# Billy Meier, whats the verdict? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 16, 2013, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000 "2013-09-16T20:03:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 24
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/461 "2013-09-26T19:44:43Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > According to whom > > You claim fake but no one has proven that its a fake It’s says right in your link the pictures were altered yet they’re still being used as proof. Look at how they’re labeled. > [@](#): > > ``` > Meier had given the negatives to a Herr Schmid for development at a cheaper price (there were some 700 hundred of them all from this trip). Schmid was a photographer who claimed he was from the Rhinevalley region in Switzerland. > Schmid was very harshly threatened and pressured by the "Men in Black" into adulterating Billy's photos on their behalf. Mr. Schmid had no alternative other than to comply with them. > The "Men in Black" found two doubles in America performing in an American TV show and photos from the show were used for manipulation of Meier's photos. > The manipulation of the photos was done by "By retouching, recopying, and "sandwiching" separate sequences. Schmid adapted and arranged the photos to look the same as Billy's originals (which no longer exist now). > The forgeries were done so perfectly, **that not even Billy noticed the adulterations over the past 23 years** , since the two female look-alikes in the photos have an extremely close resemblance to Asket and Nera, right down to the last detail. > > ``` Good ol’ Eagle-Eye Meier. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/462 "2013-09-26T19:45:05Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > Dude! Look at #110 and the Dean Martin photo. Her hair is styled EXACTLY the same. The same strands of hair fall the same way around her face, there’s the same bright curl under her cheekbone. So the aliens admired and copied the Historical Documents. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/463 "2013-09-26T19:45:18Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > Look at the eye brows, the nose, the lips, the shape of the face, the size of the forehead, the chin and the length of the face. > > I mean seriously even a blind man could see that these two ladies are totally different people Interestingly enough, when people move the muscles in their faces, eyebrows, lips and the shape of the face change somewhat. As well, when some ridiculously pathetic photographer washes out all the detail in his photo, it’s hard to see the exact shape of the nose. #110 shows the hair in reasonable detail, it’s dead on #109 despite the laughable quality of the photo shows the shape of the face and nose as being identical to the blonde dancer, it even has the shoulder of the 3rd dancer in frame #111 is simply an embarrassment to the concept of photography, my son has a toddler camera, no sense of composition, has to be reminded to hold still until it goes “click” and he has taken better pictures. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/464 "2013-09-26T19:47:43Z")
Such fashionable hair for the era these aliens had! ---
**Author:** ![Truman\_Burbank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecc23a/32.png) [@Truman\_Burbank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truman_Burbank)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/465 "2013-09-26T19:49:07Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > Come on for crying out loud > > Compare these two ladies in the photo > > Do they look like the same people to you > > I mean really > > [TheyFly.com - The Billy Meier UFO Contacts - Asket & Nera Photos](http://theyfly.com/Asket_%26_Nera.htm) > > Go to 'Meier alien photo and compare it with Dean Martin “ding-a-ling” photo I clicked on your link. **Absolutely** fraud. now the only question remaining is, evidence faked by Billy, or by _the aliens_? ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/466 "2013-09-26T19:50:21Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > It’s says right in your link the pictures were altered yet they’re still being used as proof. Look at how they’re labeled. > > Good ol’ Eagle-Eye Meier. In reference to photos #109 and #111 and not #110 ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/467 "2013-09-26T19:51:50Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > Interestingly enough, when people move the muscles in their faces, eyebrows, lips and the shape of the face change somewhat. As well, when some ridiculously pathetic photographer washes out all the detail in his photo, it’s hard to see the exact shape of the nose. > > #110 shows the hair in reasonable detail, it’s dead on > #109 despite the laughable quality of the photo shows the shape of the face and nose as being identical to the blonde dancer, it even has the shoulder of the 3rd dancer in frame > #111 is simply an embarrassment to the concept of photography, my son has a toddler camera, no sense of composition, has to be reminded to hold still until it goes “click” and he has taken better pictures. Wrong one See the photos labelled [http://theyfly.com/Asketdouble.jpg](http://theyfly.com/Asketdouble.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/468 "2013-09-26T19:52:51Z")
> [@Truman\_Burbank](#): > > I clicked on your link. **Absolutely** fraud. now the only question remaining is, evidence faked by Billy, or by _the aliens_? Fraud!? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/469 "2013-09-26T19:54:44Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > In reference to photos #109 and #111 and not #110 By who’s authority are you declaring this? It’s not mentioned anywhere on the page. ---
**Author:** ![Truman\_Burbank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecc23a/32.png) [@Truman\_Burbank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truman_Burbank)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/470 "2013-09-26T19:56:13Z")
Or, by the _Men In Black_? Occam’s razor, Dude. It’s not just for shaving anymore. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Truman\_Burbank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecc23a/32.png) [@Truman\_Burbank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truman_Burbank)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/471 "2013-09-26T19:59:14Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > Fraud!? Of course, fraud. As I understand it, that’s not in question. When we posit the photos were subbed in by aliens, we’re _conceding_ the fraud. Meiers _claims_ fraud!Now, who is the most liKely culprit? Meiers, aliens, or the MIB? Keeping in mind the Razor? ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/472 "2013-09-26T20:04:11Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > [Kalliope sounds off.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arMKT0r9cL8)Starts about 4:20 Holy Pleiades, Batshitman! Did you listen closely to what it said? > [@](#): > > She [Popi Meier] warns that he [Billy Meier] is using his faked UFO images to finance and promote a cult. OMG! That’s exactly what I said earlier. It’s like she’s reading my mind! Or, wait. Maybe I am Popi Meier! Bwahahahah. That would be your worst nightmare, wouldn’t it cultboys? ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/473 "2013-09-26T20:18:15Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > Wrong one > > See the photos labelled [http://theyfly.com/Asketdouble.jpg](http://theyfly.com/Asketdouble.jpg) You do realize that the top photo of Michelle DellaFave doesn’t look all that much like the bottom photo of Michelle DellaFave. That’s due to things like lighting, different facial expression, different makeup, etc. Anyway, this is where I’m going to register my personal irritation at your attempt to force me to look only at certain photos. Every verifiable photo of Michelle DellaFave is legitimate to use as comparison to Meier’s photo. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/474 "2013-09-26T20:28:07Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > You are making an illogical comparisons > > Everybody has something to go by in terms of Billy’s proof material > > The problem is people won’t look any deeper and any cursory glance at anything will not avail the truth of the matter. > > There is always a context to everything > > For example if you were just about to punch your friend as a gesture of playfulness but right at that moment a stranger walks in the room and sees you just about to punch someone and calls the police, who in this case has got their perception and interpretation of reality wrong? Again, you are thinking like a lawyer and not like a scientist. There are no police to call in science, things either are or they are not, and only repeatable observations can determine which any given “fact” is. Now, in the Meier situation, you have the wild card of allegedly supremely powerful entities who are supposed to act in their own interests. Once you begin to need to explain the motivations of immensely powerful and capricious beings you have left science and moved to evangelical theology. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/475 "2013-09-26T20:39:18Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > Come on for crying out loud > > Compare these two ladies in the photo > > Do they look like the same people to you > > I mean really > > [TheyFly.com - The Billy Meier UFO Contacts - Asket & Nera Photos](http://theyfly.com/Asket_%26_Nera.htm) > > Go to 'Meier alien photo and compare it with Dean Martin “ding-a-ling” photo Absolutely, positively, 100% without question, those are the same women. Definitely. Let’s take a step back. It’s not enough just to provide evidence, in the sense that you can’t just wave documents in the air and say “here’s my evidence! Believe me now!” The evidence you produce has to actually support your claims. It has to argue, persuasively, that your theory is right, and alternate theories are wrong. Also, about the burden of proof thing, which you guys also clearly don’t understand. The burden of proof is always - ALWAYS - on the person attempting to change the status quo. That is true for me as a scientist. It is true for you with your claims. The status quo is that there is no reason to believe that we have been visited by intelligent aliens. You are trying to change that. That means it is YOUR job to prove your case. We don’t have to prove that Billy Meiers is a fraud; YOU have to prove that he isn’t. This is how intelligent thought works. ---
**Author:** ![Gedd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gedd/32/4938_2.png) [@Gedd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gedd)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/476 "2013-09-26T21:19:44Z")
[This thread is what I needed after reading the Holocaust one.] **newinitiation** , does Bill have any physical evidence left besides photographs? The metal magically vanished of course (odd how that happens) but does he have anything else a university or scientific group could study or examine? On a side note, the Plejarens visited me last night! I took photo of the landing, posted them on Facebook, tweeted about it, and they gave me the cure for cancer and the upcomming winning Powerball numbers. Then when I refused to talk about them visiting on whale.to they got pissed! They hacked by Fb and Twitter accounts, erased my memory of the poweball numbers, and all I can recall of the cure for cancer is “14 K of G in a F P D” whatever that means. I do have this picture of a [northwest pacific tree octopus](http://zapatopi.net/treeoctopus/sighting.dehydrated_tree_octopus.jpg) that proves it all happened though. You just have to examine the evidence, ask how real it is, and if it makes sense. ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/477 "2013-09-26T21:52:02Z")
I had heard of Billy Meier before this thread, but I’ve become much more acquainted with the story after having read it. Now I’m scratching my head, wondering what Billy thinks he’s accomplishing with all this. Before, I had the impression that he was just scamming in order to get some notoriety, and possibly some money. Now after seeing how laughably inept ALL of the photos are, it makes me think that he is mentally unbalanced. I mean, if I were simply looking to hoax someone with fake UFO photos, maybe I’d make it out of Christmas tree ornaments and a garbage can lid, but I would find a way to photo it other than sticking it in a small tree. And if I wanted to fake pictures of aliens, I wouldn’t just take a picture of pretty women, and I wouldn’t just take a photo of my TV screen. Does anyone know about this Billy guy? Is he competent to take care of himself? Does he need mental help? ---
**Author:** ![Truman\_Burbank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecc23a/32.png) [@Truman\_Burbank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truman_Burbank)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/478 "2013-09-26T22:07:22Z")
“Before, I had the impression that he was just scamming in order to get some notoriety, and possibly some money. Now after seeing how laughably inept ALL of the photos are, it makes me think that he is mentally unbalanced.” BOTH! I vote BOTH! ---
**Author:** ![mystic7](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecccb3/32.png) [@mystic7](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mystic7)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2013, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/479 "2013-09-27T01:40:35Z")
The mossad had no problem killing Isa Rashid the translator of the TJ. The current stance of the CIA and Mossad toward Billy Meier is a neutral stance. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2013, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/480 "2013-09-27T01:44:05Z")
> [@mystic7](#): > > The mossad had no problem killing Isa Rashid the translator of the TJ. **The current stance of the CIA and Mossad toward Billy Meier is a neutral stance.** So that’s why they missed? That’s _neutral?_ [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000.md?page=23) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000.md?page=25)