# Billy Meier, whats the verdict? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 16, 2013, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000 "2013-09-16T20:03:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 51
**Author:** ![Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Attack_from_the_3rd_dimension)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1001 "2013-10-06T14:08:33Z")
\*\*tomndebb \*\*isn’t fixated on the letter J. He’s simply got the knowledge to explain that it is wrong, why it is wrong, and how that wrongness illustrates the shoddy fakery at work here. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1002 "2013-10-06T14:32:17Z")
We do have lawyers around here, but they don’t often visit flying saucer threads. So I am afraid they will continue to need to deal with science-types who give much less respect to testimony. old photos and mountains of documents than to consistent repeatable observations. Now, I wonder why they just don’t say _The space aliens told Billy that the modern German “J” is actually a more accurate transliteration than a “Y” or an “I,”_ because who could argue with a space alien? But no, they are saying that this person actually spelled his name with a letter that did not yet exist. That’s like saying that the F in Fidelius really isn’t an F but is actually a letter from a different language that no one knows yet. ---
**Author:** ![mystic7](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecccb3/32.png) [@mystic7](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mystic7)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1003 "2013-10-06T14:32:35Z")
There’s a tremendous amount of clamoring for proof on this thread in relation to the Billy Meier case. When that happens with the Meier case it’s a clear sign of weak consciousness on the part of clamorers. So are you beginning to see why the ET’s do not want their presence to be absolutely proven? When weak consciousness is shown proof they tend to fall flat on their face and start worshiping some false Almighty. That’s what happened during Jmmanuel’s time when absolute proof of the "celestial sons’ was given to the people of ancient Israel the vast majority of who had weak consciousness and somewhat degenerated spirit forms. And look what happened-- there was 2000 years of false cult religions resulting in the stifling of the peoples consciousness and spiritual evolution. The ET’s don’t intend to repeat such processes? Fortunately, a critical number of spirit forms are now ready to accept reality. And earth humanity is entering a period of hyper technology ie technological acceleration in which they are not as likely to be deceived into a cargo cult mentality. ---
**Author:** ![mystic7](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecccb3/32.png) [@mystic7](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mystic7)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1004 "2013-10-06T14:37:32Z")
By the way, weak consciousness is not necessarily the same as low intelligence. There many people of high intelligence who clamor and moan for proof. Some of these types might be the first to pull out their artillery, RPG’s ,and thermonuclear weaponry. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1005 "2013-10-06T14:40:55Z")
[quote=“newinitiation, post:972, topic:669000”] The UFO photos have gone through stringent scientific analysis with sophisticated equipment of the day and were deemed genuine and not models on strings. [Internet Archive link](http://web.archive.org/web/20120419112551/http://www.thebiggestsecret.org/home/index.php/articles/ufo-et/meier-hoax/60-meier-hoax/76-meier-smoking-gun) that tears the UFO photos into very tiny pieces. Explains and demonstrates how they were made. > [@newinitiation](#): > > They made many attempts on his life out of the documented 22 assassination attempts on Billy’s life but failed in some instances due to Plejaren intervention and help. So link to the newspaper reports or online police reports. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1006 "2013-10-06T14:43:22Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > At last one other sensible person has come to the fore. > > Totally unexpected Note that I do not, in any way, shape, or form, support your or Meier’s contention that the woman on the left is not of this world (“out of this world” having a completely different meaning). I am just saying that, at that time, multiple hot blondes roamed the Earth. Meier’s photos of “alien” craft are obvious, shoddy fakes and his “philosophy” is the worst sort of New Age word salad. Meier is a conman and a thief, and when you chose a mentor you chose poorly. > [@newinitiation](#): > > How true, how very true Because this is GD words fail me, but you remind me I have laundry to do. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1007 "2013-10-06T14:58:56Z")
I’m sorry, but the first(last, and only) thing that comes to mind when I think of Billy and his claims is [this.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHRq80QNnJM)(You tube video) edited to add: especially at 3:20 in. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1008 "2013-10-06T15:32:19Z")
Yeah, I know. And [George Adamski,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Adamski) whose UFO pilots wore Greyhound Bus drivers’ uniforms. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1009 "2013-10-06T15:46:44Z")
> [@mystic7](#): > > There’s a tremendous amount of clamoring for proof on this thread in relation to the Billy Meier case. When that happens with the Meier case it’s a clear sign of weak consciousness on the part of clamorers. The conclusion does not follow from the premise. Largely because the concept of “weak consciousness” is absurd and meaningless. How would you define “weak consciousness”? How is it measured? What makes you think it’s correlated to a desire for evidence. What this really boils down to, of course, is “anyone who disagrees with me is wrong”. The same can be said of about 90% of the “arguments” made in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![EinsteinsHund](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/einsteinshund/32/8400_2.png) [@EinsteinsHund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EinsteinsHund)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1010 "2013-10-06T16:19:07Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > The reality is that all forms of various earth languages have deteriorated > > [22  Plejadisch](http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/gaiaguys/meierv7p22-23.htm) I called you out on your bullshit claim that “most native German speakers don’t know High German” and asked you the simple question which language they know instead, and you pull another unsubstantiated claim out of your ass and give a “cite” of more imagined UFO mumbo jumbo dialog. Way to dodge the question, innit? Btw., Billy’s German in those cites is rather quaint and convoluted, but I can understand it perfectly well. No deterioration of my mother tongue on my part that prevents me from doing so. ---
**Author:** ![Truman\_Burbank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecc23a/32.png) [@Truman\_Burbank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Truman_Burbank)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1011 "2013-10-06T16:40:27Z")
Thanks for the correction. They all look alike! ---
**Author:** ![mystic7](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecccb3/32.png) [@mystic7](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mystic7)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1012 "2013-10-06T22:12:55Z")
Smeghead, There is a huge “consciousness” problem in our world today, much of which can be traced to overpopulation. IE autism, Aspbergers, developmental delay, cognitive deficit, etc. Many people with such problems do not understand the meaning of consciousness, thinking, mind, mental activity, etc. These people are mostly quite functional but they may argue with you that such idea as 'consciousness" are false and such a thing does not exist. I’m not kidding. Can you imagine the absurdity of such a mental stance? The Meier material is not directed to the weak of consciousness. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1013 "2013-10-06T23:11:24Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > But this doesn’t state in no way why it isn’t impossible . . . I lost you somewhere around the third negative. Anyway, what it does state is that you were wrong in claiming there was a magma chamber beneath Vatican City. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1014 "2013-10-06T23:14:10Z")
So, by your “logic”, if someone says that they would like evidence that all this talk of UFOs and aliens is true, then they much be autistic, or developmentally delayed, or otherwise mentally subnormal? Again, it boils down to: if you disagree with me, you’re wrong, and I can ignore you. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1015 "2013-10-06T23:17:33Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > . . . [Internet Archive link](http://web.archive.org/web/20120419112551/http://www.thebiggestsecret.org/home/index.php/articles/ufo-et/meier-hoax/60-meier-hoax/76-meier-smoking-gun) that tears the UFO photos into very tiny pieces. Explains and demonstrates how they were made. . . . This link didn’t work for me; my browser tried to search for an application to use to open it, and ended up downloading an empty file. I’d love to read the link; can you maybe figure a way to make it work? ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1016 "2013-10-06T23:19:49Z")
> [@mystic7](#): > > There’s a tremendous amount of clamoring for proof on this thread in relation to the Billy Meier case. When that happens with the Meier case it’s a clear sign of weak **consciousness** on the part of clamorers. You appear to have misspelled **credulousness**. Asking for proof, (or even undoctored, non-mendacious evidence), is the sign of intelligent people attempting to understand facts. If the only way to grasp the lack of facts is to have some sort of strong “consciousness,” I can only conclude that just as with the nonsense about the misspellings of YHWH and Immanuel, the nonsense about magma located directly beneath the Vatican that is, somehow, the same as Vesuvius, and the lies about the Jews, it is simply a contortion of the word consciousness to mean something other than what it really means. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2013, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1017 "2013-10-06T23:34:05Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > This link didn’t work for me; my browser tried to search for an application to use to open it, and ended up downloading an empty file. I’d love to read the link; can you maybe figure a way to make it work? [This site has the 2006 version](http://loveforlife.com.au/content/10/01/30/billy-meier-spiritual-teachings-billy-meier-and-extraterrestrial-assistance-channel) but the photos are on a defunct page. (Hence the link to the Wayback Machine) I don’t know why it’s not working for you, I had no problems with three different browsers. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2013, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1018 "2013-10-07T01:56:42Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > I am not and I mean if you read between the lines, what you wrote above is exactly what I was referring to Smeghead. > > For once we agree on one thing > > The Jews does not necessarily have to be a Zionist nor an Isrealite nor a Habraon OK > > There are even Jewish people who oppose the Zionist Isrealites and non Israelites alike and likewise just because you are a Zionist doesn’t mean that you are a Jew > [@newinitiation](#): > > I was referring to the poster in question so don’t put words in my mouth! > > And where do you get off on all this nonsense. > > The Jews of today have no resemblance to the old jews of the ancient. > > The ramnants of the habraon alliance still exists. > > You are wrong, the Zionists founded the state of Israel This is all pretty much boilerplate anti-semitic nonsense. The whole Hebraon/Israeli/Zionist/Jew bullshit is nothing but some idiot Jew-hater making up false origins of the Jewish people by not understanding (or by deliberately lying about) the histories of the various names. > [@](#): > > 1. Especially now, it also confirms what has been said since ancient times, that the Israeli people originally never were an actual people, but that this mass of people, in ancient times, singly and alone consisted of a gigantic group of degenerate and partially even criminal elements, who during their existence on Earth at that time only incited discord, falseness and war. There never was an “Israeli” people in ancient times. There was never a group of people in ancient times who were called “Israelis” by anyone else. Pure lie. As for the rest of the claim, quote the person(s) in ancient times who ever said this nonsense. Let us see what lies they have told, (or what lies the "ET"s have told). > [@](#): > > 1. Having come forth from the ones who were expelled, because they would not obey any order and were criminal, they assembled together in a mob in ancient times and formed the sham-people of the Hebraons, the gypsies, who in their megalomania and in selfishness and egoism, named themselves a chosen people, who wanted to take up an elevated and ruling position over all terrestrial peoples, as is indeed known to you. ``` DNA research has demonstrated that the Jewish people have been a people going back at least as far as the biblical account of David. There was never a group of criminals who organized a "sham-people." The Romani, insultingly called Gypsies, are not related to the Jewish people, at all and arrived in Europe from India long after the Jewish people were established. (People who like to hate Jews generally like to hate Romani, so a hate-filled European who wanted to invent bad stories about both groups would very likely pretend that "ET"s told him that they were the same people.) Hebraon is nothing more than a poor Greek rendering of the name that the Jewish people called themselves in earlier days. The "Chosen People" is a reference to a to the Jewish people. However, it means that when they behave as God wishes them to behave, they are "chosen" to be an example to other people regarding how God wants all people to behave. The notion that it is a claim indicating that they are intended to be rulers is a lie made up by people who either never bothered to actually pay attention or by people who knew the real meaning, but found it easier to stir up hatred if they told a lie. ``` Section 104 sounds a little bit like a corruption of the Prophet Daniel, Chapter 11, in which God says that people who oppose the Jews will come like thieves and even the Chosen People will be unable to stop them. That is not a claim that they are going to be rulers or that they were ever thieves, themselves. > [@](#): > > 1. But you also know that this sham-people over a very long time always reached its goals, however, always only through murder, arson, the betrayal of friendships, and intrigues, and so forth, whereby they, the original forefathers of today’s Israelis, were truly masters. More outright lies. What “goals” have this non-existent “Israeli” people ever reached? Much less always reached? > [@](#): > > 1. Their distant descendents now, today’s Israelis, respectively their responsible ones and their myrmidons can - like the U.S.A. - commit the worst crimes pitilessly and unhindered and with their secret services and military, right before the eyes of the world at large, and even with their approval. Today’s Israelis are simply the various Jewish people who have settled in the nation now known as Israel. There were never any previous people known as “Israelis.” Similarly, Zionism is nothing more than the political movement to secure a nation where Jewish people may live without being subject to pogroms, persecutions, expulsions, and all the other horrors that the Jewish people have suffered. Pretending that there are secret “Israelis” in history who have been criminals has no basis in reality. Even with all the lies and persecutions they have suffered, no one has actually claimed that except recent Jew haters. = = = And while your "ET"s used the word “Israeli” to talk about their imaginary band of criminals, I notice that you repeatedly use the name “Israelites,” so I am beginning to suspect that you are not an objective observer, here. Your words seem to indicate that you are, yourself, someone with an irrational hatred of Jews who is clumsily trying to hide that while (mis)quoting some other Jew hating European. The whole notion that there are real and good Jews and there are evil Hebraons and “Israelis” hiding among them is just one more example of nonsense. Certainly there are Good and evil Jews–just as there are good and evil individuals among all peoples. The "ET"s story of a whole group of “sham-people” who are, somehow, confused with the real people, today, is just dumb and hateful. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2013, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1019 "2013-10-07T02:00:27Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > [This site has the 2006 version](http://loveforlife.com.au/content/10/01/30/billy-meier-spiritual-teachings-billy-meier-and-extraterrestrial-assistance-channel) but the photos are on a defunct page. (Hence the link to the Wayback Machine) > > I don’t know why it’s not working for you, I had no problems with three different browsers. Very odd! It worked for me when I tried again. Never mind…oh, and thanks! Fun link! ---
**Author:** ![Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Attack_from_the_3rd_dimension)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2013, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1020 "2013-10-07T03:34:28Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > [This site has the 2006 version](http://loveforlife.com.au/content/10/01/30/billy-meier-spiritual-teachings-billy-meier-and-extraterrestrial-assistance-channel) but the photos are on a defunct page. (Hence the link to the Wayback Machine) > > I don’t know why it’s not working for you, I had no problems with three different browsers. > [@Trinopus](#): > > Very odd! It worked for me when I tried again. Never mind…oh, and thanks! Fun link! That’s a great link. I love the remakes of the Meier photos. Have we considered the possibility that Billy is actually very very tiny himself? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000.md?page=50) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000.md?page=52)