# Billy Meier, whats the verdict? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 16, 2013, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000 "2013-09-16T20:03:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 54
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1061 "2013-10-08T05:40:52Z")
> [@Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](#): > > To be fair, newinitiation didn’t post the OP, **TheBodhi** did, and now has disappeared. Newinitiation has bravely grasped the falling banner and thrust it forward… > > …into a tree. I haven’t disappeared but hey thanks for missing me Don’t I simply make your day:p ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1062 "2013-10-08T05:41:59Z")
> [@Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](#): > > \*\*tomndebb \*\*isn’t fixated on the letter J. He’s simply got the knowledge to explain that it is wrong, why it is wrong, and how that wrongness illustrates the shoddy fakery at work here. What if what he knows isn’t all that there is. How the heck would Tomndebb know anything about the ancient Lyrian language? ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1063 "2013-10-08T05:45:34Z")
> [@DrFidelius](#): > > We do have lawyers around here, but they don’t often visit flying saucer threads. So I am afraid they will continue to need to deal with science-types who give much less respect to testimony. old photos and mountains of documents than to consistent repeatable observations. > > Now, I wonder why they just don’t say _The space aliens told Billy that the modern German “J” is actually a more accurate transliteration than a “Y” or an “I,”_ because who could argue with a space alien? But no, they are saying that this person actually spelled his name with a letter that did not yet exist. That’s like saying that the F in Fidelius really isn’t an F but is actually a letter from a different language that no one knows yet. All people have to do if they are interested in scientific scrutiny of the proof material is to get a hold of Billy’s photos and pass it onto an image analyst ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 5:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1064 "2013-10-08T05:48:42Z")
[quote=“runner pat, post:1005, topic:669000”] > [@newinitiation](#): > > The UFO photos have gone through stringent scientific analysis with sophisticated equipment of the day and were deemed genuine and not models on strings. > > [Internet Archive link](http://web.archive.org/web/20120419112551/http://www.thebiggestsecret.org/home/index.php/articles/ufo-et/meier-hoax/60-meier-hoax/76-meier-smoking-gun) that tears the UFO photos into very tiny pieces. Explains and demonstrates how they were made. > So link to the newspaper reports or online police reports. That’s a shoddy work of the most amateurish pile of shitty pseudo investigative work I have ever seen. ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1065 "2013-10-08T05:50:29Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > Note that I do not, in any way, shape, or form, support your or Meier’s contention that the woman on the left is not of this world (“out of this world” having a completely different meaning). I am just saying that, at that time, multiple hot blondes roamed the Earth. Meier’s photos of “alien” craft are obvious, shoddy fakes and his “philosophy” is the worst sort of New Age word salad. Meier is a conman and a thief, and when you chose a mentor you chose poorly. > Because this is GD words fail me, but you remind me I have laundry to do. No matter You have at least shown some reasonablness in concluding accurately that the two photos are of two entirely different people. Well done, we are making some progress here. ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 5:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1066 "2013-10-08T05:54:22Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I’m sorry, but the first(last, and only) thing that comes to mind when I think of Billy and his claims is [this.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHRq80QNnJM)(You tube video) > > edited to add: especially at 3:20 in. This one is better https://www.youtube.com/embed/P7vktQAw8l0?feature=oembed&wmode=opaque ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1067 "2013-10-08T05:57:08Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > Yeah, I know. And [George Adamski,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Adamski) whose UFO pilots wore Greyhound Bus drivers’ uniforms. George Adamski is a fraud 1. Indeed, he does not know that he has never been in these pyramids with the spaceship and the counterfeit utensils, or that it has all only been implanted in him as reality, through trickery, and that he has never flown in a spaceship any more than has another Earth human, George Adamski, who presently deceitfully makes an effort in America to work himself up from hotdog vendor to being famous worldwide as the father of UFOLOGY, as the investigations into our spaceships will already soon be officially called. 203. Er weiss ja nicht, dass er niemals in dieser Pyramide mit dem Raumschiff und den gefälschten Utensilien gewesen sein wird, dass ihm alles nur als Wirklichkeit vorgegaukelt eingepflanzt worden ist und dass er niemals in einem Raumschiff geflogen sein wird - genausowenig wie ein anderer Erdenmensch, George Adamski, der sich gegenwärtig in Amerika betrügerisch darum bemüht, sich vom Würstchenverkäufer zu weltweitem Ruhme als Vater der UFOLOGIE hinaufzuarbeiten, wie schon in Kürze die Forschung nach unseren Raumschiffen offiziell genannt werden wird. 2. Certainly, with him, the difference is that he carries out various deceitful manipulations quite consciously, as, for example, through the production of fake photos from spaceship models, and through the manipulation of humans with his extraordinarily high power of suggestion, through which, he, like the malicious beings in the pyramids of Giza, tricks humans with unreal and nonexistent things. [http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy\_Meier/Asket's\_Explanations\_-\_Part\_1](http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/Asket%27s_Explanations_-_Part_1) ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1068 "2013-10-08T05:58:38Z")
> [@Smeghead](#): > > The conclusion does not follow from the premise. Largely because the concept of “weak consciousness” is absurd and meaningless. How would you define “weak consciousness”? How is it measured? What makes you think it’s correlated to a desire for evidence. > > What this really boils down to, of course, is “anyone who disagrees with me is wrong”. The same can be said of about 90% of the “arguments” made in this thread. You wish Just look at the evidence closer > **[Documented Evidence & Proof](http://www.theyfly.com/documented-evidence-proof)** > > Below are some PDFs with various documentation that corroborates and provides evidence and proof of the veracity of Billy Meier's claims. Original article on They Fly ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1069 "2013-10-08T06:12:21Z")
> [@EinsteinsHund](#): > > I called you out on your bullshit claim that “most native German speakers don’t know High German” and asked you the simple question which language they know instead, and you pull another unsubstantiated claim out of your ass and give a “cite” of more imagined UFO mumbo jumbo dialog. Way to dodge the question, innit? > > Btw., Billy’s German in those cites is rather quaint and convoluted, but I can understand it perfectly well. No deterioration of my mother tongue on my part that prevents me from doing so. Reeeeeaaaaalllllllyyyyyy Then what do these words mean? Absolutes Absolutum Bewusstseinsblock-Programme Lebensenergie, kosmisch-elektromagnetische Schöpfungsform schöpferisch Gedankenschöpfungen Geistbereich Geistenergiewesenheit Gemüt ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1070 "2013-10-08T06:13:19Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > This one is better > > [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7vktQAw8l0](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7vktQAw8l0) What do you do for a living-collect wackos? ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 6:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1071 "2013-10-08T06:19:51Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > I lost you somewhere around the third negative. Anyway, what it does state is that you were wrong in claiming there was a magma chamber beneath Vatican City. Yes there is 1. And Man of Earth should also think about, why in times of old, the most negative place on Earth was unconsciously chosen for the establishment of the Vatican, and why especially from there again, as numerous times before, the sign of death is set for the world, when the volcano, Vesuvius, will spew forth its lava, and with it announce the Third World War. 2. These are facts, which would be worthwhile if Man of Earth would think about these. 3. But as usual, there will be the know-it-alls and the cult-religion-faithful, who will say, that volcano Vesuvius neither lies in or close to Rome, but near Naples. 4. These know-it-alls, however, do not know the conditions inside the Earth, as the respective scientists do not know either. 5. Therefore, they do not know that the major activity of the volcano is not situated and takes place directly underneath, but quite deep and directly under the City of Rome, as well as in those regions, which by the end of November will be shaken by the coming quakes, which are partially caused by erupted magma-, water- and gas -chambers and partially by tectonic movements. [http://theyfly.com/news2005/march05/march05.htm](http://theyfly.com/news2005/march05/march05.htm) ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 6:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1072 "2013-10-08T06:23:17Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > This is all pretty much boilerplate anti-semitic nonsense. > The whole Hebraon/Israeli/Zionist/Jew bullshit is nothing but some idiot Jew-hater making up false origins of the Jewish people by not understanding (or by deliberately lying about) the histories of the various names. > > There never was an “Israeli” people in ancient times. There was never a group of people in ancient times who were called “Israelis” by anyone else. > Pure lie. > As for the rest of the claim, quote the person(s) in ancient times who ever said this nonsense. Let us see what lies they have told, (or what lies the "ET"s have told). > > ``` > DNA research has demonstrated that the Jewish people have been a people going back at least as far as the biblical account of David. There was never a group of criminals who organized a "sham-people." The Romani, insultingly called Gypsies, are not related to the Jewish people, at all and arrived in Europe from India long after the Jewish people were established. (People who like to hate Jews generally like to hate Romani, so a hate-filled European who wanted to invent bad stories about both groups would very likely pretend that "ET"s told him that they were the same people.) Hebraon is nothing more than a poor Greek rendering of the name that the Jewish people called themselves in earlier days. The "Chosen People" is a reference to a to the Jewish people. However, it means that when they behave as God wishes them to behave, they are "chosen" to be an example to other people regarding how God wants all people to behave. The notion that it is a claim indicating that they are intended to be rulers is a lie made up by people who either never bothered to actually pay attention or by people who knew the real meaning, but found it easier to stir up hatred if they told a lie. > > ``` > > Section 104 sounds a little bit like a corruption of the Prophet Daniel, Chapter 11, in which God says that people who oppose the Jews will come like thieves and even the Chosen People will be unable to stop them. That is not a claim that they are going to be rulers or that they were ever thieves, themselves. > More outright lies. What “goals” have this non-existent “Israeli” people ever reached? Much less always reached? > Today’s Israelis are simply the various Jewish people who have settled in the nation now known as Israel. There were never any previous people known as “Israelis.” Similarly, Zionism is nothing more than the political movement to secure a nation where Jewish people may live without being subject to pogroms, persecutions, expulsions, and all the other horrors that the Jewish people have suffered. > Pretending that there are secret “Israelis” in history who have been criminals has no basis in reality. Even with all the lies and persecutions they have suffered, no one has actually claimed that except recent Jew haters. > > = = = > > And while your "ET"s used the word “Israeli” to talk about their imaginary band of criminals, I notice that you repeatedly use the name “Israelites,” so I am beginning to suspect that you are not an objective observer, here. Your words seem to indicate that you are, yourself, someone with an irrational hatred of Jews who is clumsily trying to hide that while (mis)quoting some other Jew hating European. > The whole notion that there are real and good Jews and there are evil Hebraons and “Israelis” hiding among them is just one more example of nonsense. Certainly there are Good and evil Jews–just as there are good and evil individuals among all peoples. The "ET"s story of a whole group of “sham-people” who are, somehow, confused with the real people, today, is just dumb and hateful. Hostile Attitude toward Jews and Homosexuals [http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy\_Meier/FIGU\_Bulletin\_002#Hostile\_Attitude\_toward\_Jews\_and\_Homosexuals](http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/FIGU_Bulletin_002#Hostile_Attitude_toward_Jews_and_Homosexuals) ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1073 "2013-10-08T06:25:30Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > 1. But as usual, there will be the know-it-alls and the cult-religion-faithful, who will say, that volcano Vesuvius neither lies in or close to Rome, but near Naples. > 2. These know-it-alls, however, do not know the conditions inside the Earth, as the respective scientists do not know either. Do they actually use the term “know-it-alls”? For real?? ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1074 "2013-10-08T06:27:12Z")
> [@JBDivmstr](#): > > Wow! 361 posts by **NewInitiation** , and _ **every single one** _, in _ **this** _ thread! :eek: > That’s gotta be some kind of record. :dubious: > Not a record to be proud of, but a record all the same. 361 posts where did you pull this one out of ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1075 "2013-10-08T06:29:10Z")
> [@DrFidelius](#): > > So, do your benevolent space brothers have any suggestions for a solution to the problem of these weaklings? Learn the truth “The word of truth is given, and this is wholly sufficient to reveal the teaching of the truth for any who are willing to make and to bear the effort of learning through their own power.” The Earth human’s sense of effort towards seeking the truth has disappeared. He has lost the inclination to seek the truth through his inherent power of thinking, searching and recognizing. Therefore he has wandered into the erroneous form of thinking, that he will only accept as true that which he can touch with his hands and that he can see with his eyes and that he can hear with his ears. But this is the false, purely material way, which mocks and scorns any effort of self-thinking, self-feeling, self-searching, self-seeking and self-recognition of every solution and truth. Therefore through this, the way to the searching for the truth, and the finding of the truth, is not provided. And so, through the JHWH and the Prophets, no signs, or only sparse signs, should be given, that testify to the truth. The word of truth is given, and this is wholly sufficient to reveal the teaching of the truth for any who are willing to make and to bear the effort of learning through their own power. [http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy\_Meier/OM\_–\_The\_Book\_of\_Books\_–\_The\_Book\_of\_Truth](http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/OM_%C3%A2%E2%82%AC%E2%80%9C_The_Book_of_Books_%C3%A2%E2%82%AC%E2%80%9C_The_Book_of_Truth) ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1076 "2013-10-08T06:31:33Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > Hostile Attitude toward Jews and Homosexuals > > [The Future Of Mankind - A Billy Meier Wiki - FIGU Bulletin 002](http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/FIGU_Bulletin_002#Hostile_Attitude_toward_Jews_and_Homosexuals) From your link > [@](#): > > To begin with, the Talmud Jmmanuel certainly contains no hostile material against Jews, for the book represents nothing more than a chronological depiction of the spiritual teachings and past events from the period in Palestine, some 2000 years ago, when Jmmanuel was persecuted, imprisoned, innocently sentenced and nailed to a y-shaped cross by the Romans with the help of Jews. From the Jewish viewpoint, however, this fact has been vehemently denied since then – and the identical denials remain in place today through conservative, indeed fundamentalist, Jewish control powers. Nope-no hostility towards the Jews here, nosiree! :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1077 "2013-10-08T06:31:44Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > Well, I’m not going to accept your claims on faith. > > It doesn’t have a search function, oddly; in fact, it seems stragnely difficult to actually access witness accounts on a website that proudly proclaims that they have 500 witness accounts. > > Sir, no one’s suggesting that the hoax is putting Meier’s life in danger. They are saying that the assassination attempts are part of the hoax, and did not actually occur. Use the search function man! Open the file from internet explorer and use its search function. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1078 "2013-10-08T06:33:33Z")
> [@newinitiation](#): > > 361 posts where did you pull this one out of 381 now, and I pulled it out of your public profile. Are you saying that number is wrong? edited to add: That means that more than a third of the posts in this thread are yours. ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1079 "2013-10-08T06:34:20Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > [Wow, they’re clever!](http://theyfly.com/cnotes.html) > How can you tell? By reading [http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy\_Meier/Attempts\_on\_Billy's\_Life](http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/Attempts_on_Billy%27s_Life) ---
**Author:** ![newinitiation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/278dde/32.png) [@newinitiation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newinitiation)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2013, 6:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000/1080 "2013-10-08T06:36:30Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > I had a feeling the jews had to be at the bottom of all this. I’m just surprised it took 20 pages of posts for the truth to be revealed. Because you weren’t paying any attention, quite a Johnny come lately don’t you think!? Hostile Attitude toward Jews and Homosexuals [http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy\_Meier/FIGU\_Bulletin\_002#Hostile\_Attitude\_toward\_Jews\_and\_Homosexuals](http://www.futureofmankind.co.uk/Billy_Meier/FIGU_Bulletin_002#Hostile_Attitude_toward_Jews_and_Homosexuals) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000.md?page=53) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/billy-meier-whats-the-verdict/669000.md?page=55)