young folk would go to for fun > > Buncha middle age guys drinking alone, and one waitress talking politics I figure it’s a locals’ bar, kind of like my local pub. Actually pretty busy most weekdays with the lunch crowd, and some evenings, but Saturdays can sometimes be really dead. More than once, I’ve been the only one there for an hour or two on a Saturday evening, and just a few regulars is pretty common. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2024, 10:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/64 "2024-08-20T10:18:37Z")
In case nobody’s seen this yet, here’s Joel’s own analysis of the song - mostly in musical terms - from his legendary appearance on _Inside the Actors’ Studio_: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/ELuZxvsUByQ/hqdefault.jpg "Billy Joel on 'Piano Man' 'Inside the Actors Studio' 1999") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELuZxvsUByQ) He’s actually not that big a fan. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2024, 10:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/65 "2024-08-20T10:18:57Z")
> [@Kent\_Clark](#): > > Or, he added, there’s an Internet story that the song is about a gay bar, since it’s all men, and Paul is talking to Davey, who’s still in the Navy. I’ve always loved this interpretation - that “Bill” is playing at a gay bar and hasn’t realized it yet, that John has a secret crush on him which is why he gives him free drinks, and that Paul who “never had time for a wife” was hitting on Davey in the Navy. It’s obviously not the original intended narrative, but it’s fun. Also: > [@Alessan](#): > > You’re overthinking it; “When I wore a younger man’s clothes” is just a poetic way of saying “When I was younger”. Yeah, I thought this one was pretty straightforward. > [@Alessan](#): > > Maybe, but to me it’s more that he was entirely focused on his drink, drinking it slowly, carefully, savoring every sip, while ignoring everything else around him. I agree. And I’m reminded of the old man in Ralph McTell’s _really_ depressing “Streets of London”: _In the all night cafe At a quarter past eleven Same old man Sitting there on his own_ _Looking at the world Over the rim of his tea cup Each tea lasts an hour And he wanders home alone_ ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2024, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/66 "2024-08-20T14:21:53Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > “Making love to his tonic and gin” — I always took that to mean that guy didn’t have a wife to go home to. His only relief is to drink. > [@Alessan](#): > > it’s more that he was entirely focused on his drink, drinking it slowly, carefully, savoring every sip, while ignoring everything else around him. both of these interpretations lead to the same conclusion: a very sad image. A guy with no wife, no life, his only relief is to savor his drink, and “to forget about life for a while”… ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2024, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/67 "2024-08-20T15:40:15Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > And I’m reminded of the old man in Ralph McTell’s _really_ depressing “Streets of London”: Sheryl Crow found him in L.A. _“All I wanna do is have a little fun before I die”_ _Says the man next to me out of nowhere_ _It’s apropos of nothing, he says his name is William_ _I’m sure he’s Bill or Billy or Mac or Buddy_ _And he’s plain ugly to me_ _And I wonder if he’s ever had a day of fun in his whole life_ ---
**Author:** ![burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/burpo_the_wonder_mutt/32/365_2.png) [@burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burpo_the_wonder_mutt)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2024, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/68 "2024-08-20T17:12:47Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > Saturdays can sometimes be really dead. Wouldn’t Bill be playing on the busy nights when he could actually get paid and garner tips? Totally off the wall: There was a time when someone could make a decent living putting out paperback originals (for newspaper racks at, say, the airport or your local 7-11 — I believe the term used was “cannon fodder”). One of the earlier Stephen King stories had a main character who did just that. I don’t remember particulars, but would Steve-o lie to us? ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2024, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/69 "2024-08-20T17:17:37Z")
> [@burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](#): > > Wouldn’t Bill be playing on the busy nights when he could actually get paid and garner tips? Nope. The manager at the local pub only books music acts on Fridays and Saturdays, specifically to try to draw more business. He doesn’t have to spend money on a band the other nights, because the pub is mostly full with things like sports teams having a post-game drink, or people watching sports on the TVs. Weekends are particularly slow in the summer because many regulars go up to their cottages/trailers for the weekend. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2024, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/70 "2024-08-20T17:18:50Z")
> [@burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](#): > > Wouldn’t Bill be playing on the busy nights when he could actually get paid and garner tips? Maybe Bill isn’t very good, and the other, more talented piano men play the good days. It would actually fit with the song’s tone. Bill’s got no more going on than any of the other regulars. He just thinks he does. ---
**Author:** ![burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/burpo_the_wonder_mutt/32/365_2.png) [@burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burpo_the_wonder_mutt)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2024, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/71 "2024-08-20T17:19:54Z")
I like the way you think. ---
**Author:** ![Spoons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spoons/32/3141_2.png) [@Spoons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoons)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2024, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/72 "2024-08-20T17:22:37Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > … And I’m reminded of the old man in Ralph McTell’s _really_ depressing “Streets of London”: Maybe that old man should be sittin’ in Miami, pourin’ blended whisky down: _"Old dogs care about you even when you make mistakes_ _God bless little children while they’re still too young to hate"_ _When he moved away, I found my pen and copied down that line_ _'Bout old dogs and children, and watermelon wine_ _. . ._ _That night I dreamed in peaceful sleep of shady summertime_ _Of old dogs and children and watermelon wine._ (“Old Dogs and Children and Watermelon Wine,” by Tom T. Hall.) Point is, that there can occasionally be a bright spot in those bars. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2024, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/73 "2024-08-21T01:51:43Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > Maybe Bill isn’t very good, and the other, more talented piano men play the good days. He said himself the piano sounds like a power mower. ---
**Author:** ![Coriolanus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/coriolanus/32/18769_2.png) [@Coriolanus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coriolanus)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2024, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/74 "2024-08-21T03:10:48Z")
If Billy Joel says it’s in 6:8 time and not the more familiar 3:4 time it’s his song and he still calls it a waltz and says he was surprised it was released. My father and I were listening to it on the car radio on the way from his machine shop when I wiorked with him in the early 80’s. As far as rock & roll he was partial to songs with harmonica and the rare accordion. And us being Long Islanders he probably knew of Billy Joel. “That’s a waltz” he says. And my stupid teenager self says “no it’s not” “1, 2, 3… 1, 2, 3”. Of course it is and you can’t unhear it as such. There are a surprising number of “rock songs” that have the same time signature. Paul Simon’s 'America;,Allman Brothers ‘Dreams’ etc… ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2024, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/75 "2024-08-21T13:42:09Z")
Whenever I hear that song I think about [Wyn Cooper](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wyn_Cooper#Songs). That whole experience must have blown his mind. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2024, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/76 "2024-08-21T13:48:54Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > Maybe Bill isn’t very good, and the other, more talented piano men play the good days. > > It would actually fit with the song’s tone. Bill’s got no more going on than any of the other regulars. He just thinks he does It’s exactly this. The guys who play the bar circuit aren’t making a lot of money. You do it when young to get your foot in the door, but if you’re still doing it a decade later, then that’s just a job. You’re not going to be a huge star. It’s the musical equivalent of being in the Navy for life. ---
**Author:** ![Patx2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/73ab20/32.png) [@Patx2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patx2)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2024, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/77 "2024-08-21T19:53:31Z")
I recently saw where Joel said the real estate novelist refers to the idea that Paul sells real estate, but wants to write the great American novel. He also said his intention was not that Paul and Davy are gay, but when the idea was pointed out to him, he surely can see why that connection might be made. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2024, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/78 "2024-08-21T20:31:22Z")
> [@Stratocaster](#): > > > [@Spoons](#): > > > > To me, a “younger man’s clothes” would mean what I wore, back in the day. Which would look ridiculous on me now. And no, I will not be more specific. > > It’s leopard-skin spandex, isn’t it? So you’ve seen the pictures too, huh? ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2024, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/79 "2024-08-23T03:30:25Z")
> [@Coriolanus](#): > > “1, 2, 3… 1, 2, 3”. Of course it is and you can’t unhear it as such. There are a surprising number of “rock songs” that have the same time signature. Paul Simon’s 'America;,Allman Brothers ‘Dreams’ etc… joe cocker’s “with a little helpf from my friends”, also comes to mind, as opposed to the beatle’s version which was 4/4 ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2024, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084/80 "2024-08-23T13:00:33Z")
> [@Coriolanus](#): > > “1, 2, 3… 1, 2, 3”. Of course it is and you can’t unhear it as such. There are a surprising number of “rock songs” that have the same time signature. Paul Simon’s 'America;,Allman Brothers ‘Dreams’ etc… Trivia: the last #1 on Billboard’s Hot 100 for 1958 was a waltz. [The Chipmunk Song (Christmas Don’t Be Late)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Chipmunk_Song_(Christmas_Don%27t_Be_Late)) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-joels-piano-man/7084.md?page=5)