Boy Scout offical charged in child pornography case

[Hoodoo_Ulove]

He was definitely a fascist. No controversy there.

[Guinastasia]

IIRC, they wouldn’t allow gays because to be a Boy Scout one must be “morally straight”, and they consider homosexuality to be immoral. Not because they’re afraid of kiddy diddlers.

[DrDeth]

“Charged”. :rolleyes:

Not “convicted”. This is America, isn’t it? :dubious:

[DrDeth]

@Hoodoo Ulove

He was definitely a fascist. No controversy there.

Cite?
:dubious:

Unless you mean- “very right wing, conservative and into para-military stuff= fascist”. :dubious:

[Soul_Brother_Number_Two]

Scouting was the best part of my youth. Bar none. No religious crap, no pseudo-fascist military bullshit, just a bunch of insane teens who poured kenosene from the lanterns onto their jeans, lit it and ran screaming through the campsite. And had match fights. And played dangerous games with axes and hatchets and knifes. And fire.

It was the 70s, and no one forced religion or patriotism down our throats. We said the Pledge because we had always said it, and when we said the Scout Oath thing, I forget now what it was called, when we got to “morally straight” we just said it, even if we had smuggled in stolen liquor and Hustlers on our last camping trip.

We went camping every month. We went to Scout camp every summer. I was on Scout camp staff for three years running. I got fired the middle of my second year there for taking dope and generally being a fuckup, but they took me back the next year.

I repeat, never not once was religion or patriotism or moral value crap pushed down our throats. The leaders were volunteers who loved Scouting and loved us, and we loved them. To this day some of them are my role models. And they smoked cigarettes and talked about women some, but they were great role models nonetheless. And not just within my own troop. This was statewide. We interacted plenty with other troops and other councils year-round. Sure there was a freak or two who marched his kids around everywhere, but we all felt sorry for those kids.

It has always broken my heart that Scouting has been taken over by moral fascists. It has the potential to do so much good. It did for me: it might have even saved my life, for real. I hate what Scouting has become, and I wish that this shit would all go away so kids could get back to what’s really important: burning shit up and having hatchet-throwing contests and snipe hunts and shit.

Thanks for listening.

[asterion]

Scouting is still pretty good at the troop level–one of the results of the organization being pretty loose. The main problems come from the fucking idiots at National.

[wring]

@threemae

Hold on a second. I’m not sure that they denied gays from participating in the organization because of pedophile concerns, I think it’s oriented around the religious basis ofthe organization. Remember, they don’t allow atheiests either because it’s a fundamentally religious organization.
.

debates I recall involved concerns about camping types of stuff, comparisons w/ "you wouldn’t want to send a man to chaperone girl scouts, or a woman chaperoning boy scouts. Obviously YMVs

[Nightime]

Yeah, I’m gonna have to agree with:

1. We don’t know what this guy actually did. We just know he has been charged with downloading child porn.

2. The Boy Scouts aren’t hypocrites at all over this.

3. The reason the Scouts (stupidly) have rules against gays is based on moral and religious reasons, not pedophile reasons.

[Nightime]

Scouting was the best part of my youth.

Same here. I really think the Boy Scouts are important and I wish they would get their act together.

[rjung]

@DrDeth

Not “convicted”. This is America, isn’t it? :dubious:

Ask Michael Jackson, Robert Blake, and O.J. Simpson.

[DoctorJ]

IIRC, they wouldn’t allow gays because to be a Boy Scout one must be “morally straight”, and they consider homosexuality to be immoral. Not because they’re afraid of kiddy diddlers.

That was the official reason, but they had a lot of people arguing for their position based on the pedophilia angle.

[Contrapuntal]

@DrDeth

“Charged”. :rolleyes:

Not “convicted”. This is America, isn’t it? :dubious:

I believe his lawyer his said he intends to plead guilty.

[Hoodoo_Ulove]

I said the founder of the scouting movement was a fascist.

@DrDeth

Cite?
:dubious:

Unless you mean- “very right wing, conservative and into para-military stuff= fascist”. :dubious:

linky

He actually upbraided one official of the Scout movement who did not want to be associated with the Hitler Youth. The head of his International Bureau, Hubert Martin, reported that a German scouting leader named Riecke had been dispatched to a camp for the offense of proposing an independent, non-Nazi movement. B-P responded testily that Riecke had been sent there “not for international tendencies, but for homosexual tendencies!” This is the only reference to that dread subject that I know of in his writings; an accusation repudiated with indignation when made — often unfairly — against British scoutmasters was taken at face value when made by Hitlerites. It’s pleasant to record, however, that B-P was outvoted on this question, and that the BSM never recognized the Hitler Youth as a model or as a partner.

He also praised Mussolini.

[Paul_in_Qatar]

@DrDeth

This is America, isn’t it? :dubious:

In a word, no.

[NurseCarmen]

@Soul Brother Number Two

Sure there was a freak or two who marched his kids around everywhere, but we all felt sorry for those kids.

Don’t worry. We just got fed up and quit. Except for his kids. Man. I pitied them.

[Tomcat]

Yeah, I realize, n = 2, but still…

I was fondled one night by my Scout Master…he tried to pass it off as a joke, but…Got me out of Scouting right quick.

It is a tragedy that this has happened, and I do hope that this man only went so far as to download, not go any further. But I wonder if a person will speak up now that he is outted. Hopefully not. But will it be a boy or a girl?

The gay stance by the BSA is their legal right, but it sure does backfire when something like this happens because people start throwing around terms like irony and hypocrisy and see it coming…. I hope the numbers dwindle and BSA dies, only to be born-again (punny) into a more tolerant organization that follows the spirit of what they can do for people.

Unfortunately the main problem here is that, yet again, pedophile = homosexual because of what he did, and what they are against. If you say hypocrisy, then you are pushing that association. It is wrong and vile, but that is what people will see now, and possibly use to bolster BSA’s stance. “Homosexuality is wrong and BSA has assisted the police in apprehending this Pedophile! See, we try to protect our children, but these people can trick us all.”

-Tcat

[Tomcat]

Sorry- sample size = 1, not 2. (For those of you not statistically inclined or slightly tipsy like myself, this means it is my story and opinion).

[aaslatten]

@asterion

Scouting is still pretty good at the troop level–one of the results of the organization being pretty loose. The main problems come from the fucking idiots at National.

Exactly, and Soul Brother, you could have been writing about my experiences with the Scouts. It was all just camping and good times and trying to keep our minds on something besides girls. The only time religion came up in the scouts for me was during my Eagle Board of Review (Them: “Do you believe in God?” Me: “Uh, yeah, sure.” Them: “Great, you’re in.”)

I have considered turning in my Eagle badge (as others have done), but I know scouts are still doing good things on the troop level…

[DrDeth]

@Hoodoo Ulove

I said the founder of the scouting movement was a fascist.
linky He also praised Mussolini.

Ah, so you mean that being deluded by the Fascists pre-war means you were a Fascist. :rolleyes: :dubious:

Many people were- Prime Minister Chamberlain for example. Before the war, there was little thought that Fascism was all that Evil. “Lucky” Lindberg was also fooled by the Fascists. If you call everyone who was fooled by them a “Fascist”, that’d be likely more than half of the worlds leaders in Government & Industry.

Stalin was also fooled by Hitler- was even Hitlers ally. Was Stalin a “fascist”?

[gaucho]

This is rich (from NY Times):

Mr. Smith also responded on behalf of the Boy Scouts in September 2004 when a lawyer and onetime Eagle Scout, Bruce D. Collins, wrote a letter taking issue with the Boy Scouts’ dismissal of an assistant scoutmaster, James Dale, because he was gay. The case reached the Supreme Court and established the Boy Scouts’ right to bar gays under the organization’s own First Amendment right of expressive association.

Mr. Smith replied that “some intolerant elements in our society want to force scouting to abandon its values and become fundamentally different.” He said that Mr. Collins “would do well to communicate his displeasure to those directing their discriminatory assault against his beloved Boy Scouts – the A.C.L.U.”