# Bizarre animals: On ligers and tigons **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 23, 2004, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383 "2004-11-23T23:55:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Aankh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ebca7d/32.png) [@Aankh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aankh)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/1 "2004-11-23T23:55:24Z")
As a kid, I had an encyclopaedia meant for younger children (along the lines of “100 Interesting Science Facts” or something like that) which contained a small section about lions and tigers interbreeding to produce offspring termed ligers and tigons. Now, in all my years watching the Discovery Channel and National Geographic, I have never once seen a documentary on this topic. Nor have I ever come across any reference to these odd creatures in any text, apart from the original encyclopaedia article. A Google search does return entries, even some with pictures, but none from what I would call a “reputable” source on the issue. One set of pictures I found can be seen [here](http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/evolution/library/05/2/images/l_052_02_l.jpg), the source being [this PBS site](http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/evolution/library/05/2/l_052_02.html). Can anyone verify that these animals do exist? Also, why is there so little information about them out there?! ---
**Author:** ![Aankh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ebca7d/32.png) [@Aankh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aankh)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2004, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/2 "2004-11-23T23:57:17Z")
Umm…this was supposed to be a GQ, not a GD. Mods, a little help? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/3 "2004-11-24T00:02:09Z")
They exist. Lots of cross species [hybrids](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid) have been produced: sheeps and goats camels and llamas horses and donkeys (everyone knows about this) horses and zebras ---
**Author:** ![Splanky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b2d939/32.png) [@Splanky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Splanky)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/4 "2004-11-24T00:25:55Z")
Ligers are massive! Look at the one on the bottom of the page [http://www.greenapple.com/~jorp/amzanim/cross02a.htm](http://www.greenapple.com/~jorp/amzanim/cross02a.htm) ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/5 "2004-11-24T00:36:30Z")
Yeah, ligers are bad mo’ fo’s. If you ever get to see the Discovery Channel show: “Humanzee”, look for the film footage of ligers. The main thrust of the show is junky crap about Oliver, a chimp that was pushed as a human/chimp hybrid for years, but there is a part of the show devoted to real cross species offspring. Seeing a still picture of a liger just can’t compare to seeing one stride around on film!! ---
**Author:** ![Gaudere](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e495f1/32.png) [@Gaudere](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gaudere)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/6 "2004-11-24T01:08:09Z")
[Moderator Hat ON] To GQ. [Moderator Hat OFF] ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/7 "2004-11-24T01:17:30Z")
> [@Gaudere](#): > > [Moderator Hat ON] > > To GQ. > > [Moderator Hat OFF] Brief hijack… For Dopefests, I think the moderators should get golf-style caps that say “Moderator” across the front. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Liz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/liz/32/17737_2.png) [@Liz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liz)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/8 "2004-11-24T01:28:24Z")
Is it just me, or do the ligers on the page look rather deformed? The female looks bulky and ill-shaped around the shoulders, and the male’s legs look foreshortened and weak. ---
**Author:** ![Tranquilis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tranquilis/32/3639_2.png) [@Tranquilis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tranquilis)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/9 "2004-11-24T01:39:18Z")
There’s even been a very rare fertile tigon. There was some footage of the mother and her cub on one of those Animal Planet ‘rescue shelter’-type shows. Everyone had assumed she was infertile, so hadn’t bothered to segregate her from the males. Oops! :eek: I’ve had the pleasure of bottle-feeding a liger cub. Even a very young liger is one hell of a handfull! ---
**Author:** ![Aankh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ebca7d/32.png) [@Aankh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aankh)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/10 "2004-11-24T02:37:27Z")
> [@Splanky](#): > > Ligers are massive! Look at the one on the bottom of the page > > [http://www.greenapple.com/~jorp/amzanim/cross02a.htm](http://www.greenapple.com/~jorp/amzanim/cross02a.htm) Big! :eek: Given that tigers and lions don’t share the same territories in the wild (see [tigers](http://www.5tigers.org/AllAboutTigers/Subspecies/distribution.htm) and [lions](http://www.barbarylion.com/images/All%20About%20Lions%20Page/Present%20Day.gif)) is it safe to assume that ligers and tigons are the product of human intervention? Artificial insemination, maybe? ---
**Author:** ![Abbie\_Carmichael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/49beb7/32.png) [@Abbie\_Carmichael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Abbie_Carmichael)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/11 "2004-11-24T03:27:25Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > Yeah, ligers are bad mo’ fo’s. Hush yo mouth! Just talkin 'bout ligers! Then we can dig it! ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/12 "2004-11-24T06:59:58Z")
> [@aankh](#): > > Given that tigers and lions don’t share the same territories in the wild (see [tigers](http://www.5tigers.org/AllAboutTigers/Subspecies/distribution.htm) and [lions](http://www.barbarylion.com/images/All%20About%20Lions%20Page/Present%20Day.gif)) is it safe to assume that ligers and tigons are the product of human intervention? Artificial insemination, maybe? Yes to the first question, no to the second. The cites offered thus far make it clear that at least some of the matings were “natural”. ---
**Author:** ![Helen\_s\_Eidolon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Helen\_s\_Eidolon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Helen_s_Eidolon)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/13 "2004-11-24T13:24:14Z")
Ligers and tigons are COOL. Ligers, the offspring of male lions and female tigers, are larger than either tigers OR lions. They are MASSIVE. Check out [this](http://www.greenapple.com/~jorp/amzanim/ligersize.jpg) graphic representation. Tigons, the offspring of male tigers and female lions are smaller than either, and are apparently much more rare than ligers. Tigons do not have manes or have small ones, ligers have huge ones. Ligers also have spots - interestingly, from their lion rather than tiger half. They are extremely rare in the wild, but I think there have been ‘sightings’. All of the ligers and tigons that have been studied are the product of zoo matings (which do happen, sometimes without the handlers expecting it); I haven’t seen any references to artificial insemination. Someone mentioned that some tigons are fertile - that is the case. This has two interesting sequelae. First, there are such things as ti-tigons and li-tigons, their offspring. Second, it becomes obvious that we need to question our definition of species or our classification of lions and tigers as two seperate species. Now, as a fun way to end, I offer you [this](http://www.geocities.com/anti_liger_alliance) site. It has provided me with endless amusement. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/14 "2004-11-24T13:54:05Z")
> [@LaurAnge](#): > > They are extremely rare in the wild, but I think there have been ‘sightings’. Please correct me if I’m wrong (hey, it’s been known to happen), but isn’t it true that lions and tigers don’t even inhabit the same continent? So how could there be sightings in the wild? Unless we’re talking about captive animals being returned to the wild or something. ---
**Author:** ![paulberserker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@paulberserker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/paulberserker)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/15 "2004-11-24T14:04:41Z")
The bother I had at work last year trying to convince people these things existed. There can’t be any in the wild, Tigers and Lions never interact. All of them bred so far have been in captivity, and I very much doubt they’d release them into the wild - don’t they eat too much? Also, no survival instincts if they’ve been hand reared since birth. I think Siegfried and Roy had one too, before the tiget decided to invest in Roys neck. ---
**Author:** ![Aankh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ebca7d/32.png) [@Aankh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aankh)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/16 "2004-11-24T14:25:10Z")
> [@LMM](#): > > Please correct me if I’m wrong (hey, it’s been known to happen), but isn’t it true that lions and tigers don’t even inhabit the same continent? Not true. Lions are native to Africa, and are still found in Asia (in a little corner of India known as the Gir forest). Tigers are native to Asia - south Asia, all the way up to Siberia. Voila - same continent! Look at my post (#10 in this thread, I think) for a current day map view. > [@LMM](#): > > So how could there be sightings in the wild? I just noticed that **John Mace** ’s first post in this thread actually contained a Wikipedia cite. Perusing it, I see that: > [@](#): > > In natural conditions tigers and lions do not inhabit the same territory so do not have the opportunity to form such a species cross. (Lions and tigers coexist in the wild today only in the Gir forest of India although their respective ranges used to intersect in Persia, China and perhaps also Beringia.) Lions and tigers also do not usually want to mate with each other. To the best of my knowledge, this is false. I mean the part about the Gir forest. Gir is home to the Asiatic Lion, but not any sort of tiger. [Cite1](http://www.iit.edu/~bhatmeh1/main.html) and [cite2](http://www.indianwildlifeportal.com/wildlife-sanctuaries/gir-wildlife-sanctuary.html). Nevertheless, I think it can be assumed that in the days of yore, when we had not quite managed to blast 99% of the big cat populations, their territories probably did intersect somewhat, and liger-tigon cases could have been sighted in the wild. And **LaurAnge** - the front page is :D, but I think we’ve managed to Dope the rest of the site. > [@](#): > > The web site you are trying to access has exceeded its allocated data transfer ---
**Author:** ![Helen\_s\_Eidolon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Helen\_s\_Eidolon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Helen_s_Eidolon)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/17 "2004-11-24T16:33:20Z")
The other thing to note is that many of these ‘sightings’ are historical - vague accounts from way back when their ranges did overlap. Personally, I put very little credence in them. More likely they just saw a large, spotted lion, ---
**Author:** ![audreyayn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@audreyayn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/audreyayn)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/18 "2004-11-24T19:56:39Z")
According to the [http://www.greenapple.com/~jorp/amzanim/cross02a.htm](http://www.greenapple.com/~jorp/amzanim/cross02a.htm) site: "The stripes are inherited from its tiger parent and the spots from the lion parent. " Did I miss the bit where lions have spots? They just look like normal (if faint) tiger stripes to me. Anyway, I’ve seen them on tv. The largest of the big cats, they said. (No cite, sorry.) It looks like it should be chasing mastadons. Historically, leopards were believed to be the result of matings between cheetahs and lions (leo = lion, pard = cheetah) so I’d have to see some photographs to believe this ever happens in the wild and wasn’t a misunderstanding. ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/19 "2004-11-24T22:21:10Z")
> [@audreyayn](#): > > Did I miss the bit where lions have spots? They just look like normal (if faint) tiger stripes to me. [Lion cubs have spots.](http://www.spottycat.com/marlos/emporium/lion/lio02gt.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2004, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383/20 "2004-11-24T23:21:32Z")
> [@Anne Neville](#): > > [Lion cubs have spots.](http://www.spottycat.com/marlos/emporium/lion/lio02gt.jpg) Awwwwwwww [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-animals-on-ligers-and-tigons/276383.md?page=2)