# Boeing Struggling To Produce New Air Force Ones **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [February 15, 2025, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boeing-struggling-to-produce-new-air-force-ones/1014357 "2025-02-15T16:40:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![OldOlds](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a3d4f5/32.png) [@OldOlds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldOlds)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2025, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boeing-struggling-to-produce-new-air-force-ones/1014357/61 "2025-02-19T17:22:08Z")
> [@WildaBeast](#): > > I would assume Boeing’s sales department tried that, but none of those airlines wanted them. Maybe, but Lufthansa has publicly stated their commitment to the 747 for as long as practical. [https://simpleflying.com/worlds-largest-boeing-747-passenger-fleet-still-flying/#:~:text=As%20of%20February%202025%2C%20Lufthansa,that%20blends%20nostalgia%20and%20modernity](https://simpleflying.com/worlds-largest-boeing-747-passenger-fleet-still-flying/#:~:text=As%20of%20February%202025%2C%20Lufthansa,that%20blends%20nostalgia%20and%20modernity). ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2025, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boeing-struggling-to-produce-new-air-force-ones/1014357/62 "2025-02-19T18:17:57Z")
> [@Pleonast](#): > > Does Airforce One use civilian air certifications? I found this FAA directive which (if I’m reading it right) describes the type certification process for Military Commercial Derivative Aircraft. > **[Order 8110.101A - Type Certification Procedures For Military Commercial...](https://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/orders_notices/index.cfm/go/document.information/documentID/1026967)** > > The Federal Aviation Administration is an operating mode of the U.S. Department of Transportation. ---
**Author:** ![mnemosyne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c4cdca/32.png) [@mnemosyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mnemosyne)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2025, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boeing-struggling-to-produce-new-air-force-ones/1014357/63 "2025-02-19T23:54:54Z")
Good find! I hadn’t thought to look for such a thing. Definitely keeping note of it to peruse further. Essentially, the majority of the work will be following the civil approval process on such an aircraft. ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2025, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boeing-struggling-to-produce-new-air-force-ones/1014357/64 "2025-02-20T22:59:18Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Given the number of specialized aircraft that get described as “a modified ”, I think that the aircraft industry has come to the conclusion that it is not, in fact, cheaper to start from scratch. wasn’t that how the whole Boing 373max debacle started? … they tried to sidestep a lot of New certificaciones by “keeping the name” … eventhough the flight controles and dynamics were drastically different? One of those “the remedy was more expensive than the sickness” - moments ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2025, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boeing-struggling-to-produce-new-air-force-ones/1014357/65 "2025-02-20T23:17:28Z")
> [@mnemosyne](#): > > This absolutely was a case of government agencies failing to work together. And of giving in to the $$$$ as a priority over safety. I shudder at the thought of how govt agencias Will work in the future, now that they are streamlined by Trusk. ---
**Author:** ![Sooner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sooner/32/7875_2.png) [@Sooner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sooner)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2025, 8:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boeing-struggling-to-produce-new-air-force-ones/1014357/66 "2025-02-26T08:24:11Z")
My understanding, by the time the F-22 was in production. All the electronics were obsolete. It was one reasons so few were built, most of subcontractors. Could not, or would build the old stuff. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2025, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boeing-struggling-to-produce-new-air-force-ones/1014357/67 "2025-02-26T15:53:58Z")
It would not surprise me. My wife works for a microchip manufacturer, and one of her complaints is that they have entire lines set up (generally in “maintained rest” state) to produce certain chips to exacting but obsolete standards for legacy military equipment. Although who know if they’ll retain them as-is or enough skilled staff for them in the upcoming layoffs. ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2025, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boeing-struggling-to-produce-new-air-force-ones/1014357/68 "2025-02-27T12:38:22Z")
makes you wonder: why dont they produce twice/3times the amount predicted for the contract period and call it a day? (I am pretty sure, i am NOT the first person with this idea, and there is prob. a reason for NOT doing that)? ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2025, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boeing-struggling-to-produce-new-air-force-ones/1014357/69 "2025-02-27T17:26:38Z")
In this day and age of just-in-time production, it’s considered a poor deal. One, you have the sunk costs of the materials and labor to make the chips, possibly with years / decades before they’ll need it again. Second, and related to the prior, is then you have to pay to store the finished products, complete with allowances for damages happening while stored. Of course, that’s from the production side. From the government side, if you ordered a ton ahead of time you have to justify the costs (despite military overruns) and that’s easier to do on some gee-golly-wiz new SciFi concept (Looking at various Boeing Aerospace boondoggles! -Bonus points for working in the OP again!-) but harder on some 20-30 year old missile. And you still have to store it. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2025, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boeing-struggling-to-produce-new-air-force-ones/1014357/70 "2025-02-27T17:38:45Z")
> [@ParallelLines](#): > > It would not surprise me. My wife works for a microchip manufacturer, and one of her complaints is that they have entire lines set up (generally in “maintained rest” state) to produce certain chips to exacting but obsolete standards for legacy military equipment. Although who know if they’ll retain them as-is or enough skilled staff for them in the upcoming layoffs. Kinda like how every year General Mills has to make more Frankenberry and Count Chocula. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2025, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boeing-struggling-to-produce-new-air-force-ones/1014357/71 "2025-02-27T17:50:55Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Kinda like how every year General Mills has to make more Frankenberry and Count Chocula. They don’t _have_ to; they do it because they know that there’ll be a large demand, and they’ll make good money on it. And those cereals are likely not radically different, in manufacturing process or ingredients, than General Mills’ everyday cereal lineup, and are undoubtedly not made on separate, dedicated lines. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2025, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boeing-struggling-to-produce-new-air-force-ones/1014357/72 "2025-02-28T22:10:55Z")
I didn’t say it was _exactly_ the same. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boeing-struggling-to-produce-new-air-force-ones/1014357.md?page=3)