# Boycott of Arab products and brands **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 30, 2006, 9:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189 "2006-01-30T09:28:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/61 "2006-02-03T20:34:28Z")
Between this shit and the Joint Chiefs flap, it looks like cartoons are the new shark attacks. I’m happy that the PM of Denmark told those offended to essentially go fuck themselves. What the hell should they apologize for, the paper is privately owned. ---
**Author:** ![CC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f1d935/32.png) [@CC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CC)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/62 "2006-02-03T20:38:23Z")
[QUOTE=World Eater] … the Joint Chiefs flap …QUOTE] ??? ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/63 "2006-02-03T20:56:01Z")
[QUOTE=CC] > [@World Eater](#): > > … the Joint Chiefs flap …QUOTE] > > ??? Over [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=357034). ---
**Author:** ![jali](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ecae2f/32.png) [@jali](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jali)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/64 "2006-02-03T21:03:18Z")
> [@Cerri](#): > > I don’t personally see [[Cox & Forkum: Image Problem](http://www.coxandforkum.com/archives/000768.html)] this cartoon in an offensive light…much like alot of American political cartoons, I personally think it has a grain of truth in it. > > As for all the others that were linked…I’ll frankly just claim stupid, because I honestly didn’t get either the point they were trying to make (80% of them) or the offensiveness above and beyond your average American political cartoon. > > As far as Middle Easterners burning the Dutch flag…uh…so? Far as I’m aware, they’ve been burning the American flag for what’s got to be going on generations now. I’ve never seen the need to get my tail in a twist about it. What’s that got to do with me, your average American? I’m a non religious/non believer, but I empathise with those who are rightfully upset at the drawing. If Christians and others would perhaps look at the “cartoon” from another perspective maybe they might understand some of the outrage of people from a totally different culture. Mohammed is\* never \* to be drawn - to draw him as a terrorist doubles the sin/insult. Would cartoons of the Virgin Mary as a hooker or Jesus as a crackhead be acceptable to the pious of certain faiths? How about Abraham and Moses as pimps? Mohammed isn’t a political feature to the believers - this is a sacrilige to do this. Mohammed is a religious icon to billions - many who are not of Arab descent so the “cartoon” exposes the ignorance of many. If Jesus were dressed in an American flag wouldn’t the Christians from around the world be offended? There are political leaders in the Middle East that may deserve the pitting of the world via cartoon, but one beleived by many to be a prophet from thousands of years ago does not. ---
**Author:** ![CC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f1d935/32.png) [@CC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CC)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/65 "2006-02-03T21:09:45Z")
Yep - probably a lot of people would be offended by depictions of Mary as hooker - it’s probably been done, in fact. Or Jesus wrapped in an American flag. My question is, would they then storm the offices of the newspaper with guns, threaten the lives of the publisher, riot in the streets, take over the buildings where the papers were published, etc? Probably not. We all have the right to be offended. We all have the right to get our undies in a knot. We all have the obligation to try to be nice to one another, to be respectful of one another’s religions, etc. But when it doesn’t happen, it doesn’t happen. Ok. Deal with it, I think a lot of us are saying. Don’t fucking go off in full riot regailia. Spend your energy in a classroom educating someone. Go rake in a garden. Work. Do something to make your life better, or someone else’s. Don’t waste your time trying to run someone else’s life, or trying to avenge some offense. Heaven can wait. Grow up. Civilize yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/66 "2006-02-03T21:30:43Z")
> [@jali](#): > > I’m a non religious/non believer, but I empathise with those who are rightfully upset at the drawing. > > If Christians and others would perhaps look at the “cartoon” from another perspective maybe they might understand some of the outrage of people from a totally different culture. Mohammed is\* never \* to be drawn - to draw him as a terrorist doubles the sin/insult. Would cartoons of the Virgin Mary as a hooker or Jesus as a crackhead be acceptable to the pious of certain faiths? How about Abraham and Moses as pimps? Sure, they’d be pissed. Can’t say I’d blame them, either. But these were comics published in a privatly owned newspaper, and the response is to boycott products from the _entire country_ where that paper was printed. That’s just stupid. Be offended at the people who actually offended you. Don’t take it out on everyone who happens to live in the same rough geographical area. Needless to say, **Rune** ’s counter-boycott is equally stupid, for exactly the same reasons. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/67 "2006-02-03T21:35:39Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Sure, they’d be pissed. Can’t say I’d blame them, either. But these were comics published in a privatly owned newspaper, and the response is to boycott products from the _entire country_ where that paper was printed. That’s the nicest thing they’re doing. The fanatics are also calling on Bin laden to blow up Denmark. ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/68 "2006-02-03T21:41:50Z")
I’ve just seen a large group on the TV chanting “Denmark, your 7/7 is on it’s way” Nice. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/69 "2006-02-03T21:49:00Z")
> [@World Eater](#): > > That’s the nicest thing they’re doing. The fanatics are also calling on Bin laden to blow up Denmark. Well, yes, but I assumed I didn’t need to explain why _that_ was unacceptable. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/70 "2006-02-03T21:50:42Z")
> [@CC](#): > > I mean it’s against Jewish law for someone to utter or write the name Jaweh, for example, but I can’t for the life of me imagine that if some newspaper editor wrote or spoke that name, for the sake of freedom of the press, that a group of fundamentalist Jews would come rioting, bearing arms, burning flags, threatening lives, etc. I hate to disillusion you, but this sort of thing does indeed happen. Maybe not specifically about use of the Tetragrammaton, but extremist Haredim or Orthodox Jewish fundamentalists in Israel have definitely turned on numerous occasions to violence and threats over sacrilege issues. [Haredim throw stones at cars for driving on the Sabbath](http://quickstart.clari.net/qs_se/webnews/wed/bn/Qisrael-religion.RN6o_DlH.html) > [@](#): > > Since Lupolianski was narrowly elected Jerusalem mayor on June 4, beating millionaire Nir Barkat, some people have been trying to stop the traffic on Bar Ilan street by throwing stones. > > The street passes through a predominantly ultra-Orthodox area and the protestors charge that cars are violating the holy Shabbat. > > According to Jewish scriptures, all work is prohibited on Saturday, the day of rest and Jews cannot engage in any work, cook, drive or even turn on electrical appliances. [Haredim riot over proposed archaeological dig, fearing it might disturb Jewish graves](http://failedmessiah.typepad.com/failed_messiahcom/2005/10/haredim_riot_in.html) > [@](#): > > Hundreds of ultra-Orthodox men rioted Tuesday night in Jerusalem’s Shabbat Square, stoning police and injuring four officers. […] > > Police believe the riot was in protest of plans to build the trans-Israel highway over ancient Jewish graves. [Haredim gather for mass curse, praying that the hands of archaeologists be cut off](http://oi.uchicago.edu/OI/ANE/ANE-DIGEST/V03/v03.n070) > [@](#): > > Nearly 30,000 haredim from Jerusalem and Bnei Brak packed Mea She’arim’s Kikar Shabbat on Sunday to pronounce a mass curse. > > They had gathered to pray that the hands be cut off from the archaeologists excavating in Modi’in, who are involved in removing ancient bones from the newly discovered Hasmonean ossuary. > > Participants at the rally told reporters that they “would not be surprised nor upset if one of those attending the rally actually carried out the sentence.” > > Haredi organizer Yehuda Meshi-Zahav said the curse was very similar to the one pronounced several hears ago against City of David archaeologist Yigal Shilo, who later died of cancer. Hundreds of yeshiva heads felt the rally was important enough to release their students from studies to take part in the three-hour cursing marathon. > > Originally, some of the radical haredi organizers had planned to pronounce a pulsa denora death curse on the archaeologists as well as on Education Minister Amnon Rubinstein. But fearing police intervention, the rally dropped the death threats and replaced them with recitations, > calling for the less severe punishment of ‘severing of hands’ for those who move bones from their final resting place. The specific curse was written by Jerusalem Rabbi Haim Palagi. [Haredim riot over performance of autopsy](http://failedmessiah.typepad.com/) > [@](#): > > Haredim, angered by an autopsy performed on a haredi murder victim, rioted in in protest: […] > > Zaka, an organization responsible for the recovery and identification of body parts, attempted to convince police not to perform the autopsy, but as foul play was suspected detectives in charge of the case filed a request for a court warrant authorizing the autopsy. […] > > Jerusalem’s Sabbath Square was closed to traffic after hundreds of haredim gathered at there and began setting fire to garbage cans. The protesters blocked the road and threw stones at passing cars. > > Ultra-Orthodox men attacked a vehicle north of Jerusalem and threw tear gas on it, as riots in the area go on. The driver was rescued by the police. […] > > Some 100 ultra-Orthodox protested outsides the Institute for Forensic Medicine in south Tel Aviv; they tried to break in through the institute gates and snatch the body, but police forces dispatched to the scene prevented their entrance; nine protesters were arrested in the incident. > > The ultra-Orthodox community has traditionally opposed autopsies. According to several haredi sources, right-wing activists are attempting to increase tensions to steer the police’s focus away from Amona (illegal West Bank outpost). [Haredim issue death threats to secularist politician](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/01/26/wisr26.xml) > [@](#): > > In a calculated act of political provocation, the leader of Israel’s aggressively secular Shinui party, Yosef “Tommy” Lapid, breached the Jewish sabbath yesterday by staging his final election rally. […] > > Shinui means “change” in Hebrew, and the uncompromising slogan under which Mr Lapid is campaigning - with remarkable zest for a man of 71 - says it all: “Freedom of religion and freedom from religion.” > > To him, the Haredim - the ultra-Orthodox - are both tyrants and leeches, attempting to impose their own rigid beliefs on the secular majority while pocketing vast sums from the welfare system. […] > > Mr Lapid receives frequent death threats and notes wryly that he is the only poll contender whose bodyguards fear Jewish assailants more than Palestinians. I could go on, unfortunately, but you get the idea. No, of course the overall, worldwide level of violence and intimidation from Jewish (or Christian, or Hindu) fanatics over religious issues is not comparable to that from Muslim fanatics. But let’s not kid ourselves that it doesn’t happen. ---
**Author:** ![gum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bbe5ce/32.png) [@gum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gum)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/71 "2006-02-03T22:04:16Z")
"About 500 protesters who gathered in London on Friday carried signs with slogans such as: “Freedom of speech, go to hell” and “Kill, kill Denmark!” As they walked through the British capital, they shouted: “What do we want? Jihad! [holy war!] When do we want it? Now!” “The only way this will be resolved is if those who are responsible are turned over so they can be punished by Islamic law, so that they can be executed,” Abu Ibraheem, a 26-year-old protester in the British march, told the Associated Press. “There are no apologies … Those responsible would have to be killed.” I’m so pleased I don’t have to ridicule Islam anymore. They’re doing a splendid job themselves. ---
**Author:** ![CC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f1d935/32.png) [@CC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CC)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/72 "2006-02-03T22:15:58Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > I hate to disillusion you… You don’t disillusion me, you educate me. Fortunately, some of these instances are no more than praying for injury (admittedly ugly, but harmless in itself), and some is more or less self-protection, i.e. defending one’s own area against some sort of perceived incursion. None-the-less, you are absolutely correct - extremist fanatasism exists in other religions and other areas, and some of your examples are anything BUT benign. And, it is indeed fortunate that it is not more widespread. I still feel - without any hard statistics to back it up, lamentably - that the percentage of fantatics / extremists / fundamentalists in Islam appears to be much larger than in Judaism or Christianity. ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/73 "2006-02-03T22:45:56Z")
Freedom Fries, anyone? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/74 "2006-02-03T23:13:24Z")
> [@CC](#): > > Fortunately, some of these instances are no more than praying for injury (admittedly ugly, but harmless in itself), and some is more or less self-protection, i.e. defending one’s own area against some sort of perceived incursion. I agree with you that praying for the death or injury of an enemy is not as bad as deliberately threatening to cause it (although I don’t like the more direct menace implied by the participants who said they “would not be surprised nor upset if one of those attending the rally actually carried out the sentence”). But I really don’t see how throwing stones at cars that are legally driving on a public street because they are breaking a religious prohibition that you follow counts as “more or less self-protection”. Nor do I see how that description applies to riot or assault committed in response to plans to legally build a road or legally perform an autopsy. Calling such violent reactions “more or less self-protection” strikes me as a pretty indefensible double standard. > [@CC](#): > > I still feel - without any hard statistics to back it up, lamentably - that the percentage of fantatics / extremists / fundamentalists in Islam appears to be much larger than in Judaism or Christianity. I think you’re quite right about that point, and I don’t think hard statistics would be difficult to find. ---
**Author:** ![Wolfian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/7ea924/32.png) [@Wolfian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wolfian)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/75 "2006-02-03T23:14:36Z")
> [@gum](#): > > “The only way this will be resolved is if those who are responsible are turned over so they can be punished by Islamic law, so that they can be executed,” Abu Ibraheem, a 26-year-old protester in the British march, told the Associated Press. “There are no apologies … Those responsible would have to be killed.” > I’m so pleased I don’t have to ridicule Islam anymore. > They’re doing a splendid job themselves. :rolleyes: I bet I could fine equally stupid and violent talk from the fringes of any group, but don’t let me spoil your little jihad. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2006, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/76 "2006-02-03T23:24:14Z")
> [@Wolfian](#): > > :rolleyes: > > I bet I could fine equally stupid and violent talk from the fringes of any group, but don’t let me spoil your little jihad. Problem is, the size of the fringe appears larger. When was the last time the KKK had tens of thousands of protesters across different cities, each in different countries, screaming for death? Replace KKK with any fringe group you like. ---
**Author:** ![Cerri](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3bc359/32.png) [@Cerri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cerri)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/77 "2006-02-04T00:37:52Z")
> [@jali](#): > > I’m a non religious/non believer, but I empathise with those who are rightfully upset at the drawing. > > If Christians and others would perhaps look at the “cartoon” from another perspective maybe they might understand some of the outrage of people from a totally different culture. Mohammed is\* never \* to be drawn - to draw him as a terrorist doubles the sin/insult. Would cartoons of the Virgin Mary as a hooker or Jesus as a crackhead be acceptable to the pious of certain faiths? How about Abraham and Moses as pimps? > > Mohammed isn’t a political feature to the believers - this is a sacrilige to do this. Mohammed is a religious icon to billions - many who are not of Arab descent so the “cartoon” exposes the ignorance of many. > > If Jesus were dressed in an American flag wouldn’t the Christians from around the world be offended? > > There are political leaders in the Middle East that may deserve the pitting of the world via cartoon, but one beleived by many to be a prophet from thousands of years ago does not. Hm…well, it’s food for thought, certainly. I’d see the Xtian equivalent being more Jesus sitting with some PR people, and them listing the craziness of some of his most looney followers, i.e. Robertson, Phelps, etc., and saying “Hey, if the looneys are the loudest/only voices of your religion being heard, and the only images of your religion being broadcast at large, you’ve got bigger issues to deal with than a couple offensive political cartoons.” The image of Mohammed isn’t drawn as a terrorist in that picture, but is holding a drawing of himself as a terrorist. And by my non-muslim, American ideals, I don’t see calling a public perception problem a problem offensive, but I recognize that apparently, some people can. Is it just the image of Mohammed that’s offensive in that particular cartoon? For the record, I thought the majority of the other ones linked were either outright offensive or just plain dumb, but I just didn’t see what there is to be really considered offensive in the particular one I was talking about. (In my admittedly non-muslim American brain, that is) ---
**Author:** ![booklyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a88e57/32.png) [@booklyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/booklyn)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/78 "2006-02-04T02:27:39Z")
Mohamad (pbuh) has a bomb in his turban. What is not offensive about that? And it is the issue of representation AT ALL, not even the particulars. That is just ‘gilding the lilly’. What if the editor who comissioned the cartoons was charged as a terrorist? ---
**Author:** ![CC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f1d935/32.png) [@CC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CC)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/79 "2006-02-04T02:31:12Z")
Yes, Cerri, - it’s just the image that’s offensive. No image of Muhammad is allowed. No picture, no matter how “flattering” it might be, is allowed. It’s not that some of the cartoons were also satirical. That just added to the offense. That we see their offense as ridiculous is beside the point. It’s offensive to them to create visual images of the prophet. That’s their point. And to reprint them exacerbates the problem. In Christianity, lots of artists have knocked themselves out trying to depict God or Jesus in the most flattering of versions. But that’s Christianity. Islam doesn’t see it that way. Ok. So be it. My beef is that they can’t simply take offense. They have to turn it into jihad. Instead of " I hate what those motherfuckers have done," it becomes, “Death to those motherfuckers.” Huge leap. Huge. ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2006, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189/80 "2006-02-04T04:22:30Z")
> [@booklyn](#): > > What if the editor who comissioned the cartoons was charged as a terrorist? Do you have a crime involved here? Or just a summary judgement? If upsetting people is a crime, Hollywood execs should be the first to go. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-of-arab-products-and-brands/342189.md?page=5)