# Boy in Police hugging photo dead :( **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [March 29, 2018, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429 "2018-03-29T19:37:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![StGermain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stgermain/32/2868_2.png) [@StGermain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StGermain)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2018, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/21 "2018-04-02T13:45:58Z")
My guess is murder-suicide. Everyone’s seat belt was unbuckled. I’m sure that wasn’t normally the case. No skid marks. StG ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2018, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/22 "2018-04-02T14:53:10Z")
> [@Lucas\_Jackson](#): > > Surely driving off of a cliff makes this irrelevant. Regardless of how fast they were actually going as soon as the tires left the pavement or dirt and were free in the air the speedometer would have shot up. Or the drivers foot was clamped down in terror. Even if it was deliberate, she might well have been terrified and stomping down on the pedal all the way down. But it’s easy to contrive a scenario that suits us on way or the other. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2018, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/23 "2018-04-02T15:05:35Z")
> [@StGermain](#): > > My guess is murder-suicide. Everyone’s seat belt was unbuckled. I’m sure that wasn’t normally the case. No skid marks. > > StG From when I first heard the story, I must confess, this was the only thing that made any sense to me. I mean, I’ll wait it out to hear the rest, but I’m definitely biased towards expecting this outcome. So, was there an update where they confirmed finding all six kids? Last reported in this thread (in **Shodan** ’s link), only three kids were accounted for. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2018, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/24 "2018-04-02T15:35:51Z")
[CNN](https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/02/us/family-suv-pacific-coast-crash/index.html) has some additional information: > [@](#): > > Police said that preliminary information suggested the car may have been intentionally driven straight off the edge of the cliff. > > Data from the vehicle’s air bag module and software indicated that the car had stopped at the pull out and then accelerated off the road, said Greg Baarts, acting assistant chief of the California Highway Patrol’s Northern Division. > > “At this point in our investigation, that is the direction we are going,” Baarts said. > > Preliminary data from the car suggested that there had been approximately 70 feet of continuous acceleration from the last moment the brakes were applied before the SUV went over and hit the ocean floor, Baarts said. (and perhaps a tiny glimmer of hope that not all the children died): > [@](#): > > Their other children – Hannah, 16, Devonte, 15, and Sierra, 12 – are missing. Nobody reported seeing the crash, so authorities don’t know exactly when or how it happened and it is unclear whether the three missing children were in the SUV when it fell 100 feet into the sea. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2018, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/25 "2018-04-02T22:35:47Z")
I’m hoping the three kids unaccounted for were given to close friends. They are the older kids and would have tried interfere with the Thelma & Louise plan. Maybe one of the off-the-grid families that doesn’t follow the news is faring for them. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2018, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/26 "2018-04-02T23:04:13Z")
Forensics should provide answers. Police searched the home for any potential evidence. [https://www.google.com/amp/abcnews.go.com/amp/US/wireStory/latest-woman-told-police-anger-led-spank-child-54097787](https://www.google.com/amp/abcnews.go.com/amp/US/wireStory/latest-woman-told-police-anger-led-spank-child-54097787) > [@](#): > > No one saw the 2003 GMC Yukon XL drive off a flat, dirt pullout overlooking the Pacific Ocean this week. > > But Marcus Mazza, an engineer and reconstruction expert with Lancaster, Pennsylvania-based Robson Forensic, said Thursday that the SUV was required to have a “black box” that records accident data. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2018, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/27 "2018-04-02T23:04:27Z")
Ok, I guess the question is how the hell are these three kids not accounted for? If they’re dead, they’re presumably in or close to the van for their remains to be found. Is the thought that they survived the initial impact, wandered off some distance, and then died there? This doesn’t make any sense to me. ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2018, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/28 "2018-04-02T23:50:07Z")
2 options I think - their bodies were washed away or something happened to them before the crash. Something could be they were killed somewhere else, dropped in the woods on the way down, left with friends… I hope they find them. ---
**Author:** ![Omega\_Glory](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7c8e57/32.png) [@Omega\_Glory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omega_Glory)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/29 "2018-04-03T02:44:15Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > They are the older kids and would have tried interfere with the Thelma & Louise plan. This isn’t true. A nineteen year old and two fourteen year olds are confirmed dead. The sixteen, fifteen and twelve year old are missing. The two missing teens aren’t much older than the teens whose bodies have been located. > [@](#): > > DeKalb said that he had called Child Protective Services March 23 and they had arrived at the house just after Jennifer Hart came home from work but that she didn’t answer the door. Sarah Hart came home not long afterward, DeKalb said, and by Saturday morning the family and their vehicle were gone. I don’t understand how this happened. People are allowed to avoid CPS by refusing to answer the door? Why didn’t the police get involved and force them to cooperate? ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/30 "2018-04-03T03:04:16Z")
You’re right. I mistakenly remembered that the older kids were missing. I forgot about the 19 year old that died. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/31 "2018-04-03T03:25:41Z")
> [@Omega\_Glory](#): > > … I don’t understand how this happened. People are allowed to avoid CPS by refusing to answer the door? Why didn’t the police get involved and force them to cooperate? I assume this was an upcoming step in the process. ---
**Author:** ![Omega\_Glory](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7c8e57/32.png) [@Omega\_Glory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omega_Glory)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/32 "2018-04-03T03:53:27Z")
That step should immediately follow “parents enter home and refuse to come out.” The social worker came Friday, Monday and Tuesday. In a completely unsurprising move, the parents took off on Saturday. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/33 "2018-04-03T04:42:42Z")
> [@Omega\_Glory](#): > > That step should immediately follow “parents enter home and refuse to come out.” The social worker came Friday, Monday and Tuesday. In a completely unsurprising move, the parents took off on Saturday. Eh, it’s government work done by government employees. Mediocrity and mistakes are what they excel at. I don’t know why anyone would be surprised. Across the country in Florida the FBI just got done ignoring warnings about the latest school shooter. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/34 "2018-04-03T07:01:54Z")
> [@Omega\_Glory](#): > > I don’t understand how this happened. People are allowed to avoid CPS by refusing to answer the door? Why didn’t the police get involved and force them to cooperate? > [@Omega\_Glory](#): > > That step should immediately follow “parents enter home and refuse to come out.” The social worker came Friday, Monday and Tuesday. In a completely unsurprising move, the parents took off on Saturday. Maybe they didn’t have enough evidence of wrongdoing to use any kind of force. I imagine there has to be _some_ level of information that warrants knocking on the door to make inquiries (which is just free speech) but not forcing people to cooperate (which requires cause). ---
**Author:** ![Omega\_Glory](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7c8e57/32.png) [@Omega\_Glory](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omega_Glory)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/35 "2018-04-03T14:39:20Z")
I don’t know if the social workers weren’t able to call the police given the information that they had, or if they decided not to, but if it’s the former, the law should be changed. No one should be able to decline a child welfare check. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/36 "2018-04-03T14:48:54Z")
> [@Omega\_Glory](#): > > … No one should be able to decline a child welfare check. I have some concerns with this proposed policy. ---
**Author:** ![FairyChatMom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fairychatmom/32/21906_2.png) [@FairyChatMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FairyChatMom)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/37 "2018-04-03T14:56:06Z")
I can’t buy the notion that 3 kids were washed away. And since no one has heard anything from any of them as far as I know, I have a sickening feeling they’re in a shallow grave somewhere. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/38 "2018-04-03T20:14:13Z")
> [@FairyChatMom](#): > > I can’t buy the notion that 3 kids were washed away. And since no one has heard anything from any of them as far as I know, I have a sickening feeling they’re in a shallow grave somewhere. It doesn’t seem that improbable to me if they were all unbuckled. I can imagine the bodies being thrown clear from the vehicle, then hitting the ocean below. ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/39 "2018-04-03T20:50:20Z")
> [@cmyk](#): > > It doesn’t seem that improbable to me if they were all unbuckled. I can imagine the bodies being thrown clear from the vehicle, then hitting the ocean below. It seems very possible to me as well. [This article](http://www.pressdemocrat.com/news/8182783-181/possible-fort-bragg-sighting-of?artslide=0&sba=AAS) has a photo of how high the surf can get in this area. If the incident occurred with no one seeing it, it may have been hours of high tide to carry anything loose away from the wreck. It also reads that authorities think ocean currents may have been keeping the missing children in the area. I found the turnout on google maps - 20.8 miles north of Fort Bragg at Juan Creek. I have been by that area on bike trips - a very scenic and remote section of coast. Very sad and disturbing story. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2018, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429/40 "2018-04-03T21:49:47Z")
Apparently the surf in this spot is so dangerous that the authorities had not even been able to get divers into the water, last I heard. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boy-in-police-hugging-photo-dead/811429.md?page=3)