# Book Banning in Utah **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 9, 2024, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508 "2024-08-09T23:03:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2024, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/1 "2024-08-09T23:03:33Z")
Utah has actually banned 13 books. Not just on a reading list, not just in one school- but totally and completely for all school- and maybe more- > **[Utah orders all schools to ban 13 books, including works by Margaret Atwood...](https://www.salon.com/2024/08/09/utah-orders-all-schools-to-ban-13-books-including-works-by-margert-atwood/)** > > The state's Board of Education is seeking to comply with a new law that ostensibly aims to ban "pornography" _The Utah State Board of Education has ordered schools to remove [13 books](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vQc_7uakPh4eRXrq0iVq-L2g-BwcnRWyfc7E0QOdrThoUEtPHQaDvJM4JwNFXV-HZQok4L-fDh_P9jt/pubhtml), including works by Judy Blume, Rupi Kaur, Sarah J. Maas, Margaret Atwood and other authors, for content they deem to be pornographic or indecent under a new state law._ _Free speech advocates say this the first statewide book ban as, traditionally, schools and libraries have decided which books are appropriate for children giving due consideration to their literary or artistic value, ABC News [reported](https://abcnews.go.com/US/utah-bans-13-books-public-schools-statewide-including/story?id=112680897)._ We had a thread not too long ago debating whether or not removing a book from a reading list, for example- was a real book ban. But this really is a _book ban._ Also I found that the books can not be sold or given away- so book burnings are next. ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2024, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/2 "2024-08-09T23:12:40Z")
SIX of the thirteen books are fantasy novels by Sarah J. Maas (who I had never heard of before now)…I have to assume this is because they’re extremely popular with (I’m assuming) teenage girls. They seem pretty tame. This is silly. If students can’t get them at the library, they’re just going to go buy them, so I guess Utah wants Sarah J. Maas to make more money. ---
**Author:** ![Mama\_Zappa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/71e660/32.png) [@Mama\_Zappa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mama_Zappa)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2024, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/3 "2024-08-09T23:17:23Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > SIX of the thirteen books are fantasy novels by Sarah J. Maas (who I had never heard of before now) I actually just finished the first of her books on that list, and there are a couple scenes that are fairly racy - but no worse than any bodice-ripper novel you find at the drugstore, plus several scenes with a fair bit of violence (but violence is okay, right?). Whenever I hear of crap like such bans, I’m tempted to buy huge stacks of the books and leave them out where teenagers congregate, with a sign saying “Free - take one!”. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2024, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/4 "2024-08-09T23:18:21Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > SIX of the thirteen books are fantasy novels by Sarah J. Maas ( I read her first book in the series- not for me. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2024, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/5 "2024-08-09T23:20:38Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > so book burnings are next > [@Lamoral](#): > > so I guess Utah wants Sarah J. Maas to make more money [Frothing at Mouth Fundied-out Fuckwit]These books in this pile are the Devil’s work! We are going to burn them to show how _eeeevvvviiillll_ they are.[/FAMFOF] [Someone with Actual Brain]Excuse me. And just _where_ did you get all those new books in that pile?[/SWAB] [FAMFOF]I bought them at the bookstore we’re going to boycott for selling them![/FAMFOF] And going by this from the link @DrDeth provided > Posting of these titles does not imply they received official USBE endorsement we’re not dealing with people with a high threshold of comprehension. And this bit reminds me that those fuckwits bent out of shape by books really suck at language. > […] and have met the statewide threshold of removal […] It’s like one of the posters at my school. The poster says > Who can hurt a child? What’s that? You’re giving us permission? ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2024, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/6 "2024-08-09T23:33:15Z")
I thought a tenet of conservative philosophy was that local control of decision making was best. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2024, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/7 "2024-08-09T23:40:24Z")
It is easy to get banned books for free, thru the inter-library loan system. They get borrowed, they get “lost”, they get destroyed. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2024, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/8 "2024-08-09T23:47:33Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > I thought [Conservatives in Power]You _what_? You _thought_? You’re not competent enough to have your own _thoughts!_[/CIP] ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2024, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/9 "2024-08-10T12:20:51Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Also I found that the books can not be sold or given away- so book burnings are next. I don’t now what you mean by this. The story you link to says that the books can be banned throughout the Utah school system, but not that they are banned from Utah book stores. You can still buy the books in the state. When I lived in the Beehive State, I dated some LDS women. I had a discussion with one o them about the church-affiliated bookstore, Deseret Books. These were only supposed to sell “correlated” books – ones that had been examined and found to be free of material not sanctioned by the Church, or anything morally objectionable. “I can go into Deseret Books and buy a stack of steamy, sexy novels,” she told me. Evidently their correlating procedure isn’t 100% foolproof. Not only can you buy those banned books in Utah bookstores, you might be able to get them at Deseret Books. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2024, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/10 "2024-08-10T12:34:04Z")
In somewhat better news, a federal judge ordered the school district in the Matanuska Valley in Alaska to return all challenged books to the library shelves. [Article](https://www.adn.com/alaska-news/mat-su/2024/08/07/federal-judge-orders-mat-su-district-to-reshelve-challenged-library-books/) (may be paywalled). ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2024, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/11 "2024-08-10T12:48:02Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > If students can’t get them at the library, they’re just going to go buy them, so I guess Utah wants Sarah J. Maas to make more money. Indeed. It looks like the 13 books on the list aren’t any worse than plenty of other books—they’re just giving them free publicity. > [@CalMeacham](#): > > > [@DrDeth](#): > > > > Also I found that the books can not be sold or given away- so book burnings are next. > > I don’t now what you mean by this. I wondered that too. Is “I found…” anything like “[People are saying](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/a-phrase-that-might-need-to-be-banned-outside-the-bbq-pit/1005501)…”? ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2024, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/12 "2024-08-10T17:15:38Z")
A friend is a fan and says they get better. She was very young when she started. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2024, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/13 "2024-08-10T20:07:28Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > The story you link to says that the books can be banned throughout the Utah school system, but not that they are banned from Utah book stores. You can still buy the books in the state. What is meant is that the banned books _that are taken from the schools_ can not be sold or given away. Yes, I see no reason why- other than a crowd with pitchforks, ropes and torches 🤪- why a bookstore cant sell those banned books. > [@Larry\_Borgia](#): > > A friend is a fan and says they get better. She was very young when she started. My educated guess (I am a semi-pro book reviewer) is that the series is aimed at young females - and I am neither. 😀 Not that the book was _bad_ mind you- just not my cup of tea. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2024, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/14 "2024-08-10T20:19:39Z")
Why limit the title to Utah? > **[Federal appeals court rules Iowa's book ban law can take effect](https://www.iowapublicradio.org/education/2024-08-09/federal-appeals-court-rules-iowas-book-ban-law-can-take-effect)** > > Iowa’s law banning books with descriptions or images of sex acts from K-12 school libraries can take effect after a federal appeals court lifted an injunction blocking its enforcement Friday. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2024, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/15 "2024-08-10T20:23:17Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > Why limit the title to Utah? Because that is the article I linked to. That is interesting, thank you, but note the two bans are rather different- Utah bans books by title- Iowa bans books by sexual content. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2024, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/16 "2024-08-10T20:44:54Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > My educated guess (I am a semi-pro book reviewer) is that the series is aimed at young females - and I am neither. 😀 Not that the book was _bad_ mind you- just not my cup of tea. My friend (who is a young woman) recommended it to me (Who is not.) But then I really like Leigh Bardugo. To make this tangent thread relevant, I have a hard time seeing why Sarah Maas riles up the book burning crowd so much. I can think of far more risqué books. Take Tamsyn Muir’s Locked Tomb series, for example. I guess one of them got upset about it and spread their ire to other idiots. ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2024, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/17 "2024-08-21T06:49:00Z")
Dang you’ve had lots of important jobs. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2024, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/18 "2024-08-21T22:27:59Z")
I am old, and trust me- getting free books to review and occasionally reviewing them is by no means an important job. You get free books- 90% are trash. ---
**Author:** ![jjakucyk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3d9bf3/32.png) [@jjakucyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjakucyk)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2024, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/19 "2024-08-22T16:02:20Z")
If I were a teacher in one of these states I’d put up in my classroom a poster-sized display with the list of banned books “in large, easily readable font” along with a four-paragraph “context statement” describing the history of book banning, religious indoctrination, and why only a secular society has true religious freedom. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2024, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/book-banning-in-utah/1005508/20 "2024-08-22T18:44:23Z")
And you wouldn’t be a teacher by the end of the week. Are you perchance independently wealthy?