# Boycott Star Trek 2 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 27, 2013, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126 "2013-03-27T19:13:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/81 "2013-03-28T04:11:39Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > I take it you only watched the first five minutes of the movie, then, and didn’t see the part later on where Sarek puts that line in context. > > [Or the TOS episode](http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Journey_to_Babel_(episode)) where Sarek said the exact same thing, in the presence of his wife, in the exact same context. Does Sarek say that in the 2009 movie? I came in somewhere about the time that “Kirk” is cheating on the _Kobayashi Maru_ test, and didn’t see the first five minutes. > [@Smapti](#): > > Bro, do you even Trek? Not as much as I would have liked. When it originally aired I was not in control of a television. I have spent the intervening [del]years[/del] decades waiting for the fine folks at Paramount to come to their senses and bring back Kirk (read that as: _Shatner_) and the gang, and considering all other _ST_ pretenders to be mere placeholders, unworthy of my attention. Still waiting. And yes, I realize that I will now be waiting forever. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/82 "2013-03-28T04:14:59Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > He hadn’t even come out properly, as it were, having not even graduated. > > The Kirk of the 2009 film gets handed things because he HAS A DESTINY, not because he worked for them, and the entire movie is contrived to that end. Yes. And the Enterprise (which was gorgeous, I might add) seems to change size a couple of times, Vulcan is apparently about 5 minutes drive away, and I don’t even want to talk about the butchery the movie committed against black holes. But ya know what? It succeeded despite all that because it was so much fun. I don’t feel compelled to take any of that seriously because it didn’t do so itself. I’m not generally all that forgiving when it comes to these sorts of sloppily thought-out scripts, and I didn’t feel obliged to like the movie just because it was Star Trek, but this movie was good, clean fun. And it brought me great joy. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/83 "2013-03-28T04:15:11Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > He hadn’t even come out properly, as it were, having not even graduated. > > The Kirk of the 2009 film gets handed things because he HAS A DESTINY, not because he worked for them, and the entire movie is contrived to that end. At this point, he has saved _the entire planet of Earth and all its people, including the president and the majority of the Federation’s government_, from total destruction after almost all of Starfleet and most of its sitting command-level personnel were wiped out in seconds. They’re going to have to replace the hundred-odd captains Nero wiped out _somehow_ - why not go with the now certainly galaxy-famous war hero who Admiral Pike, the Vulcan ambassador, a time-traveler from 120 years in the future, and his Academy instructor have all endorsed? ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/84 "2013-03-28T04:19:27Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > Does Sarek say that in the 2009 movie? I came in somewhere about the time that “Kirk” is cheating on the _Kobayashi Maru_ test, and didn’t see the first five minutes. In that case, you missed the scenes of young Spock growing up on Vulcan, where Sarek speaks that exact line. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/85 "2013-03-28T04:27:07Z")
Oh sure! Let’s all boycott the sequel to a refreshing, kickass reboot of the Star Trek franchise, as well as the original cast, but let Michael Bay keep dumping Cleveland Steamers all over our chests with — what now? — his _4th_ Transformers film? Also, _Robocob_ is fucking in it. ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/86 "2013-03-28T04:47:46Z")
I discovered that I’m a purist Trekkie upon watching Star Trek (2009). I thought it was a good movie… but it wasn’t Star Trek. There were a lot of little things that bugged me but it added up to you can’t just put new actors in the old roles. The movie even acknowledges this with that clunky “we must be an alternate timeline!” conversation on the bridge. Star Trek canon is vast but there are legions of fans out there who would gladly serve as continuity gurus to make sure some glaring mistakes don’t get through, like “Admiral Archer” who should have been long dead before Scotty was even born. In any case, I’ll see this new film on opening day. But every little bit of continuity that is out of place will bug me forever. It’s already begun. Carol Marcus is a homely mom, not a lingerie model. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/87 "2013-03-28T05:35:38Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > At this point, he has saved _the entire planet of Earth and all its people, including the president and the majority of the Federation’s government_, from total destruction after almost all of Starfleet and most of its sitting command-level personnel were wiped out in seconds. They’re going to have to replace the hundred-odd captains Nero wiped out _somehow_ - why not go with the now certainly galaxy-famous war hero who Admiral Pike, the Vulcan ambassador, a time-traveler from 120 years in the future, and his Academy instructor have all endorsed? That’s kind of my point about the weakness of the film. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/88 "2013-03-28T05:37:29Z")
> [@DWMarch](#): > > Carol Marcus is a homely mom, not a lingerie model. Bibi Besch was many things, but she was never a homely mom. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/89 "2013-03-28T05:38:38Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Bibi Besch was many things, but she was never a homely mom. She can cook to - ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/90 "2013-03-28T05:43:30Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > It isn’t even due to be released until May 17th. My birthday! ---
**Author:** ![moriah](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b2d939/32.png) [@moriah](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/moriah)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/91 "2013-03-28T06:13:06Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > Oh please give me a link! It was already linked above… [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02LgdXVkXgM](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02LgdXVkXgM) ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 6:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/92 "2013-03-28T06:43:18Z")
> [@bup](#): > > Boycotting a movie because it’s bad? Isn’t that what capitalism is supposed to do without help? Good point. If you do not think a movie will be good or that you will like it, you do not go to see it. That’s not considered a boycott, just exercising your choices. Does boycotting the film mean we should not attend it whether we think we will like it or not? ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 7:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/93 "2013-03-28T07:08:23Z")
> [@cmyk](#): > > Also, _Robocob_ is fucking in it. “Creamed or popped, they’re coming with me!” ---
**Author:** ![Aspidistra](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspidistra/32/3894_2.png) [@Aspidistra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspidistra)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 7:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/94 "2013-03-28T07:26:48Z")
> [@Skara\_Brae](#): > > +1. I can hardly take my eyes off him in the [trailer](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhz4A5BCMAA).\* It’s a Bond movie! no, wait…It’s The Avengers! no, wait… ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 7:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/95 "2013-03-28T07:49:28Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > I think it is silly to think that a guy could come right out of the academy and command a ship. To be fair, quite of few of the other captains and experienced officers were dead. Look, The ST reboot is not TOS. There are many reasons to like TOS only some of those reasons are forcible anally raped by the reboot. JJ Abrams not only jumps the shark but he jumps sharks with friggin lasers mounted on their heads. He’ll probably jump the shark 10 times in this movie. ---
**Author:** ![ekedolphin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ekedolphin/32/10003_2.png) [@ekedolphin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ekedolphin)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 8:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/96 "2013-03-28T08:09:23Z")
It’s been a little while since I watched the 2009 film, but I don’t recall Sarek saying that line to Spock-- “marrying your mother was logical”-- in front of Amanda. I don’t recall seeing Amanda _at all_ until Spock was an adult and had just turned down entrance into the Vulcan Science Academy. Carol Marcus may have been a “homely mom” in _Star Trek II,_ but _Star Trek into Darkness_ takes place 26 years before the events of TWOK would have taken place in the prime universe. **kaylasdad99,** if _TNG_ is not to your liking, I’d suggest you try _Deep Space Nine._ In my educated opinion, the best Trek series by far. Actions actually have _consequences_ in it. You can’t just go to a planet, fix/break everything (often accomplishing both at the same time), leave and never come back. Anyway. Yes, _Star Trek_ (2009) has plot holes you could fly a starship through, and somehow managed to make starship travel completely unnecessary in just one movie with the introduction of transwarp beaming. Nevertheless, I found it great fun, and will be in line for the second one, as I have been for every _Trek_ movie since _The Final Frontier._ (Which, incidentally, was not an auspicious beginning). ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/97 "2013-03-28T11:46:49Z")
> [@ekedolphin](#): > > It’s been a little while since I watched the 2009 film, but I don’t recall Sarek saying that line to Spock-- “marrying your mother was logical”-- in front of Amanda. I think that was his point: in TOS, Sarek says it to Spock while they’re both laid up in sick bay in front of Amanda, at the end of **Journey To Babel** – followed by McCoy dictating Kirk’s treatment, and then shushing everyone who tries to stop him from pulling rank. _“Well, whadaya know? I finally got the last word.”_ But if Amanda’s already dead, there’s no way that memorable scene can play out in the new continuity. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/98 "2013-03-28T12:02:29Z")
But that’s what it is - a new continuity. A parallel universe. Everything that happened in TOS will still happen in the TOS/TNG universe. NONE of the memorable scenes you remember will take place in the new continuity. How can they? ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/99 "2013-03-28T12:06:10Z")
We still have all the old stuff, preserved as relics of the 1960s like flies in amber. I do not expect, want or need my ongoing stories or franchises to be welded to their past. A excessive worship of continuity is the death of storytelling. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2013, 12:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126/100 "2013-03-28T12:07:20Z")
> [@DWMarch](#): > > Star Trek canon is vast but there are legions of fans out there who would gladly serve as continuity gurus to make sure some glaring mistakes don’t get through, like “Admiral Archer” who should have been long dead before Scotty was even born. Right, I mean, it’s not like humans have been known [to live for upwards of 130 years](http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Leonard_McCoy)in the Trek-verse or anything. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boycott-star-trek-2/654126.md?page=6)