# Black holes, faster than light travel and ten dimentional space. IDEAS???
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [November 10, 1999, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052 "1999-11-10T16:07:00Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@BIGmatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BIGmatt)
#### Post date: [November 10, 1999, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/1 "1999-11-10T16:07:00Z")
Does anyone have any ideas on balck holes, ten dimentional space (or however many dimentions there are (supposedly) now and faster than light travel (of anything)??
Please help me… am I the only one who thinks about these things???
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### Author:  [@Derf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derf)
#### Post date: [November 10, 1999, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/2 "1999-11-10T16:22:00Z")
Read Michio Kaku’s _HyperSpace_
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“To be great is to be misunderstood” – Ralph Waldo Emerson
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### Author:  [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)
#### Post date: [November 10, 1999, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/3 "1999-11-10T17:02:00Z")
Yes BIGmatt, we have manny ideas about such things. However, we are constrained by contact protocols from revealing them to you at this stage in your cultural development. If you have any complaints about this policy they can be presented in person at the regional office on Sigma Draconis IV. Any complaints not accompanied by a sentient entity will not be processed or considered. Non-corporeal intelligences use sub-office C.
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### Author:  [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C_K_Dexter_Haven)
#### Post date: [November 11, 1999, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/4 "1999-11-11T06:49:00Z")
Check out: [How many dimensions are there?](http://www.straightdope.com/mailbag/mdimensions.html)
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### Author:  [@BIGmatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BIGmatt)
#### Post date: [November 11, 1999, 11:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/5 "1999-11-11T11:30:00Z")
Thanks DrFidelius for your… erm… interesting response.
Thanks also for recommending the book ‘Hyperspace’, but I’ve been reading it anyway - that’s where I found out about 10 dimensional space in the first place.
Does anyone else have any ideas about these things. Come on, you know you want to tell me…
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“Now be quiet before I rather clumsily knight you with this meat cleaver” - Edmund Blackadder
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### Author:  [@AuraSeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuraSeer)
#### Post date: [November 11, 1999, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/6 "1999-11-11T13:49:00Z")
Have you read anything by Stephen Hawking? I suggest you get both his _A Brief History Of Time_, and _Black Holes and Baby Universes_. They do a very good job of explaining cosmology and high-level physics in everyday English.
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Laugh hard; it’s a long way to the bank.
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### Author:  [@JoeyBlades](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoeyBlades)
#### Post date: [November 11, 1999, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/7 "1999-11-11T14:45:00Z")
BIGmatt,
We’re not sure what you’re looking for. You need to be more specific. Having been around here for a while, I can assure you that this group does not want for opinions on this subject and can prattle on indefinitely about it. You seem to be trying to solicit a brain dump…
Another good book (especially for laypersons) is Brian Greene’s “The Elegant Universe”.
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### Author:  [@GasDr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GasDr)
#### Post date: [November 11, 1999, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/8 "1999-11-11T22:19:00Z")
Say I look at a star on the Eastern horizon then rapidly move my eyes to a star on the Western horizon. Didn’t my eyes just transcend thousands of light years of space in a fraction of a second?
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### Author:  [@heretic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/heretic)
#### Post date: [November 11, 1999, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/9 "1999-11-11T23:29:00Z")
No.
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### Author:  [@moriah](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/moriah)
#### Post date: [November 12, 1999, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/10 "1999-11-12T03:36:00Z")
The question isn’t even a question.
Let’s say I posted a topic like this:
Hey, anyone know anything about computers? You know, monitors, keyboards, CPUs? ANY IDEAS?
Just nonsensical.
When you finish _Hyperspace_ (good book, IMO) and have any **specific** questions, please ask.
Peace.
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### Author:  [@BIGmatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BIGmatt)
#### Post date: [November 12, 1999, 11:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/11 "1999-11-12T11:11:00Z")
Thanks for telling me that I can’t ask for general ideas, how else could I have known that asking for peoples personal views on these subjects would only encourage people to (very diplomatically) inform me that it was not the right thing to do?
Since this is the case, how about answering these questions…
How was the number ‘10’ reached for the number of necessary dimensions?
Would a black hole’s effects span all of the dimensions or merely the 4 we are familiar with?
What do you thinks of my theory that dark matter (the stuff that astronomers have been searching in vain for for years)actually surrounds the Universe and pulls the matter that we are familiar with outwards by gravity, and THAT is why objects that are further away seem to be moving faster, because they are nearer to the gravitational ‘source’?
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### Author:  [@JoeyBlades](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoeyBlades)
#### Post date: [November 12, 1999, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/12 "1999-11-12T15:53:00Z")
BIGmatt,
You wrote:
> [@](#):
>
> Thanks for telling me that I can’t ask for general ideas…
I don’t think anyone said that, we were just pointing out that your question was a little bit too open ended.
> [@](#):
>
> How was the number ‘10’ reached for the number of necessary dimensions?
I don’t think that conclusion **HAS** been reached. The only thing I’ve heard is that the mathematics of superstring theory predicts that there are at least 10 spacetime dimensions (but possibly more). Bosonic string theory demands 26 spacetime dimensions or more… Also, there is the question of whether these extra dimensions are necessarily still with us or might have combined in some ways to form the more obvious dimensions we know today.
> [@](#):
>
> Would a black hole’s effects span all of the dimensions or merely the 4 we are familiar with?
Good question. My guess is that all dimensions would be affected, but it’s more of an instinctive guess than one based on science. Why should we arrogantly assume that only the dimensions that we can perceive would be the only ones affected? On the other hand, we don’t know enough about the nature of the compactified dimensions to say that they might or might not be affected…
> [@](#):
>
> What do you thinks of my theory that dark matter (the stuff that astronomers have been searching in vain for for years) actually surrounds the Universe and pulls the matter that we are familiar with outwards by gravity, and THAT is why objects that are further away seem to be moving faster, because they are nearer to the gravitational ‘source’?
When you say “surrounds the Universe”, do mean outside the universe? By definition, if there is an outer boundary to the universe, there would be no dark matter beyond that perimeter. If there were dark matter ‘there’, then ‘there’ would technically still be in the universe…
The other problem with your theory is you have to explain where this outer dark matter came from. If it came from the big bang, then (1) it’s still technically part of the universe and (2) why would the density of dark matter beyond the perimeter be significantly denser than all the matter (dark and bright) within the perimeter?
If your outer perimeter dark matter came from some other source, then you have the problem of explaining where this fairly uniform density “shell”, with much greater cumulative mass than our meager universe, came from…
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### Author:  [@BIGmatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BIGmatt)
#### Post date: [November 13, 1999, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/13 "1999-11-13T01:44:00Z")
Maybe I should re-phrase the last question…
What I am suggesting is not that dark matter extends beyond the edge of the Universe, because, as you so rightly say, the Universe can hypothetically have no ‘edge’, because as soon as anything ‘passed’ it, more space would be created. What I was saying is that the ‘dark’ matter could have been formed in the Big Bang and could have expanded in a ‘shell’ surrounding the OBSERVABLE Universe. My explanation (under-educated guesswork now) is that the conditions at the outer edge of the Big Bang’s ‘explosion’ were significantly different to that within the perimeter, and that when the explosion occurred, the dark matter was blown outward in a more-or-less uniform manner. As it could theoretically be travelling at near the speed of light, it could have a much greater effective mass than matter travelling at slower velocities, and thus have a much greater gravitational effect.
The material within this ‘boundary’ would be pulled outward towards the dark matter. It is possible that the matter that we are familiar with exists beyond this ‘shell’ also, but as there is all this dark matter between it and us, we cannot observe it.
A very long winded posting, there, I know, but thanks for answering my other questions. I would also appreciate anyone else’s insights.
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“Now be quiet before I rather clumsily knight you with this meat cleaver” - Edmund Blackadder
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### Author:  [@John\_Kentzel-Griffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Kentzel-Griffin)
#### Post date: [November 13, 1999, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/14 "1999-11-13T04:03:00Z")
There is a common misconception about the big bang. The big bang was **not** a localized phenomenon that spread matter and energy out into an existing empty void. The big bang was the creation of space and time as well as matter. There is no outer edge of the explosion. The big bang happened “everywhere”.
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Virtually yours,
DrMatrix
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### Author:  [@BIGmatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BIGmatt)
#### Post date: [November 13, 1999, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/15 "1999-11-13T12:40:00Z")
Thanks, I’ll remember to try and stay more accurately informed in the future… but my theory stands, maybe the dark matter just got lucky and ended up with it’s mates, I don’t know. Anyone else have any theories about why astronomers can’t find any of the dark mater that’s supposed to account for (I forget) about 80% of the matter in the Universe??? Is it because they don’t know what they’re looking for, perhaps?
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“Now be quiet before I rather clumsily knight you with this meat cleaver” - Edmund Blackadder
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### Author:  [@dougie\_monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougie_monty)
#### Post date: [November 13, 1999, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/16 "1999-11-13T21:24:00Z")
I’d like to know: What happens when two black holes meet? 😉
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### Author:  [@John\_Kentzel-Griffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Kentzel-Griffin)
#### Post date: [November 14, 1999, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/17 "1999-11-14T02:11:00Z")
**dougie\_monty** According to Steven Hawking, if two black holes meet, they combine into a single black hole. The area of the resultant black hole’s event horizon is greater than or equal the the sum of the two event horizons’ areas.
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Virtually yours,
DrMatrix
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### Author:  [@Demo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Demo)
#### Post date: [November 14, 1999, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/18 "1999-11-14T03:00:00Z")
Dr. Matrix said:
> [@](#):
>
> The big bang happened “everywhere”.
I’ve read this in varying forms elsewhere and have not really been able to grasp what it really means. DrMatrix, can you explain this a little bit more for me? I keep getting hung up on the traditional idea of an explosion(like a grenade, starts at the center and moves out). Thanks.
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“I would far rather be ignorant than wise in the foreboding of evil.”
-Æschylus. 525-456 B. C.
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### Author:  [@John\_Kentzel-Griffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Kentzel-Griffin)
#### Post date: [November 14, 1999, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/19 "1999-11-14T03:46:00Z")
Every point in the universe looks like the center of the expansion. If we turn time back to the big bang, space was infinitely dense everywhere. Currently we cannot explain what happened at t=0. Physics has trouble with infinite density.
There are two cases to consider: finite and infinite space. I am going to cop out here and consider only a finite universe. (Sorry about that) Also, so as not to have to get into 4D geometry, lets think of a 2D universe. A finite unbounded universe would be the surface of an expanding sphere. The big bang was when the sphere was a point.
I put everywhere in quotes because everywhere was one point.
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### Author:  [@JoeyBlades](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoeyBlades)
#### Post date: [November 16, 1999, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-holes-faster-than-light-travel-and-ten-dimentional-space-ideas/6052/20 "1999-11-16T16:42:00Z")
DrMatrix,
You wrote:
> [@](#):
>
> There is a common misconception about the big bang…
You speak with such authority… I take it you were there? If not, you may want to be a bit less assertive with your assertions…
Wisdom is the art of not confusing what we know with what we think we know.
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