# Bizarre Urban Myth **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 18, 2000, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378 "2000-03-18T21:03:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![funster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3ab097/32.png) [@funster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/funster)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2000, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/1 "2000-03-18T21:03:00Z")
Can anybody throw any light bizarre tit-bit which i’ve heard a few times here in England - ‘you don’t get many black swimmers because their muscles are denser than ours (whites)and so they are heavier and find swimming difficult’. Now I’m sure this is complete nonsense but where does it come from ? ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2000, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/2 "2000-03-18T21:13:00Z")
I remember a high school gym teacher (in the U.S.) telling us about some muscular guy who was a tremendous athelete, but couldn’t swin because he had little fat, and was all non-buoyant muscle. I don’t remember the guy’s race being mentioned, though. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2000, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/3 "2000-03-18T22:02:00Z")
I do not automatically dismiss the theory that some ethnic groups have physical advantages in SOME sports. I think it’s very obvious that black athletes (specifically, those from West AFrica or descended from West Africans) are much faster sprinters than other ethnic groups. As for swimming, however, I think there’s a simpler explanation as to why there are so few black swimming champions. It’s the same reason there are so few black golfers and tennis players: TO become a great golfer, you need regular access to a golf course, and to a skilled professional instructor. To become a star tennis player, you need access to tennis courts, and to professional instructors. To become a great swimmer, you need access to an Olympic-size pool and to a professional trainer. In short, most top golfer,s tennis players and swimmer are rich kids whose families belonged to country clubs! Only if and when black Americans become affluent enough to join country clubs in large numbers will we see whether they could become great swimmers (I suspect they could). ---
**Author:** ![funster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3ab097/32.png) [@funster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/funster)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2000, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/4 "2000-03-18T22:03:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by Revtim: > **I remember a high school gym teacher (in the U.S.) telling us about some muscular guy who was a tremendous athelete, but couldn’t swin because he had little fat, and was all non-buoyant muscle. I don’t remember the guy’s race being mentioned, though.** Right - thanks - sounds similar - as a lot of urban myths tend to be based on older versions etc. ---
**Author:** ![funster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3ab097/32.png) [@funster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/funster)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2000, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/5 "2000-03-18T22:14:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by astorian: > \*\*I do not automatically dismiss the theory that some ethnic groups have physical advantages in SOME sports. I think it’s very obvious that black athletes (specifically, those from West AFrica or descended from West Africans) are much faster sprinters than other ethnic groups. > > As for swimming, however, I think there’s a simpler explanation as to why there are so few black swimming champions. It’s the same reason there are so few black golfers and tennis players: > > TO become a great golfer, you need regular access to a golf course, and to a skilled professional instructor. To become a star tennis player, you need access to tennis courts, and to professional instructors. To become a great swimmer, you need access to an Olympic-size pool and to a professional trainer. In short, most top golfer,s tennis players and swimmer are rich kids whose families belonged to country clubs! > > Only if and when black Americans become affluent enough to join country clubs in large numbers will we see whether they could become great swimmers (I suspect they could).\*\* Thanks - that’s exactly what I thought the explantion was too, i.e., environment. Here in UK the top swimmers are almost exclusively white/middle class. Re the sprinting - I’ve also heard from the same person who had the swimming ‘theory’, that blacks are faster sprinters because they have ‘fast twitch muscles’ whatever that might be. I’m wondering if the reason for most UK sprinters being black is for the same reason - i.e. they tend to be from working class backgrounds/areas, where you tend to get more black people living. ---
**Author:** ![Nightingale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecae2f/32.png) [@Nightingale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nightingale)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2000, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/6 "2000-03-18T23:29:00Z")
I don’t have any scientific evidence to prove or disprove this claim, but I was friends with the head lifeguard at a large water park while in college, and he told me that it had been his experience that black males are more likely to drown or nearly drown. Also, I think I read once that people of African descent have denser bones, or something like that. I know that black women are much less likely to develop osteoporosis that whites. Anybody else ever hear that? * * * “There are more things you don’t know than there are things that I do know. I despair of the imbalance.” – Dr. Morgenes, _The Dragonbone Chair_ ---
**Author:** ![Alphagene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Alphagene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alphagene)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2000, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/7 "2000-03-19T02:45:00Z")
There was a GD thread discussing the idea that blacks are inherently better athletes in general, for anyone who’s interested in that angle: [Why Are Blacks Better Than Whites at Sports?](http://boards.straightdope.com/ubb/Forum7/HTML/000309.html) I don’t think the swimming story funster brought up is mentioned there, though. * * * **Gypsy** : Tom, I don’t get you. **Tom Servo** : Nobody does. I’m the wind, baby. ---
**Author:** ![funster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3ab097/32.png) [@funster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/funster)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2000, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/8 "2000-03-19T21:17:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by Nightingale: > \*\*I don’t have any scientific evidence to prove or disprove this claim, but I was friends with the head lifeguard at a large water park while in college, and he told me that it had been his experience that black males are more likely to drown or nearly drown. Also, I think I read once that people of African descent have denser bones, or something like that. I know that black women are much less likely to develop osteoporosis that whites. Anybody else ever hear that? > > \*\* Thanks Nightingale. ---
**Author:** ![RTA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b4bc9f/32.png) [@RTA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTA)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2000, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/9 "2000-03-19T21:49:00Z")
Ah, yes … the good old “Jimmy the Greek” school of sports-physiological philosophizing. Classic racism. One may as well say that black people don’t swim because there aren’t any pools in the ghetto! Needless to say, I find the subject beneath discussion. **NEXT …** * * * I’m a loner, Dottie … a rebel. ---
**Author:** ![funneefarmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9fc348/32.png) [@funneefarmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/funneefarmer)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2000, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/10 "2000-03-19T22:27:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by Nightingale: > \*\*I know that black women are much less likely to develop osteoporosis that whites. Anybody else ever hear that? > > \*\* Yeah, you heard it here from Majormd at [SDMB-Osteoporosis and Asian women](http://boards.straightdope.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/005605.html) ---
**Author:** ![Homer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/df788c/32.png) [@Homer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homer)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2000, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/11 "2000-03-20T04:47:00Z")
Go fuck yourself, RTA. You are so much better than everyone else. You’re just so great, because you’re so highly evolved. You, my good man, are so wonderful, the very THOUGHT that there may be racially-borne genetic predispositions towards one type of behavior or trait or another is so inherently racist and distasteful that someone as highly educated and elite as yourself can only show up on this little ol’ thread to voice your contempt for something so low. ::haaaawwwk:: Yep, dat 'ere nigger boy, boy sure can he run like’er wind. Hmmm hm. ::spittoey:: NO. That’s not the fucking intent of this topic. Is it SO WRONG to speculate that there may be a racial predisposition to some things? And how, dammit, is it racist to question that? No one is being discriminated. No one is being hated. No one is even being belittled. Yet, it is racist and awful. Ooooh, so horrible. Look, get a clue. Until the human genome is mapped, shit, until thousands of chromosonal sets from thousands of people from thousands of races and mixtures are mapped and thoroughly analyzed, we have NO WAY of knowing any of this stuff for sure. Why is it so wrong to speculate on something you have noticed or seen, be it stereotyped or ‘pure’? If it’s intent is not to lessen the status of anyone else, but merely to learn, why is there anything wrong with it? Shit. Don’t presume your worth to be more than anyone elses, and don’t limit yourself or your mind by what’s “PC” and what’s not. That’s bullshit. You’re not only hurting yourself by doing that, you’re holding everyone else back. –Tim * * * We are the children of the Eighties. We are not the first “lost generation” nor today’s lost generation; in fact, we think we know just where we stand - or are discovering it as we speak. ---
**Author:** ![Homer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/df788c/32.png) [@Homer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homer)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2000, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/12 "2000-03-20T04:51:00Z")
BTW, isn’t the purpose of this board to dispel ignorance? Your instant dismissal only helps to cast ignorance further into the darkness in which it stands. If you want to help, then help. If you want to judge and posture, shut the fuck up and go sit in your cardboard box. This goes for everyone. –Tim * * * We are the children of the Eighties. We are not the first “lost generation” nor today’s lost generation; in fact, we think we know just where we stand - or are discovering it as we speak. ---
**Author:** ![RTA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b4bc9f/32.png) [@RTA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTA)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2000, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/13 "2000-03-20T13:05:00Z")
Thanks for the outburst, teen angel … But coming from you in particular robs it of all meaning. Hey! I think “the Mexicans” are conspiring to break into your car again and take your stereo and CDs. Better run along, now, and check. * * * I’m a loner, Dottie … a rebel. ---
**Author:** ![Steve-o](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecc23a/32.png) [@Steve-o](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve-o)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2000, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/14 "2000-03-20T16:57:00Z")
Hey, I’ve noticed that blacks tend to have darker skin than alot of other races. Anyone else notice this, or might I be starting another UL? ---
**Author:** ![Steve-o](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecc23a/32.png) [@Steve-o](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve-o)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2000, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/15 "2000-03-20T16:58:00Z")
Ditto what Homer said. ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2000, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/16 "2000-03-20T17:05:00Z")
Yeah, it’s the same gene that predisposes them to like fried chicken. ::spitooey:: Seriously, though, I think the question has more to do with muscle and fat percentages. Are Blacks genetically programmed to have a lower amount of body fat? I don’t know one way or the other. Muscle tissue is less buoyant, since it’s mostly water. So does anyone have any quantitative statistics on body fat percentages? ---
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2000, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/17 "2000-03-20T17:19:00Z")
The place for profanity-laced tirades is the BBQ Pit. Take it there or knock it off, **Homer**. * * * [Change Your Password, Please](http://204.95.48.199/cgi-bin/ubbcgi/ubbmisc.cgi?action=getannounce&ForumNumber=3&Start=2451545.99&End=2451911&Session=2451598.1854) and don’t use HTML, as it has been disabled, but you can learn about superscripts [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/ubb/Forum2/HTML/000795.html) ---
**Author:** ![Ursa\_Major](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/a88e57/32.png) [@Ursa\_Major](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ursa_Major)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2000, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/18 "2000-03-20T17:26:00Z")
I would venture that cultural (including socio-economic) preferences have more to do with it than physical disposition. Is there some genetic reason for there being so few black hockey players? Or white rappers? Or Chinese NASCAR drivers? ---
**Author:** ![Timothy\_Campbell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/958977/32.png) [@Timothy\_Campbell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Timothy_Campbell)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2000, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/19 "2000-03-20T17:58:00Z")
I don’t know about black people being more likely to sink, but I’m white and I simply can not float. I have another white friend who is the same way. Now I have a fair bit of fat on me, and he has relatively little. I do have a white friend who is quite a bit overweight, and he floats like a cork. * * * Are you educated, erudite and maybe a bit eccentric? Please help us test a [new web game](http://www.pyroto.com)! ---
**Author:** ![Milossarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Milossarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Milossarian)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2000, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378/20 "2000-03-21T06:09:00Z")
There is something to this myth, but I haven’t a clue as to why it is. The idea that blacks can’t swim as well because they don’t have access to Olympic swimming pools and coaches is ludicrous. The percentage of people who learn to swim in such places is small. Most learn to swim in lakes, rivers, reservoirs, the ocean. Blacks on the east and west coasts, the Gulf Coast, along the Mississippi, anywhere there’s a damn lake should have just as much predisposition for swimming skill as anyone. Anyone remember the old ABC Sports show “The Superstars” on weekends back in the 1970s/early '80s? They would take the preeminent athletes from a variety of pro sports - football, baseball, track, etc. - and have them go through a series of different contests to determine the best of the best. When it got to the pool and swimming, it was like a snap of the fingers that the black athletes fell back in the pack. We’re talking about the most physically fit people around, too. Like I said, I don’t know why exactly this is, and I wouldn’t even want to speculate. But I’m with Homer; I can’t stand political correctness that says you can’t question something in a non-violent or non-persecutory way. By the way, the reason there aren’t many black hockey players is the game came into prominence in Canada, which has very few blacks. Until very recently there weren’t very many _Americans_ playing the game, of any ethnicity. Hockey is becoming more popular in the U.S.; pro teams in warm-weather locales and the advent of rollerblades have furthered the process. And, surprise-surprise, there are more black players in the college and pro ranks now than ever before, and their skill level and importance to their teams is increasing as well. * * * “Nothing is so firmly believed as what is least known” - Michel Gyquem de Montaigne [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bizarre-urban-myth/10378.md?page=2)