# Bluesman **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 18, 2004, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643 "2004-04-18T06:13:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/1 "2004-04-18T06:13:24Z")
Revisiting the WMD issue but… Clarke O’Neill Kwiatkowski & now Powell via Woodward confirm what educated people had deduced and discussed on the state of the evidence, sure. But what do we find, **Bluesman** , who made repeated efforts to deceive people on this board about the evidence, often indiscriminantly using **bold type** , pr#ofa\*&ni!ty and UPPER CASE LETTERING, **Bluesman** who dishonestly exploited his inside knowledge to misrepresent the fabled WMD intelligence, **Bluesman** , who took the favoured flame-out and run tactic, so typically cowardly of his ilk, **Bluesman** , has signed on as a Charter Member. To quote the man: > [@](#): > > This place gives me a stomach ache, and is a total failure on it’s stated mission. > > Ignorance abides. Fuck this. Abides my ass! 100% see-through on your flimsy lies. Come out from hiding and tell us again **I am the authority**! Woncha. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 6:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/2 "2004-04-18T06:35:47Z")
Linky-poo? ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 7:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/3 "2004-04-18T07:08:14Z")
[Here ya go](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=229050&page=1&pp=50). ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 7:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/4 "2004-04-18T07:28:00Z")
A more direct link to **Gary Kumquat** ’s Pit thread: [Hey Bluesman, a question for you](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=183669) ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 7:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/5 "2004-04-18T07:44:48Z")
I hadn’t read that thread you linked to **Larry** , I didn’t realize it was so good. It’s got some brilliant stuff in it, e.g.: > [@scr4](#): > > > [@Bluesman](#): > > > > You want a cite for the stuff I claim to know? I AM the authority here; I am the reference work. > > Is this how you and your colleagues responded to the President when aksed for proof of WMDs in Iraq? > > That’s not how the quest for knowledge works. If you can’t back up your statements with evidence, your opinion doesn’t count any more than anyone else’s. “This expert said so” isn’t considered a valid reference, at least not in my world (academia). “This expert has found such and such evidence, which is confirmed by this other expert” would be a valid cite, but nothing short of that. Turns out **scr4** is psychic: > [@](#): > > [House of Broken Toys > By MAUREEN DOWD > Published: April 18, 2004](http://www.nytimes.com/2004/04/18/opinion/18DOWD.html) > > George Tenet comes across in the book as another profile in cravenness. On Dec. 21, 2002, the C.I.A. chief went to the Oval Office with an aide to present “The Case” on W.M.D. Even Mr. Bush, already deeply enmeshed in war plans, was taken aback at the paucity of it. “Nice try,” Mr. Bush said. “I don’t think this is quite — it’s not something that Joe Public would understand or would gain a lot of confidence from.” Turning to Mr. Tenet, he added: “I’ve been told all this intelligence about having W.M.D. and this is the best we’ve got?” > > When the president asked how confident he was, Mr. Tenet, premier apple polisher, gave Mr. Bush the answer he wanted to hear: “Don’t worry, it’s a slam dunk!” ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 10:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/6 "2004-04-18T10:49:10Z")
For this priceless puff from one of the above links: > [@](#): > > Bluesman has been very busy over the past few months, and he rarely comes to these boards any more. I will not point out this thread to him, because frankly, he’s been working damn hard in service to his country, and doesn’t need this kind of crap. … > > Whatever you may think of him, he fought hard to keep you safe. He deserves your thanks for that. Oh there’s no valid critical process here **Lucretia** , working real hard has **Bluesman** been? Goofing off, to sponge his brats off the public purse and add to the growing mass of falsehood in the world! Add **GingerOfTheNorth** to the conspiracy of falsehood. Add **Bluesman** to the pit _again_ because I’ve just remembered his flame-out occurred but days before the David Kay revelations he knew were about to arrive. ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 10:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/7 "2004-04-18T10:57:06Z")
Neither **Lucretia** nor **GingerOfTheNorth** deserve much criticism for things they said in defense of family and friends back then. Don’t be a jerk. :mad: ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 11:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/8 "2004-04-18T11:11:01Z")
I know it is the pit, but jeez man, Bluesman is in the service of the US of A. Grant him that. It’s a lot more than me, for example, that takes it in the shorts for taxes but that’s about it. That said, I would like Bluesman to either clarify those earlier statements or say security prevents him from doing so. Maybe the Bluesman saw bad data but took it in good faith. Hell, the American electorate did much the same. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/9 "2004-04-18T11:15:45Z")
> [@China Guy](#): > > I know it is the pit, but jeez man, Bluesman is in the service of the US of A. Grant him that. It’s a lot more than me, for example, that takes it in the shorts for taxes but that’s about it. > > . How am I to know he in the service of the US of A? Because he and at least 1 other anonymous poster has said so? For all I know, **bluesman** is a 60 year old jewish woman. ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/10 "2004-04-18T11:56:20Z")
**Demostylus** , **China Guy** , you’re right. I went too far, I confess the resentment has been brewing, my apologies to the affected parties. Shanghai & Sydney, 2 of my favorite places, how are things there? ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/11 "2004-04-18T12:02:36Z")
> [@sevastopol](#): > > **Demostylus** , **China Guy** , you’re right. I went too far, I confess the resentment has been brewing, my apologies to the affected parties. > > Shanghai & Sydney, 2 of my favorite places, how are things there? By all means flame on at **bluesman** , but please try to limit the collateral damage. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/12 "2004-04-18T13:50:00Z")
> [@spooje](#): > > How am I to know he in the service of the US of A? Because he and at least 1 other anonymous poster has said so? > > For all I know, **bluesman** is a 60 year old jewish woman. For one thing, all the Mid-Atlantic Dopers know him and **Lucretia** and their kids. **Bluesman** is an honorable man–he was taken in by Bush but so was I and so were many other Americans. ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/13 "2004-04-18T14:21:32Z")
**Bluesman** is neither honorable nor co-deceived. He claimed first hand knowledge of evidence, _evidence_ mind you, not _analysis_ that answered the question definitively. With Dr Kay’s final revelation imminent and known to him in advance he flamed out of the board in a apparently final vomit of hate and mendacity. Did so in order to avoid accounting for his assertions in the face of damning facts. And now has the audacity to return. Well the sneak’s back and it’s accounting time. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/14 "2004-04-18T15:17:18Z")
Since I know **Bluesman** IRL, you are cordially invited to go fuck yourself. I don’t kno the evidence that he had or what he was told, but I know him and his character, and he would never, ever, do anything contrary to the interests of this country or in any way state anything that he himself did not believe to be true. He is a patriot, serving his country for measly pay and the ingratitude of ungrateful, sniveling left-wing trash like you. You may argue with his politics, but don’t you DARE attack his honor or his character. Shithead. ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/15 "2004-04-18T15:49:16Z")
Oh I missed the rule that nominated the professions above question. Kindly point it out for me for future reference. Interests of his country? Spread noxious lies about its largest public policy issue, to help the admin poison the public mind. It’s EXACTLY his supposed honor and character that I’m pitting Do I need to show your where your friend _explicity_ put his integrity on the line. Well I’m calling him on it. But the trend line of his cowardice is that he’ll rely on the limited vocabulary of lieutenants like **gobear** to speak for him, rather than front up to meet the questions. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/16 "2004-04-18T15:55:34Z")
At the very least there can no argument that he was, at best, incorrect? It’s been about a year, surely if the secret evidence he referenced has turned out to be valid, it would have come out by now? Is there any reasonably plausible scenario where it was true and we would not have heard about it by now? I’m willing to give him the benefit of the doubt that he was working from bad info, and not lying. I just hope those who backed him because of his position can now see that this type of claim, even from someone allegedly “in the know”, isn’t proof-positive. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/17 "2004-04-18T16:02:58Z")
> [@sevastopol](#): > > But the trend line of his cowardice is that he’ll rely on the limited vocabulary of lieutenants like **gobear** to speak for him, rather than front up to meet the questions. [/quote] limited vocab, my aunt Agatha. Simple AngloSaxon expletives are all that;s required to dismiss assmonkeys like you. And I’m nobody’s _lieutenant_–I am, however, someone who sticks up for his friends. I’m curious how you even know of the debate on **Bluesman** ’s claims or that in your POV he has “come back”, since judging by your signup date of January 2004, you weren’t even around for last year’s heated debates… > [@](#): > > I’m willing to give him the benefit of the doubt that he was working from bad info, and not lying. I just hope those who backed him because of his position can now see that this type of claim, even from someone allegedly “in the know”, isn’t proof-positive Good point, and one that I will remember for future claims. ---
**Author:** ![MsRobyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/90ced4/32.png) [@MsRobyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsRobyn)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/18 "2004-04-18T18:05:35Z")
**sevastopol** , what **gobear** said. I’ve also had the privilege of meeting the Bluesclan. Suffice it to say that having met **Bluesman** , I can say that he is not a 60-year-old Jewish woman, nor do I have any particular reason to doubt that he is who he says he is. So, speaking as a friend of the Bluesclan, kindly go fuck yourself. Robin ---
**Author:** ![GingerOfTheNorth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/cdc98d/32.png) [@GingerOfTheNorth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GingerOfTheNorth)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/19 "2004-04-18T18:58:16Z")
How the fuck did I end up getting flamed over this? We’re not allowed to defend our friends? I know Bluesman. I know that he doesn’t lie. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2004, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643/20 "2004-04-18T19:11:37Z")
> [@GingerOfTheNorth](#): > > I know Bluesman. I know that he doesn’t lie. How do you define “lie”? 🙂 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bluesman/240643.md?page=2)