Brave jihadists

Great Debates
61

I think the US govt. put out the whole 72 virigns thing to attempt to lessen the amount of balls it took to do something like this. They did a similar thing in Vietnam by putting out something saying the Viet Cong don’t care about life and family like good old Americans do, then we they see the film of them crying over their dead relatives. They wanted the public to think that it was no big deal, that Muslims are dying to die, if you will, which is dumb, becasue Christians who believe in heaven aren’t rushing to die to get there. As Drew Carey said about the Pope behind bullet proof case- what, he’s afraid he going to get shot, die and go to heaven?

I feel they did this so the public would not realize that there are people who hate the US so much, they are willing to die in specutacular fashion to fuck with them.

And I see the OP’s point about not wanting to call them brave, but it is very brave to do what they did. There really isn’t another word to define knowing you are going to die for this cause. I would guess people didn’t want to call Kamikaze pilots brave back then, but now most would agree that they were.

62

Their thinking is delusional,it is easier to die while taking the lives of innocent people than to live and fight for them;that is what brave men do such as our soldiers who do not intend to be killed but fight for the very freedoms that the innocent people deserve. The Jihadists are not getting what they want and are killing their own kind or some of the people who would help them get a better life. They are killing more Muslims than they do Americans and people of other countries.

Monavis

63

Suicide bombing is simpler, but not necessarily easier that fighting politically or militarily with the intent of living.

I am sure that they have weighed their options and have determined that they can accomplish more with one act as a suicide bomber than they could with a lifetime of more peaceful actions. They may or may not have been delusional when they made this decision, but I can see how a combination of a miserable existence with little hope for improvement and religious zealotry could influence away from what we would call sane.

Also, I can safely say that they do not think that the people they kill would help them to a better life in their view. It is also likely that their view of a better life differs significantly from yours.

64

I don’t know for sure if they are brave or not, because I can’t get into the mindset of a suicide bomber to really understand what he’s thinking. But I’ll give you my take on it anyway…

I don’t believe religion enters into the equation. Or not much, anyway. I’d say it would be pretty brave of a devout Christian to throw himself in front of a train to save a child on the tracks. Does it matter that he knows he’s going to a better life every bit as much as a jihadist does? I don’t think so. If you think that the belief in an afterlife lessens the bravery of a life-terminating act, do you therefore believe that athiest soldiers are braver than Christians or Muslims? I don’t think so.

I think the comparison to spree killers is closer. Jihadists are essentially brainwashing themselves into committing these acts, through being taught hatred and extremism and coming to seriously believe that the mere act of blowing up infidels is a glorious way to go out, regardless of the religious overtones. After you hate enough, and obsess enough, your brain must get to a point where nothing really matters, other than expunging that hatred. Thus a normally meek kid will work himself into a state where he can wander the halls killing people, and face down a hail of bullets from cops without flinching. There’s nothing brave about those actions - they’re the product of a form of temporary insanity.

Psychologically speaking, I imagine the rituals that suicide bombers go through play a part in this (note that the Kamikaze in Japan were highly ritualized and rigid, and their indoctrination/training bears a lot of resemblence to the way Jihadists are trained). The ritual helps put your mind in another state and create a form of mental detachment.

Most military forces around the world use the same kind of techniques to make their soldiers more willing to take orders and to be in a mindset that puts self behind their buddies, their unit, their country. Not the hatred and extremism part, but extreme physical training, mental duress, rituals, and being mentally conditioned to have a strong desire to live up to the standards of your buddies and unit.

I imagine some suicide bombers are brave. I imagine a few of them have second thoughts, but know that there’s no turning back, and they tremble and quake with fear as they reach for the switch. That doesn’t make them admirable, or sympathetic - it just means that they committed their particular act of evil in a brave way.

But I’m equally sure there are many suicide bombers who just hate so much, who have had their minds so twisted over the years, that they’re grinning like Cheshire cats as they flip the switch, ecstactic that they’re finally getting to kill the people they’ve wanted to kill so badly for a long time. They’re not brave. They’re sick and twisted. And another bunch who do it out of religious fervor, and they’re not brave either.