# Botticelli General Questions **URL:** \ **Category:** Thread Games\ **Created:** [December 1, 2019, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223 "2019-12-01T01:50:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Personal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Personal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Personal)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2019, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/1 "2019-12-01T01:50:28Z")
I’ve been following the last few rounds of Botticelli and think I have a decent grip on it, but is there a particular set of written rules for the version used here anywhere? Also, I note in the sticky thread that Idle Thoughts was going to move over a Botticelli thread with a list of letters already used. Does such a thread exist and if so should it be stickied or something? ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2019, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/2 "2019-12-01T03:10:23Z")
Elendil’s Heir has come up with and maintained a list of letters already used. Here’s the link: [Botticelli - the letters we've used so far - Thread Games - Straight Dope Message Board](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=648663) I’ll see what I can come up with about rules. Someone else may already have them. ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2019, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/3 "2019-12-01T13:38:52Z")
Here’s a link to the Wiki site with rules: [Botticelli (game) - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Botticelli_%28game%29) We have a few idiosyncracies, of course. Basically, the game goes like this: The Host, who won the previous round, picks a person, real or fictional, and provides an initial letter from the name. (Isaac Asimov could be I or A. John Quincy Adams could be J, Q or A. Socrates is just going to be an S. Queen Elizabeth II, however, is an E. Titles don’t count UNLESS they’re part of the name. Queen Latifah could be a Q or an L.) Players then ask Indirect Questions (IQs). An IQ has to reference someone who has the same initial as the Host is asking for. (If the letter is A, then you could ask “Were you the second POTUS’s wife?” for Abigail Adams.) All IQs (and DQs) have to come from your own noggin, however. There is no researching for answers. This goes for the Host as well, but he or she is allowed to research the person he’s hosting in order to answer questions. But ONLY that person. Every asked IQ that the Host cannot answer earns the player a DQ, which is a 20 Questions-like question that can be answered yes or no. (The first DQ is usually, and needs to be, “Real?” because otherwise it can be a real stretch answering some questions if the person is fictional.) It is our practice to allow 3 IQs to be asked per round. There’s no limit to the number of DQs one can store up to ask later, but see below. When 20 DQs have been asked and answered, the Host declares an end to the IQs. He or she may also call an end to DQs if he or she likes, but it’s more often the case that he or she lets any outstanding DQs be asked. There will be a time limit. Then, when the DQs are cut off, everyone who has earned one DQ or more during the game gets to ask one “Are you Firstname Lastname?” question. Whoever gets it right gets to host the next round. If no one gets it right, then the Host gets to go again. Except that: in order to prevent people coming up with truly obscure persons, it is our practice that at least one of the other players must have heard of this person. If no one has, then the Hosting duties fall back to whoever Hosted the game before the present Host. There are a few other peculiarities we use: “American” in a DQ refers to the United States of America. It doesn’t refer to Canada, Mexico, Central or South America, which would have to be asked separately. “The Arts” come in three flavors: performing, visual and writing. Plays are not considered prose writing. Other players may add to this, and I may have forgotten something, but that’s basically it. ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2019, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/4 "2019-12-01T13:39:52Z")
And we all hope you come and play with us! ---
**Author:** ![Some\_Call\_Me.Tim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Some\_Call\_Me.Tim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Some_Call_Me.Tim)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2019, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/5 "2019-12-02T05:58:41Z")
Perhaps it’s obvious, but as it’s a major part of the game and wasn’t mentioned: If the Host is asked an IQ for which the target is a possible answer, the Host must give a valid answer. Using the example of Abigail Adams and A as the target, if asked as an IQ, “Were you a First Lady of the United States?” the Host might answer, “I’m not Abigail Fillmore”… but if the Host didn’t happen to know of her or of any other A answer to that IQ, he or she must answer that “I am Abigail Adams” and award the win to that IQ questioner. A local custom here is that the target of the IQ questions should not repeat during a round… so if someone has asked an Isaac Asimov IQ already any subsequent Isaac Asimov questions during the same target round would not be awarded a DQ, even if they used a different trivia hook concerning Asimov, and even if they were asked by someone else between when the first Asimov question was asked and answered. One quibble with the Prof’s game description: I think his definition of “round” may have changed in the middle. If by “round” we mean the whole game concerning a given target person, there’s no limit per “round” for IQs- just that only up to 3 may be outstanding at any given time. Once the Host has addressed one’s outstanding IQs, one may ask another set without limit until the IQ part of the “round” is over. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2019, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/6 "2019-12-04T05:40:25Z")
I would agree with all of the above. Three other points, which I may have overlooked: 1. If the answers given in a particular round have established that the Host has in mind, say, an American woman who is still alive, you’re not limited in your further IQs to American women who are still alive. You can ask all kinds of questions about dead European men, for instance, if that’s what you wish, in order to earn more DQs. 2. It’s tactically better to ask broad DQs in the early parts of a round than to get too specific too soon. It’s not unusual to see questions like “Living?” or “Male?” or “American?” to eliminate huge groups of people from contention, and then get more and more specific in order to figure out who the Host is really thinking about. 3. If you ask the Host an IQ and she answers with someone who fits your IQ but _isn’t_ who you have mind, you may rephrase up to three times. Hope you’ll join us, **Personal**! C’mon in, the water’s fine. You’ll get the hang of the game very quickly once you get going, I’m sure, and we’re always glad to welcome new players! ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2019, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/7 "2019-12-25T15:44:32Z")
Start the New Year the Botticelli way! All are welcome! ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2020, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/8 "2020-01-20T19:45:14Z")
Yes, indeed! Come join us for our latest round, **Personal** and anyone else who’s interested: [https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=887662&page=4](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=887662&page=4) ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/9 "2020-02-08T13:11:13Z")
Bumping this 'cause we have some new players. ---
**Author:** ![Personal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Personal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Personal)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2020, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/10 "2020-02-08T15:01:23Z")
I’m glad you bumped this, Prof. I missed it first time round. ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2020, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/11 "2020-05-07T01:35:45Z")
And bumping for new players! ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2020, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/12 "2020-09-12T01:43:55Z")
And bump for more new players! ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2020, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/13 "2020-09-12T04:10:24Z")
Oh, yeah! ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2020, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/14 "2020-10-06T12:43:55Z")
And more new players! ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2020, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/15 "2020-10-06T15:22:53Z")
Preach it, **Prof.**! ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2020, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/16 "2020-12-30T22:19:37Z")
And even more! ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2021, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/17 "2021-01-01T04:00:03Z")
By all means! ---
**Author:** ![SCAdian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scadian/32/3292_2.png) [@SCAdian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SCAdian)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2021, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/18 "2021-01-24T20:28:22Z")
Names are used in their most common form. - The first names of Thomas Woodrow Wilson, Steven Grover Cleveland, and others are usually used only in biographies and encyclopaedias. Thus Wilson can be used only as a W, Cleveland as a G/C, Coolidge as a C, &c. - If a middle name or initial is commonly used, it can be used for IQs: B J Hunnicutt as a J, Harry S Truman as an S, John Quincy Adams as a Q, J Pierpont Morgan as a P, &c. Middle names or initials should not, however, be used for targets. - When asking/answering DQs, the “last name” is the last word in the name as commonly used, and the “first name” is the first word. For the purpose of the game, Red Cloud’s first name is “Red” and his last name is “Cloud”, and David Lloyd George’s last name is “George” (even though his actual surname is “Lloyd George”). - If the target is generally known by a single-word name – eg, Liberace – or only has a single-word name – eg, Pocahontas – a DQ of “First/Last name starts with…?” should be answered “Only name starts with…” - The target or the IQ reference does not have to be human. Aliens (Mr Gazoo), real (Fala) or fictional (Jad-Bal-Ja) animals, robots (Bender), &c, can be used. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2021, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/19 "2021-01-24T20:35:47Z")
Thanks, **SCAdian**. I agree with all of those points but one: > [@SCAdian](#): > > … > > - If a middle name or initial is commonly used, it can be used for IQs: B J Hunnicutt as a J, Harry S Truman as an S, John Quincy Adams as a Q, J Pierpont Morgan as a P, &c. Middle names or initials should not, however, be used for targets. > … I think J. Edgar Hoover could be a Botticelli subject - or target, as you say - under any of his three initials, as could, say, Lee Harvey Oswald or J.R.R. Tolkien. They are commonly known by _all_ three (or four, in Tolkien’s case) names or initials, and for game purposes I think any of the starting letters would be fair play. That’s how we’ve played it in the past, too, I think. ---
**Author:** ![SCAdian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scadian/32/3292_2.png) [@SCAdian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SCAdian)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2021, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223/20 "2021-01-24T20:42:26Z")
> [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](#): > > “The Arts” come in three flavors: performing, visual and writing. Plays are not considered prose writing. I divide the Arts IAW [Wiki](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_arts): > [@](#): > > Major constituents of the arts include **visual arts** (including architecture, ceramics, drawing, filmmaking, painting, photography, and sculpting), **literary arts** (including fiction, drama, poetry, and prose), **performing arts** (including dance, music, and theatre), and **culinary arts** (including cooking, chocolate making and winemaking). [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/botticelli-general-questions/844223.md?page=2)