# Bob Barr drinking John McCain's milkshake? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 8, 2008, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704 "2008-07-08T15:58:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/1 "2008-07-08T15:58:50Z")
According to [Zogby](http://www.zogby.com/news/ReadNews.dbm?ID=1523), Libertarian Candidate, Bob Barr is polling at 6% nationally, but perhaps more troubling for McCain is what Barr is pulling from conservatives and independents: > [@](#): > > Bob Barr receives the support of 7% of voters who identify themselves as conservative or very conservative voters. Barr gets 43% of libertarians and 11% of independents. McCain’s support among conservatives is 74%. On the left, Ralph Nader gets less than 2% nationally. I have no doubt that Barr’s poll numbers are probably inflated and that a lot of those righties will hold their noses and vote for McW regardless of what they say now, but is it possible that Barr might have a genuine shot at Naderizing this race and maybe delivering a red state or two (like his own home state of Georgia, [which is already closer than it should be](http://www.electoral-vote.com/evp2008/Pres/Graphs/georgia.html)) up to Obama? I initially didn’t think Barr would be any factor at all, but it looks like he might have an effect after all. ---
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/2 "2008-07-08T16:02:29Z")
I think I’d wait and see who McBush picks as a running mate. Gore didn’t help his case with Lieberman. I think the choice of Lieberman pushed a few of the hold your nose for Gore into the Nader camp. Gore picking Bob Graham would have locked up Florida and the election. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/3 "2008-07-08T16:04:15Z")
It don’t thinki so. I think conservatives just plain dont’ want McCain and would pick Obama first. They already gonna raise a ruckus as the convention, so. There,s something about Gallup. I don’t know what it is but it aint right. I’m sorry. I’m on the streoids again. Im very sorry. It wont’ be long though. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/4 "2008-07-08T16:06:01Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] I think conservatives just plain dont’ want McCain and would pick Obama first. They already gonna raise a ruckus as the convention, so. [/QUOTE] Eh? RW protests are planned at the Republican convention in St. Paul? First I’ve heard. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/5 "2008-07-08T16:09:25Z")
Yep. They’er mad about the platform or something. Hand on and I’ll look it up. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/6 "2008-07-08T16:14:10Z")
Found it!!! Front page Washington POst. > **[Conservatives Ready To Battle McCain on Convention Platform](https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/07/06/AR2008070602322.html)** > > Follow 2008 Elections & Campaigns at washingtonpost.com. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/7 "2008-07-08T16:18:42Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] Found it!!! Front page Washington POst. [http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/07/06/AR2008070602322.html](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/07/06/AR2008070602322.html) [/QUOTE] > [@](#): > > Conservative activists are preparing to do battle with allies of Sen. John McCain in advance of September’s Republican National Convention, hoping to prevent his views on global warming, immigration, stem cell research and campaign finance from becoming enshrined in the party’s official declaration of principles. Interesting that there appears to be no disagreement about foreign policy or the war. ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_Door](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@Bill\_Door](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_Door)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/8 "2008-07-08T16:25:04Z")
If it’s a close race the conservative wing will vote for Senator McCain. If it looks like Senator Obama has a lock on the election they’ll make a protest vote for Congressman Barr. While there was a lot of talk about Ralph Nader being a spoiler in 2000, in 48 out of 50 states you could have given every Nader vote to Gore and it would not have affected the outcome one bit, and there is probably some truth to the Nader contention that his votes came from disaffected voters who would not have voted at all if he had not run. I don’t see Barr having an affect at all. ---
**Author:** ![Renob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8c91f0/32.png) [@Renob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Renob)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/9 "2008-07-08T18:10:09Z")
All I know is in my circle of young active Republicans (one of whom is working on a Republican congressional campaign), Bob Barr is the overwhelming choice. Many conservative or libertarian Republicans that I know despise John McCain and would never vote for him. Of course, Obama will carry Maryland regardless, so it’s not like if we voted for McCain it would have any effect anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/10 "2008-07-08T18:35:43Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] I’m sorry. I’m on the streoids again. Im very sorry. It wont’ be long though. [/QUOTE] [Mom]Are you sick, sweetheart? You don’t sound so good.[/Mom] No, I’m not kidding or making fun of you. I’m serious. Are you ok? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/11 "2008-07-08T18:37:49Z")
_Barr’s milkshake brings McCain to the yard He could teach him but he’d have to charge…_ Couldn’t resist. Didn’t try, but couldn’t have anyway… ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/12 "2008-07-08T19:48:11Z")
[Obligatory _TWBB_ video](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=URjeS5-NaXY). ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/13 "2008-07-08T19:54:49Z")
[QUOTE=Oy!] [Mom]Are you sick, sweetheart? You don’t sound so good.[/Mom] No, I’m not kidding or making fun of you. I’m serious. Are you ok? [/QUOTE] Yeah, I’m fine. Thanks. 🙂 Pneumonia was negative. ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/14 "2008-07-08T20:31:07Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] Yeah, I’m fine. Thanks. 🙂 Pneumonia was negative. [/QUOTE] I’ve had The Bronchitis That Would Not Die. It sucks. Go easy there, and do what your doc tells you. I hope you feel better soon. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/15 "2008-07-08T23:33:46Z")
It’s not the conservatives who will from McCain to Barr - what they don’t like about McCain they like even less about Barr. It’s the Liberatian-oriented Republicans McCain is going to lose - the small government, humble foreign policy, civil liberty-minded Republicans. That means a chunk of the independents (but Obama may lose some of those to Barr as well), but also some mainstream Republicans - Reagan Republicans mainly. The ones who fondly remember Reagan saying, “Government isn’t the solution. Government is the problem.” The loss of the Reagan Republicans is what’s really going to hammer both McCain and the Republican party in general. Some of them will move to Obama, some will move to Barr, and a lot will just stay home. Or they may hold their noses and vote for McCain as the lesser of two evils, but they sure as hell aren’t going to volunteer for get-out-the-vote drives or open their pocketbooks to support him. Frankly, I hope Barr comes on strong and picks up 10% of the vote (not that that’s likely, but I’d love it if he did). The Republicans need to be taken to the woodshed and spanked, but they also need to realize that where they went wrong was moving too far too far to the left, and not that they didn’t move far enough. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2008, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/16 "2008-07-08T23:55:19Z")
[QUOTE=Sam Stone] The Republicans need to be taken to the woodshed and spanked, but they also need to realize that where they went wrong was moving too far too far to the left, and not that they didn’t move far enough. [/QUOTE] You need to edit that sentence. It can be read different ways with very different meanings. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2008, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/17 "2008-07-09T00:03:20Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] I’m sorry. I’m on the streoids again. Im very sorry. It wont’ be long though. [/QUOTE] I hope you feel better soon. **Mrs. Fear** is on the 'roids, has been for two years. Best wishes. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2008, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/18 "2008-07-09T00:26:27Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] You need to edit that sentence. It can be read different ways with very different meanings. [/QUOTE] I must have been drunk. Let me rephrase. No, there is too much. Let me sum up: The Republicans need to get back to being the party of responsible government, lower spending, less regulation, and more optimism. Today they’re the party of big spending and fear. Fear of terrorists, fear of immigrants, fear of losing their cushy jobs. So they vote for laws that restrict civil liberties, idiotic plans like erecting a fence across a huge border, and they spend money like drunken sailors and earmark the pork back home to get re-elected. [This guy](http://www.ocregister.com/articles/government-gop-party-2083930-republican-committed) has some good advice: > [@](#): > > Republicans need to revive what I call the Politics of Aspiration. Instead of promoting an agenda that a) echoes what Democrats offer, only not so much; or b) is based on negativity and fear (of illegal immigration, terrorists, Godless liberals, etc.), they need to tap into the entrepreneurial feelings and desire to get ahead that lies deep within us all – rich, middle class and poor. Winning parties offer hopeful messages and sound ideas. > > Here are some of the key promises the GOP should make. They are fairly obvious, which only makes GOP neglect here that much more shameful: > > Regulation: “Every new rule transfers power from individual Americans to government bureaucrats. While some basic, easily understood rules are necessary, most regulations are about micromanaging. This squelches freedom and saps our opportunity to move up the economic ladder. Those with political power use the rule-making process to keep upstarts from competing with them. We plan a regulatory rollback even more aggressive than Wal-Mart’s price rollbacks!” > > Taxation: “You pay plenty in taxes already. It’s not just about the cash, but about freedom. You need to invest in your business, pay your mortgage and pay for your kids’ education. Government already has too much money, and it spends it on mission-creep rather than the ‘public good.’ By the way, we are NOT going to increase taxes on your grandchildren by engaging in reckless debt spending, either.” > > Immigration: “Yes, we can slow illegal immigration though some sound policies, but we won’t be overly punitive in doing so. The big problem isn’t that there are too many immigrants, but too few Americans. We’re committed to creating opportunities for assimilation and reducing the costs associated with immigration by reducing the size of the welfare state. Our policies will welcome people and remove barriers to their independence and success. Isn’t that better than building a wall?” > > Civil liberties and defense: “We are committed to defending you against real threats, but we will not erode the nation’s constitutional guarantees in the process. We will put into place the humbler foreign policy promise that a former GOP president (we forget his name, for some reason) made in 2000. We are committed to protecting your privacy from government snooping.” > > Infrastructure, economy and growth: “While our party is committed to maintaining a safe and healthy environment, we are also committed to building (actually, encouraging states and the private sector to build) the infrastructure needed to meet the needs of a growing population. A booming economy needs more personal mobility. We’re all for making it easier for corporations – that’s not a bad word, by the way – to develop sources of oil and new alternatives as worldwide demand rises. Markets will provide affordable, clean energy. The economy needs no meddling – limited government and sound money will help sustain growth.” > > Education and health care: “Government-run, union-controlled monopolies do not face market pressures, and produce the worst goods and services at the highest prices. Therefore, we are committed to choice and competition in the crucial areas of education and health. The government builds Yugos; the market builds Toyotas. Which do you prefer?” > > Entitlements: “Most of the federal budget is tied up in promises for Social Security and Medicare. The key to your future and the health of the federal budget is privatizing these programs so that Americans can look to a prosperous old age.” > > Other issues: “We’re for ending corporate welfare (and treating all businesses fairly), protecting private property rights (which benefit the little guy the most), upholding the Second Amendment (everyone deserves the right to self protection), promoting open government (so you can monitor our behavior) and defending free speech (even in political campaigns!). We will eschew divisive social issues, which are best handled outside of the coercive world of government. We are for getting government out of the way and out of your lives so that each of you can make your own way.” That’s a winning policy. It’s also a far cry from what today’s Republicans are. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2008, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/19 "2008-07-09T02:15:09Z")
Stay healthy, Lib. We care. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2008, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704/20 "2008-07-09T02:32:08Z")
[QUOTE=Sam Stone] The Republicans need to get back to being the party of responsible government, lower spending, less regulation, and more optimism. [/QUOTE] Hear hear. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bob-barr-drinking-john-mccains-milkshake/455704.md?page=2)