# Boyfriend spanked my son without my permission. Advice on how to chew him out most effectively? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [November 8, 2010, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934 "2010-11-08T17:54:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![whole\_bean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/96bed5/32.png) [@whole\_bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whole_bean)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/181 "2010-11-09T18:55:43Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > **prettydorky** , you do not have to answer this. This is a bullying tactic. I always thought it a given that no poster is legally obligated to answer a question posed in the post of another, _i.e._, there is no contempt to be had for a failure to respond. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/182 "2010-11-09T18:59:15Z")
I wouldn’t assume that bullying stems from being spanked at home. There is some evidence that a lack of discipline can lead to a personality that ends up bullying (the child grows up feeling entitled, and will do anything to get their way). ---
**Author:** ![Binarydrone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3da27b/32.png) [@Binarydrone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Binarydrone)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/183 "2010-11-09T19:04:37Z")
> [@tumbleddown](#): > > Spanking isn’t discipline, it’s punishment. And punishment should not be meted out to anyone, especially a small child, in anger. Physical punishment, especially. Not that I agree that a child should ever be shown violence as a means of behavior control, because the immediate behavior change comes with the side effect of the take away, long term lesson that violence is justified. We have an epidemic of bullying in our schools and a growing intimate partner violence amongst adolescents and no one seems to recognize that we teach kids from the youngest age that when people don’t act the way we want them to, the answer is to hurt them until they change. But spanking was good enough for us by gum, so it’s good enough for our kids, and so the cycle continues. > > In any case, I’d be very concerned about anyone, bio parent or not, spouse or not, giving out physical punishment to my child when they are admittedly out of control thanks to their anger. If you can’t understand why, and why a promise that it will never happen again (famous last words, uttered in every domestic violence situation that has ever occurred ever) is as meaningless as spit, I’m not sure what to tell you. So what do we make of this: [http://www.frc.org/get.cfm?i=IS07K02](http://www.frc.org/get.cfm?i=IS07K02) My impression is that less parents than ever are using spanking. Might we not decide to draw a causal link between that and bullying and the like? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/184 "2010-11-09T19:12:00Z")
There are different kinds of bullying and different kinds of bullies. I think the cliched, scowling bruiser with the abusive dad does happen. There are abused kids who become antisocial or violent and act out, but I don’t think that represents most bullying. Most bullying, in my experience (both as a kid and as a teacher) is more insidious and diffused. It isn’t one kid picking on everybody else, it’s one kid or a few kids being singled out for a lot of low level, but constant and oppressive belittling/ostracization by everybody else. It’s the fat girl who always gets laughed at, or the weird kid with the coke bottle glasses or whatever. Everybody has seen these kids who are kind of the designated punching bags, and none of the kids who engage in any of it really think that they’re doing any bullying or that they have anything to do with it. There are some alpha assholes, yes. The “mean girls” and lockr slamming jocks and so forth, but it’s not like any one kid is the standout “bully.” No one kid is “responsible,” it’s just that some kids seem to get sanctioned as everybody’s bitches, and the responsibility is so diffused that no one kid can be singled out. So I don’t think you can correlate much, if at all, between a kid being spanked and a kid being a bully. Plenty of kids bully without being spanked (and I definitely agree that some of the worst offenders are those who are spoiled rather than those who are abused), and plenty of kids are spanked without being bullies. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/185 "2010-11-09T19:24:50Z")
That’s a good article, **binarydrone**. ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/186 "2010-11-09T19:29:38Z")
> [@Binarydrone](#): > > So what do we make of this: [http://www.frc.org/get.cfm?i=IS07K02](http://www.frc.org/get.cfm?i=IS07K02) > > My impression is that less parents than ever are using spanking. Might we not decide to draw a causal link between that and bullying and the like? It doesn’t take much clicking around on that site to begin questioning their agenda. I think I’ll stick with this recommendation: [http://aappolicy.aappublications.org/cgi/reprint/pediatrics;101/4/723.pdf](http://aappolicy.aappublications.org/cgi/reprint/pediatrics;101/4/723.pdf) ---
**Author:** ![MonkeyMensch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@MonkeyMensch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MonkeyMensch)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/187 "2010-11-09T19:45:16Z")
Good on ya, **prettydorky** for getting something useful from the thread. I come from a mixed-child re-marriage family (?) and it took some incidents and encounters to get things sorted out. It sounds like you and your SO communicate well enough to have sorted this one out. I wish you good luck with your “blended family” and peace. ---
**Author:** ![prettydorky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f04885/32.png) [@prettydorky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/prettydorky)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/188 "2010-11-09T19:46:58Z")
> [@tumbleddown](#): > > In any case, I’d be very concerned about anyone, bio parent or not, spouse or not, giving out physical punishment to my child when they are admittedly out of control thanks to their anger. Well that was kind of what went behind the rehearsed information in the OP. And then not telling me, in hopes that my son wouldn’t mention it either (because who wants to tell mommy that they got in trouble). I AM hesitant to trust someone with my son who doesn’t respect my wishes and punishes him out of anger. But, **tumbleddown** , my SO is not leading down the road to domestic violence. He’s just human. He made a human mistake. I’ve done it before too. Independently of spanking him, he knows how I (we) feel about spanking when you’re angry and he did it anyway. I would be pissed if he had done the same thing to one of his daughters. The only difference is I had expressly asked him NOT to spank my son. He also admitted he was not going to tell me because he didn’t want me to get mad about it. This wasn’t an act of necessity to prevent injury, he wasn’t snatching my son up mid-swing, this was after the incident had already happened, in a different room, quietly enough that SO didn’t even know about it until oldest came out and said youngest was crying. He then had to question everyone to find out what exactly happened. If he had time to interrogate all the parties involved, he had time to call me and say “littledorky did this. Should he get a spanking? Do you want me to do it?”. My mom used to call my dad, even after they divorced, when we did a Very Bad Thing. They would punish us jointly. Sometimes my dad would come back to our house to admister the beating because my mom was a softie. Probably I would have said to him “Do what you think is best” because I can be a softie. But I never got that choice, because I wasn’t brought into the fold on this. Furthermore, the horrible day you spent dreading the spanking when Dad got there was sometimes worse than the actual spanking. Earlier I gave a birthday cake analogy, it still stands. If I had said “My boyfriend and I agreed never to spank our kids when angry and he did it anyway without consulting me, and didn’t even tell me after the fact, and now I’m pissed and worried”, would that have been better? What I really wanted was advice on how to speak to someone in a difficult situation that I was nervous about. ---
**Author:** ![Binarydrone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3da27b/32.png) [@Binarydrone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Binarydrone)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/189 "2010-11-09T19:56:17Z")
> [@TruCelt](#): > > It doesn’t take much clicking around on that site to begin questioning their agenda. I think I’ll stick with this recommendation: [http://aappolicy.aappublications.org/cgi/reprint/pediatrics;101/4/723.pdf](http://aappolicy.aappublications.org/cgi/reprint/pediatrics;101/4/723.pdf) That’s nice. Do we know if more parents (percentage wise) or less spank today than, say, 20 years ago? I am not having luck finding these numbers. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/190 "2010-11-09T19:57:16Z")
It sounds like you did a pretty good job already. You communicated everything you wanted to communicate and the message was received. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/191 "2010-11-09T20:13:07Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > …You are the legal parent. You have the legal right to decide who can and cannot spank your kid, and that’s the end of it… > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > He’s not the boy’s legal parent. She is. The right to make those decisions belongs to her and her alone. Full stop. > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I did answer your question. She has the right to decide because she is the legal parent. That is the answer to your question. No, it does not mean anything that he is her boyfriend or that he lives with them. That does not abrogate her parental rights. > > Wrong. Her legal rights are her legal rights. It is inappropriate for people to tell her she doesn’t have a right to decide who can or cannot spank her kid. > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Only one of them is the boy’s parent. Only one of them has parental rights. > > I don’t think that would necessarily make him the boy’s legal parent (I’m not sure, though), but if she chooses to give him that right then she chooses to give him that right. She has not chosen to do so yet. > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > This guy is not the boy’s parent. It doesn’t matter how long he’s lived there. He isn’t the boy’s father until she legally decided to make him the boy’s father. She does not surrender her own parental rights just because he lives with them. **Dio** , once again you’re confusing your opinion with what you like to think of as “facts.” You’re not a lawyer, and you’re not qualified to make legal pronouncements. Knock. It. Off. **twickster** , MPSIMS moderator ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/192 "2010-11-09T20:19:29Z")
> [@twickster](#): > > **Dio** , once again you’re confusing your opinion with what you like to think of as “facts.” You’re not a lawyer, and you’re not qualified to make legal pronouncements. Knock. It. Off. > > **twickster** , MPSIMS moderator You’ve got to be fucking kidding me. That the boyfriend is not a legal parent is stipulated by the OP. That is not an opinion. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/193 "2010-11-09T20:25:06Z")
The _significance_ of that fact is, however, a matter of _opinion_ – yours. Drop the subject now, or I’ll give you a warning for ignoring mod instructions. **twickster** , MPSIMS moderator ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/194 "2010-11-09T20:25:52Z")
[for Twickster](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=584958) ---
**Author:** ![StusBlues](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dc4da7/32.png) [@StusBlues](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StusBlues)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/195 "2010-11-09T20:26:30Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > You’ve got to be fucking kidding me. That the boyfriend is not a legal parent is stipulated by the OP. That is not an opinion. I actually agree with \*Dio \*here. Pretty much everything he says in **Twickster** ’s quote is pretty common sense, not something that requires a JD. Not sure what \*\*Twicks \*\*is getting at. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/196 "2010-11-09T20:32:14Z")
But the OP wasn’t asking whether or not the guy had the legal right to spank her kid. It was more about the practical ins and outs of how you deal with someone who’s not quite a stepparent but obviously not a stranger in terms of disciplining students. It would be like if a mom posted a thread about how her daughter keeps borrowing her clothes without asking and someone kept piping up to say that taking things without permission is stealing. It’s true but it’s not really adding much to the discussion. ---
**Author:** ![StusBlues](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dc4da7/32.png) [@StusBlues](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StusBlues)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/197 "2010-11-09T20:38:07Z")
> [@Freudian\_Slit](#): > > But the OP wasn’t asking whether or not the guy had the legal right to spank her kid. It was more about the practical ins and outs of how you deal with someone who’s not quite a stepparent but obviously not a stranger in terms of disciplining students. It would be like if a mom posted a thread about how her daughter keeps borrowing her clothes without asking and someone kept piping up to say that taking things without permission is stealing. It’s true but it’s not really adding much to the discussion. Well, if digression is a warnable offense on the boards, it’s a wonder that anyone with more than 200 posts is still around! I’d bring up a couple more egregious recent examples, but I think we’ve diverted the focus from the OP too much already. ---
**Author:** ![BigBertha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d78d45/32.png) [@BigBertha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigBertha)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/198 "2010-11-09T20:57:41Z")
prettydorky, its good you two discussed this rationally. Communication is very important. Now you may need to spank your SO for this transgression and you may post the photos here. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/199 "2010-11-09T21:12:59Z")
Well. I think the first thing to do is step back here, and realize there’s two issues. First, the spanking, and secondly, why he didn’t tell you. I think you have to listen to why he didn’t tell you, first. Deep breath, no accusations. Just go up to him and say, “I want to get past this, but it’s bothering me. Can you tell me why you didn’t tell me you spanked little Billy?” The answer is probably because you agreed not to, but he did anyhow, and then he felt ashamed of it. I’m guessing, but it’s a pretty probable answer. Take that answer, think about it, then forgive him. Forgive him in your heart, because I’m gathering you care about him quite a lot. Make it clear to him that the not telling hurt you as much as the spanking bit. Then work on figuring out why he spanked your kid. Forgive him again. Let your anger go. But make sure he understands you’re really against corporal punishment. Look, one slip isn’t the end of the world. But hiding shit might be. It snowballs. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2010, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934/200 "2010-11-09T21:16:22Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > **prettydorky** , you do not have to answer this. This is a bullying tactic. You are the legal parent. You have the legal right to decide who can and cannot spank your kid, and that’s the end of it. First, that’s not a bullying tactic, that’s advice of a necessary first step if there’s any hope of figuring out how to proceed - second, your legal opinion here is likely just plain wrong. (Don’t know about local law, but 'round these parts the definition of “parent” extends to the common-law parent of a biological parent.) The law is irrelevant, though - the main thing is that it makes no sense to try to unravel the situation without answering the questions: “Are we a family? Do we want to be a family?” There are huge advantages to having a co-parent, unless the candidate is constitutionally unfit for the role. That said, one of the biggest stressors in a relationship is conflict of alliances between genetic kin and “fictive” kin. (Those we just decide to include as family, regardless of genetics.) Obviously, there is a tremendous evolutionary pressure to favour genetic kin over fictive kin. This is a trait that has been selected for since the whole show started. If you step back from your emotions and look at it rationally, you might reasonably conclude that this trait has been selected for because it serves the _genes that code for it_’s interest; these hard-wired emotionally reactions may actually be contrary to the interests of the actual people who carry those genes. It’s totally reasonable to use “Do you want to be a family?” as a starting point. It is also a huge mistake to equate having a co-parent with surrendering parental rights. If \*_prettydorky_ does think of her boyfriend as a co-parent, this just sets the stage for them to have a conversation about what sort of discipline is appropriate and then to consistently apply it, presenting a totally united front. Success! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boyfriend-spanked-my-son-without-my-permission-advice-on-how-to-chew-him-out-most-effectively/559934.md?page=11)