# Bra-less older women - does this look good? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [July 2, 2010, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360 "2010-07-02T22:50:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/101 "2010-07-05T12:12:23Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > What did we ever do to you? That is NOT the picture of aging gracefully! Hey - a question was asked and I answered it. I’m all about fighting the ignorance. ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/102 "2010-07-05T12:14:34Z")
> [@rhubarbarin](#): > > For your consideration, some larger ones: > > [Miss May '58.](http://www.phombo.com/miscellaneous/every-playboy-centerfold-1954-2008-high-resolution/608375/popular/) > [Miss September '57](http://www.phombo.com/miscellaneous/every-playboy-centerfold-1954-2008-high-resolution/608370/popular/) > [Miss April '58](http://www.phombo.com/miscellaneous/every-playboy-centerfold-1954-2008-high-resolution/608361/popular/) > [Miss December '59](http://www.phombo.com/miscellaneous/every-playboy-centerfold-1954-2008-high-resolution/608356/popular/)[September '63](http://www.phombo.com/miscellaneous/every-playboy-centerfold-1954-2008-high-resolution/608281/popular/) > [December '68](http://www.phombo.com/miscellaneous/every-playboy-centerfold-1954-2008-high-resolution/608513/popular/)- debatable, but worth seeing. > [December '77](http://www.phombo.com/miscellaneous/every-playboy-centerfold-1954-2008-high-resolution/608285/popular/) > [February '63](http://www.phombo.com/miscellaneous/every-playboy-centerfold-1954-2008-high-resolution/608295/popular/) - keeping in mind she has something laying over her boob, which is pressing it downward > [December '61](http://www.phombo.com/miscellaneous/every-playboy-centerfold-1954-2008-high-resolution/608519/popular/) > [November '73](http://www.phombo.com/miscellaneous/every-playboy-centerfold-1954-2008-high-resolution/608562/popular/) Yep - there are lots of Ds, DDs, DDDs and probably a few Es in that group - the small ribcages help to increase the cup size, FWIW. (i.e. a woman with the same size of boob but a bigger ribcage will wear a smaller cup size). ---
**Author:** ![Lily\_Milliner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8edcca/32.png) [@Lily\_Milliner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lily_Milliner)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/103 "2010-07-05T14:14:50Z")
I’d never given the “pencil test” much thought until this thread (though I think I’d heard of it), but I have to say it seems backwards to me. Wouldn’t saggier breasts do better on the pencil test? For instance, if the old lady in the coffee-and-oatmeal joke stood up straight (and isn’t that the requirement?), then wouldn’t her sagging breast be able to trap a pencil, or more than one, quite easily because the weight of the boob would be against the ribcage/chest? If the “pencil test” is a measure of sag, then I think you pass if the pencil drops, because your boobs are so perky (like all the playboy models posted) and fail if it stays put. (FTR, I’m a C-cup in my late thirties, and the pencil stays put for me.) ---
**Author:** ![rhubarbarin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eb9ed0/32.png) [@rhubarbarin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rhubarbarin)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/104 "2010-07-05T15:03:12Z")
Yes, the only way to ‘pass’ the pencil test is if you can’t hold the pencil in the fold between your breast and ribcage standing upright. Only women with a very small fold or just a crease can ‘pass’ (a large minority of women/girls I would guess, from the breasts I have seen in my life). ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/105 "2010-07-05T15:22:55Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Pencil test is total bullshit. I couldn’t pass that when I was in 9th grade. No one with a C cup or larger can pass the test, no matter how perky their boobs are. But I agree with the overall sentiment, which is (unless I’m mistaken) if you’re uncomfortable without a bra and/or your tits sag, put a flippin’ bra on if you’re attempting to look good. I had to look it up, and the internet claims that the pencil test is where you _can_ trap a pencil between your boob and your chest, not where you can’t. This reminds me of Judy Blume books. Anyway, I’m only a C, but I can definitely pass the pencil test in the way that you define it. I’ve known quite a lot of larger-breasted women who could, too, as well as many who couldn’t (including two quite young, quite small-breasted women). It’s just about breast shape - they’re not all the same (I know other people have said this too, but the OP was looking for reassurance, so here’s some more :)). This thread has made my browsing history look bad. ☹ But it has also meant that I looked at a few pictures of Kim Cattrall’s boobs. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/106 "2010-07-05T16:28:10Z")
You ‘pass’ the test if the pencil drops, as far as going braless goes. You ‘pass’ the test if the pencil stays put as far as having an acceptable amount of boobage for your junior high rivals. ---
**Author:** ![TreacherousCretin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treacherouscretin/32/476_2.png) [@TreacherousCretin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TreacherousCretin)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/107 "2010-07-05T17:18:04Z")
> [@alice\_in\_wonderland](#): > > Hey - a question was asked and I answered it. I’m all about fighting the ignorance. And the pictures proved the point in question. If it weren’t for those two implants hanging under her skin, I’d say okay, an elderly woman at the beach, very nearly nude. She looks her age, she’s not hung up about her ageing body. Good for her, and so what, says I. If not for those implants. . ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/108 "2010-07-05T17:26:12Z")
> [@rhubarbarin](#): > > \ > [December '68](http://www.phombo.com/miscellaneous/every-playboy-centerfold-1954-2008-high-resolution/608513/popular/)- debatable, but worth seeing. \ Wow - it’s Alyson Hannigan as a sixties Playboy bunny! ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/109 "2010-07-05T17:48:51Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > I wonder what it would be like when the women with boob jobs get in their 70s and 80s. They would have muscle weakness and suffer the ravages of age while having their boobs stick out. I have seen the future, my friend. The lady in question was in her 60s, and it looked like someone had shoved a pair of grapefruit into the bottom of knee socks. The sight left me mildly horrified and reinforced my resolve never to get implants, but I imagine she’s scarred some young men for life. > [@rhubarbarin](#): > > I’m a woman. 🙂 > > You don’t think any of those women wear C-cups or larger? I thought that was your definition of ‘too large to pass the pencil test’. Three of the women were no more than a B cup, but the rest probably were Cs and one D. I haven’t been able to pass the pencil test since I was 17 - that’s the year the bossom fairy revisited and granted me a C cup. It was nice of her. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/110 "2010-07-05T18:17:35Z")
> [@rhubarbarin](#): > > I’m a woman. 🙂 She. My bad. > [@](#): > > For your consideration, some larger ones: > > [Miss May '58.](http://www.phombo.com/miscellaneous/every-playboy-centerfold-1954-2008-high-resolution/608375/popular/) > [Miss September '57](http://www.phombo.com/miscellaneous/every-playboy-centerfold-1954-2008-high-resolution/608370/popular/) These are the only two that are contenders. The first look fake; I don’t buy that just because it’s from 1958 it’s real. The second might be a small C, but it also might be able to hold a pencil. I’m looking at the background tit (the left one) and it looks like a pencil may drop from there, but it’s hard to tell. I’ll consider giving you the second one. How about half my hat and $250? I’ll join the “my browsing history is making me look like a perv” club now. ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/111 "2010-07-05T19:40:41Z")
> [@elfkin477](#): > > Three of the women were no more than a B cup, but the rest probably were Cs and one D. If any of those women are wearing a B cup, they’re wearing the wrong sized bra. I wear a 32 E or F. The gal that **CatWhisperer** pointed out has _MUCH_ bigger boobs than I do - as in, more boob flesh, particularly given how small her ribcage is. I would say almost all of them are Ds or large Cs. Also, add me to the perv list as well. I keep calling my husband over for his assessment. He’s bemused. ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/112 "2010-07-05T20:30:31Z")
Okay, children. The pencil test came about in the late '60s/early '70s, which was the first time since the invention of the brassiere that women who could afford to buy a brassiere went braless by choice. (Heh, a little redundant, but oh well.) If you passed the pencil test–i.e., if the pencil fell out–you were considered OK to go braless. Otherwise, put on a bra, or get some flesh-colored tape. If “the internet” claims you passed the test by trapping the pencil, then, horror of horrors, the internet is wrong. ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/113 "2010-07-05T20:41:42Z")
> [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](#): > > Okay, children. The pencil test came about in the late '60s/early '70s, which was the first time since the invention of the brassiere that women who could afford to buy a brassiere went braless by choice. (Heh, a little redundant, but oh well.) > > If you passed the pencil test–i.e., if the pencil fell out–you were considered OK to go braless. Otherwise, put on a bra, or get some flesh-colored tape. > > If “the internet” claims you passed the test by trapping the pencil, then, horror of horrors, the internet is wrong. Well, I’m happy to go by either definition, because it’s not like it’s important, but it’s obviously not obvious what pencil test means - different people have different definitions. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/114 "2010-07-05T20:54:29Z")
> [@scifisam2009](#): > > Well, I’m happy to go by either definition, Good. Go with the right definition. The person passes if the pencil falls. Because test are kind of supposed to be a challenge. And it is very easy for most women, no matter how small the boobage, to trap that pencil. I realize that some people have different definitions for different things, but some definitions are incorrect. I know a ton of people who call a monitor a computer. They are incorrect, no matter how many times the internet says otherwise. As for me, I can’t pass the electric pencil sharpener test. A damn shame. ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/115 "2010-07-05T21:42:44Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > Good. Go with the right definition. The person passes if the pencil falls. Because test are kind of supposed to be a challenge. And it is very easy for most women, no matter how small the boobage, to trap that pencil. > > I realize that some people have different definitions for different things, but some definitions are incorrect. I know a ton of people who call a monitor a computer. They are incorrect, no matter how many times the internet says otherwise. > > As for me, I can’t pass the electric pencil sharpener test. A damn shame. If a woman has very small boobs and she can trap a pencil under them, then she probably is sagging. I am so not going to google electric pencil sharpener test even though I know you made it up; my browsing history today is bad enough without some rule 34 added to it. FWIW, like I said in my post, I was going by the definition where the boob does not trap the pencil because that was the MOL was using. This test, I pass. Go me! 😃 IME that’s not unusual in women with C-cups - not like I’ve stuck pencils under their boobs or anything (rule 34 again!), but you know what I mean. I’m sure I do remember a Judy Blume, or possibly Jean Ure, book where the girls (aged about 13) do the pencil test and are disappointed when they fail. Anyone know which story I’m talking about? ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/116 "2010-07-05T21:42:57Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > . A damn shame. Having seen your cleavage pics, a damn shame my butt. While the girls probably benefit from the application of a bra (if only for comfort), they are spectacular, period. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/117 "2010-07-05T21:47:49Z")
> [@alice\_in\_wonderland](#): > > Having seen your cleavage pics, a damn shame my butt. While the girls probably benefit from the application of a bra (if only for comfort), they are spectacular, period. Now, see, I’ve been grumpy-posting today, because it is 95 degrees in Rochester, NY today, and the AC is on the fritz. But you had to go and make me smile. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/118 "2010-07-05T22:19:38Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > Now, see, I’ve been grumpy-posting today, because it is 95 degrees in Rochester, NY today, and the AC is on the fritz. But you had to go and make me smile. Thanks. Just callin’ them like I see them. And 95 degrees is just gross. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/119 "2010-07-05T22:43:31Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > And it is very easy for most women, no matter how small the boobage, to trap that pencil. Right. Before we got into this pron-laden hijack, complete with offers of hat consumption, that was my entire point: that the pencil test is complete bullshit as a litmus test for boob perkiness. There are many happy, super perky, young boobs on the planet that can trap a pencil. It is not hard to trap a pencil… at all. On top of which, at a certain size, it becomes just about impossible to pass the test, because even in all your very young, glorious, high-chestedness, there is enough boob skin against your rib cage that a tiny, little pencil could wedge itself into the fold. But back to the point, Kim Cattrall’s boobs look fine. No, they’re not 19-year-old boobs, yes they have lost some firmness over the years, but I don’t look at that and go “Hey grandma! Why don’t you try covering up?” ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2010, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360/120 "2010-07-05T22:46:53Z")
> [@rhubarbarin](#): > > Is the $500 still on offer? > \*\* > NSFW: > \*\* > [Playboy Centerfold June '69](http://www.phombo.com/miscellaneous/every-playboy-centerfold-1954-2008-high-resolution/608445/popular/) They still look mighty perky [today](http://www.helenaantonaccio.com/online.html). NSFW - old lady boobs. 😛 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bra-less-older-women-does-this-look-good/545360.md?page=7)