# Bird ID, please - SE Vermont **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 9, 2012, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653 "2012-07-09T00:48:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2012, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/1 "2012-07-09T00:48:39Z")
I recently saw two birds in a tree while visiting Brattleboro, Vt. They were both a little bigger than a large cardinal, with black heads and wings, and black spots on their breasts, and otherwise offwhite bodies. Their heads were shaped a little like a mallard duck’s, with black feathers sticking sticking straight out the back. They didn’t make any noise. No pics, sorry. Didn’t have my camera with me. ---
**Author:** ![pabstist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e99b99/32.png) [@pabstist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pabstist)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2012, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/2 "2012-07-09T02:20:21Z")
Maybe a woodpecker? There was no red on their head? Sounds like a loon, but they don’t really go into trees. I live in SE Vermont, and that is all I can think of. Curious now… ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2012, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/3 "2012-07-09T02:36:55Z")
[Royal Terns](http://www.pbase.com/noreaster/image/32611643)? ---
**Author:** ![MikeS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/919ad9/32.png) [@MikeS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MikeS)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2012, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/4 "2012-07-09T02:45:38Z")
I can’t think of a single bird native to eastern North America that has a black crest, assuming that’s what you mean by “black feathers sticking sticking straight out the back.” The best I can do is the [Horned Lark](http://www.allaboutbirds.org/guide/horned_lark/id), which does have little black tufts on its head; but they don’t have black wings and only a bit of black coloring on their head. ETA: Well, that’ll learn me to make statements about black-crested birds. Still, I doubt that terns spend much time in trees as stated by the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2012, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/5 "2012-07-09T03:31:31Z")
Didn’t look like a woodpecker; the beak wasn’t that noticeable. Didn’t look like any loon I’ve ever seen. Not a royal tern - the birds in that picture don’t have enough black on their heads or wings, and the beaks are bigger than those on the birds I saw. Not a horned lark - again, not enough black on its head and wings. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2012, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/6 "2012-07-09T03:40:27Z")
[Common Eider](http://www.pbase.com/noreaster/image/56544117)? Never mind…unlikely in Vermont. Not close enough to the shore. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/7 "2012-07-10T01:46:45Z")
Sort of like the white ones in that photo, yes. Those are closer than any others posted yet. But the head and wings of the ones I saw were all black, and there were black spots on the breast, and feathers sticking out of the back of the heads. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/8 "2012-07-10T02:01:02Z")
[Tufted Duck](http://www.google.com/search?q=tufted+duck&hl=en&client=firefox-a&sa=N&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=np&prmd=imvns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&ei=IIz7T42fJYiU6wGm0sXUBg&ved=0CFoQsAQ&biw=1600&bih=744), maybe? They don’t generally live in this hemisphere, but they’re known to be occasional visitors to both coasts. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/9 "2012-07-10T04:07:49Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Sort of like the white ones in that photo, yes. Those are closer than any others posted yet. But the head and wings of the ones I saw were all black, and there were black spots on the breast, and feathers sticking out of the back of the heads. [Red-Breasted Merganser](http://ih1.redbubble.net/image.9998588.0803/flat,550x550,075,f.jpg)? ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/10 "2012-07-10T04:16:21Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > [Common Eider](http://www.pbase.com/noreaster/image/56544117)? > > Never mind…unlikely in Vermont. Not close enough to the shore. > [@jayjay](#): > > [Tufted Duck](http://www.google.com/search?q=tufted+duck&hl=en&client=firefox-a&sa=N&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=np&prmd=imvns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&ei=IIz7T42fJYiU6wGm0sXUBg&ved=0CFoQsAQ&biw=1600&bih=744), maybe? They don’t generally live in this hemisphere, but they’re known to be occasional visitors to both coasts. > [@Tamerlane](#): > > [Red-Breasted Merganser](http://ih1.redbubble.net/image.9998588.0803/flat,550x550,075,f.jpg)? Those are all pretty unlikely to be sitting in a tree. [Goldeneyes](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Goldeneye)could conceivably be perching a tree but they lack spots on the breast or a crest. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/11 "2012-07-10T04:27:36Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Those are all pretty unlikely to be sitting in a tree. The Red-Breasted Merganser wings don’t fit all that well, either. Also, they’re a hell of a lot larger than a big Cardinal. But you did just make me search for photos of one in a tree. And yes, I failed :(. But I did at least find a _Common_ Merganser hanging with a couple of Wood Ducks in a [one](http://img2.photographersdirect.com/img/24020/wm/pd1799677.jpg) ;). ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/12 "2012-07-10T18:36:44Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > [Tufted Duck](http://www.google.com/search?q=tufted+duck&hl=en&client=firefox-a&sa=N&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=np&prmd=imvns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&ei=IIz7T42fJYiU6wGm0sXUBg&ved=0CFoQsAQ&biw=1600&bih=744), maybe? They don’t generally live in this hemisphere, but they’re known to be occasional visitors to both coasts. Kinda like that, yes, but without a black breast, and without as duckish a bill. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/13 "2012-07-10T18:37:49Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > [Red-Breasted Merganser](http://ih1.redbubble.net/image.9998588.0803/flat,550x550,075,f.jpg)? Not as long a bill, and with black wings. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/14 "2012-07-10T18:38:57Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Those are all pretty unlikely to be sitting in a tree. [Goldeneyes](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Goldeneye)could conceivably be perching a tree but they lack spots on the breast or a crest. Agreed. They weren’t Goldeneyes. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/15 "2012-07-10T18:39:58Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > …But I did at least find a _Common_ Merganser hanging with a couple of Wood Ducks in a [one](http://img2.photographersdirect.com/img/24020/wm/pd1799677.jpg) ;). No. It wasn’t all-black like that. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/16 "2012-07-10T19:03:13Z")
It wouldn’t have been a [belted kingfisher](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belted_Kingfisher), would it? ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2012, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/17 "2012-07-11T03:55:05Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > It wouldn’t have been a [belted kingfisher](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belted_Kingfisher), would it? I don’t think so. They had no blue on them, and IIRC the black of the head and wings were connected. ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2012, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/18 "2012-07-12T00:57:16Z")
I think you should go to the library or bookstore, acquire a field guide to birds of the North East, and tell us what you come up with. I can think of nothing that has all the attributes you describe. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2012, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/19 "2012-07-12T00:59:57Z")
I just might have to. Thanks to all for your help. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2012, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653/20 "2012-07-12T02:20:21Z")
> [@Ulfreida](#): > > I think you should go to the library or bookstore, acquire a field guide to birds of the North East, and tell us what you come up with. I can think of nothing that has all the attributes you describe. > [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > I just might have to. Thanks to all for your help. I’m getting ready for bed so I don’t have time to look through our copy, but I wanted to recommend Smithsonian Handbooks’ “Birds of New England” by Fred Alsop. There’s only been one bird we couldn’t ID using it, so your bird, even if it’s a transient species, is probably in it. My off the cuff guess is that you saw a rose-breasted grossbeak and just didn’t have the right angle to see the red. I’ve seen some and been confused until they’ve turned, so it happens. They’re not crested, but beyond tit mice, blue jays, cardinals, olive sided fly catchers (?) and black capped chickadees, not many NE birds are. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bird-id-please-se-vermont/627653.md?page=2)