# Breaking Bad 4.01 "Box Cutter" 7/17 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 17, 2011, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359 "2011-07-17T17:50:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2011, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/161 "2011-07-20T11:10:57Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > Re: RJ Mitte- while the voice is his, the leg braces and canes belong to his character. In real life he only has a slight limp. I’ve seen him on the cover of various teen magazines at the supermarket and think it’s great that a kid with CP is considered a teen heart throb. > > His character’s never really been developed that much. I wonder if they plan on bringing him into the center board this season. I’d see him as an essential grounding of the family. Their link to the real world. A bit like how AJ for a large part of The Sopranos didn’t really know what was going on. ---
**Author:** ![What\_the](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f4b2a3/32.png) [@What\_the](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_the)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 11:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/162 "2011-07-22T11:20:07Z")
I’m a little late to the party so I hope there is still some interest… Am I the only one who has a problem with the opening so-called “flashback” of Gale?? If they had done it as a flashback and the flasher had a reason to be flashing I’d be ok with it. But it was simply a scene to make you start thinking that Gale was alive. Maybe some saw thru it imediately and maybe it did set up a later scene (box-cutter), but primarily it was a trick with little “artistic” (for lack of a better word) value. ---
**Author:** ![II\_Gyan\_II](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/bbe5ce/32.png) [@II\_Gyan\_II](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/II_Gyan_II)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/163 "2011-07-22T11:36:19Z")
I just saw it as an interlude to prolong the suspense as well as supply new elements for the plot i.e. box cutters, lab notes, and also the soon-to-be-appreciated tragedy of Gale’s reverence for Walt. ---
**Author:** ![Placid\_Liver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e99b99/32.png) [@Placid\_Liver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Placid_Liver)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/164 "2011-07-22T13:47:27Z")
I found it more confusing because while suggesting Gale must’ve been a chemist of some knowledge (or Gus wouldn’t have used him), that it took him soooo long to get the hang of the formula… but Hank instantly knew why the meth was blue back in season 2 or whenever? and Victor could figure it out just hanging around? (seriously? just dump a bag of this and that and leave the measuring for the chemists?) ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/165 "2011-07-22T13:56:34Z")
> [@Placid\_Liver](#): > > I… and Victor could figure it out just hanging around? (seriously? just dump a bag of this and that and leave the measuring for the chemists?) We don’t know what the result of Victor’s efforts would have been, perhaps just useless sludge. ---
**Author:** ![Lakai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de0a6/32.png) [@Lakai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lakai)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/166 "2011-07-22T14:01:52Z")
> [@Placid\_Liver](#): > > I found it more confusing because while suggesting Gale must’ve been a chemist of some knowledge (or Gus wouldn’t have used him), that it took him soooo long to get the hang of the formula… but Hank instantly knew why the meth was blue back in season 2 or whenever? and Victor could figure it out just hanging around? (seriously? just dump a bag of this and that and leave the measuring for the chemists?) Victor obvious did not know what to do. That’s why he was killed. Hank only figured out why the meth was blue. He never figured out why it was 99% pure. I’m sure Gale knows why the meth was blue as well. The hard part is figuring out how to get the meth to 99%. And Gale could have learned how to get 99% purity a long time ago. Gus had no reason to kill Walt as soon as Gale figured everything out. Gale is a nice guy, it’s unlikely that Gus asked him directly to spy on Walt. Plus Walt wasn’t a major liability from the start, and there is no reason Gus wouldn’t want to hold on to two chemists, in case something were to happen to one of them. ---
**Author:** ![Bytegeist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9dc877/32.png) [@Bytegeist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bytegeist)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/167 "2011-07-22T14:29:43Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > We don’t know what the result of Victor’s efforts would have been, perhaps just useless sludge. But perhaps it would have been **candy**! Mmmmmm, candy. Like cherry sourballs maybe, or butterscotch. Or pop rocks! And now we’ll just never know. Rest in peace, Victor. You had a lot of gumption for a minor character, I’ll give you that. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/168 "2011-07-22T19:05:48Z")
> [@Lakai](#): > > I’m sure Gale knows why the meth was blue as well. No, he specifcally said he didn’t know. > [@Bytegeist](#): > > Rest in peace, Victor. You had a lot of gumption for a minor character, I’ll give you that. He bugged me. The right way, of course: it drove me crazy that he was always hovering around. ---
**Author:** ![Nicest\_of\_the\_Damned](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/8baadc/32.png) [@Nicest\_of\_the\_Damned](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nicest_of_the_Damned)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/169 "2011-07-22T19:12:46Z")
I was just happy to get one more scene of Gale being Gale. He was such a great character. “I _doff_ my proverbial cap!” He makes me think of what Martin Prince from The Simpsons might grow into if his life went all horribly wrong. I agree it would have been a cop-out to let him live but I am gonna miss that guy. ---
**Author:** ![voltaire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voltaire/32/313_2.png) [@voltaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voltaire)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/170 "2011-07-22T20:02:06Z")
> [@Placid\_Liver](#): > > I found it more confusing because while suggesting Gale must’ve been a chemist of some knowledge (or Gus wouldn’t have used him), that it took him soooo long to get the hang of the formula… but Hank instantly knew why the meth was blue back in season 2 or whenever? and Victor could figure it out just hanging around? (seriously? just dump a bag of this and that and leave the measuring for the chemists?) As has been mentioned, the issue wasn’t about the color, but of the purity. > [@Lakai](#): > > And Gale could have learned how to get 99% purity a long time ago. Gus had no reason to kill Walt as soon as Gale figured everything out. Gale is a nice guy, it’s unlikely that Gus asked him directly to spy on Walt. Plus Walt wasn’t a major liability from the start, and there is no reason Gus wouldn’t want to hold on to two chemists, in case something were to happen to one of them. But Gus pretty much did directly ask him to spy, though he used the excuse that Walt had cancer and might die unexpectedly. Gus had to know that Walt’s cancer was in remission. I think it’s clear that Gus wanted to get rid of Walt due to him being a liability. I think another aspect is that Gus saw that Walt was not a stupid man strategically speaking and was pretty much always one step ahead. I think that worries Gus, and he would just much rather have people who would blindly follow his orders and not cause him any problems. Walt has been a constant liability and trouble maker. His wife now knows what he’s up to, and his brother-in-law is a friggin DEA agent. There’s just too much risk in that picture for Gus to tolerate. Of course, the final straw was the defying of his orders and killing the two dealers. > [@Stoid](#): > > No, he specifcally said he didn’t know. You sure about that? As has been said, the blue color is a result of using methylmine(sp?) instead of pseudo-ephidrine, if I/we know that, pretty sure Gale would. ---
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/171 "2011-07-22T21:53:20Z")
> [@voltaire](#): > > As has been mentioned, the issue wasn’t about the color, but of the purity. Except that the methylamine process almost certainly contributes to the quality. > [@](#): > > But Gus pretty much did directly ask him to spy, though he used the excuse that Walt had cancer and might die unexpectedly. Gus had to know that Walt’s cancer was in remission. This wasn’t until he’d already decided Walt had to go after defying him regarding the henchmen. I think the opening scene was included to suggest that he would have liked Gale to learn Walt’s secrets just in case, but he had no immeidate plans to get rid of him until after Walt made it clear what a pain in the ass he was going to be. > [@](#): > > You sure about that? As has been said, the blue color is a result of using methylmine(sp?) instead of pseudo-ephidrine, if I/we know that, pretty sure Gale would. **Gale** : Is that our competition? It really is quite good..the purity, of course, I’m speaking of…speaking strictly in chemical terms… **and I can’t, as of yet, account for the blue color**. But if, um, that is our competition, we have our work cut out for us. ---
**Author:** ![Chipacabra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@Chipacabra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chipacabra)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/172 "2011-07-22T21:54:23Z")
Yeah, Gale says straight out that he can’t account for the blue color. Here’s how I’m reading it: Hank recognizes the blue color because he’s been in the law enforcement game a long time, and he’s either seen or heard of the blue “biker meth”. I suspect that the original recipe blue stuff wasn’t very pure, though. Gale, on the other hand, is an academic, so he’s only familiar with the “right” way to make stuff. It would never occur to him to use that old recipe, let alone that it could produce such results. Also, meth that pure shouldn’t be blue no matter what the production method. It could just be as simple as Gale not able to figure out how the hell Walt got the meth to be so pure without eliminating the blue color entirely. So maybe Gale isn’t confused that it’s blue, he’s just confused why it’s _still_ blue. ---
**Author:** ![DxZero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@DxZero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DxZero)\ **Post date:** [July 22, 2011, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/173 "2011-07-22T22:49:59Z")
Correct me if I wrong, but isn’t the only reason Hank knows why the meth is blue is because Hank knows that “Heisenberg” or his cronies broke into the storage and jacked a big ole 55 gallon of methylamine? I seem to remember him watching security footage of the heist in Season 1 and laughing at its unprofessionalness. ---
**Author:** ![quixotic78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/3ab097/32.png) [@quixotic78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/quixotic78)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2011, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/174 "2011-07-23T00:52:16Z")
> [@Nicest\_of\_the\_Damned](#): > > He makes me think of what Martin Prince from The Simpsons might grow into if his life went all horribly wrong. Ha! Excellent observation! ---
**Author:** ![Bytegeist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9dc877/32.png) [@Bytegeist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bytegeist)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2011, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/175 "2011-07-23T02:09:05Z")
Just to make sure I’m clear on some things … [ol] [li]Only Walt and Jesse know that it’s actually Walt who killed the two henchmen (at the end of Season 3). As far as Gus and Mike know, Jesse killed them, because he’s the one who was angry over the kid. Or, has the truth of that night leaked to Gus somehow and I missed it?[/li][li]Skyler doesn’t know yet that Walt has killed anyone, correct?[/li][/ol] ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2011, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/176 "2011-07-23T02:33:36Z")
No, they know Walt killed them - in that meeting in the desert after the killing they’re clearly talking knowing Walt did it, plus Mike reminds Walt to get his car fixed. ---
**Author:** ![voltaire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voltaire/32/313_2.png) [@voltaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voltaire)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2011, 11:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/177 "2011-07-23T11:54:54Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > Except that the methylamine process almost certainly contributes to the quality. Agreed. (_Gus asks Gale to “spy”_) > [@](#): > > This wasn’t until he’d already decided Walt had to go after defying him regarding the henchmen. I think the opening scene was included to suggest that he would have liked Gale to learn Walt’s secrets just in case, but he had no immeidate plans to get rid of him until after Walt made it clear what a pain in the ass he was going to be. My interpretation of that flashback was that if Gale had shown confidence that he could easily match Walt’s output, then likely proved it in a trial run, Gus would have gotten rid of Walt a long time ago without even blinking an eye. Why else frame it to Gale as “the competition” instead of framing it as a perspective partner. > [@](#): > > **Gale** : Is that our competition? It really is quite good..the purity, of course, I’m speaking of…speaking strictly in chemical terms… **and I can’t, as of yet, account for the blue color**. But if, um, that is our competition, we have our work cut out for us. Ok, but that’s just the flashback from the past. Gale said that only after analyzing Walt’s product. Gale hadn’t yet had an opportunity to try making his own using the methylamine which was available in the lab, and he didn’t yet have the opportunity to observe any of Walt’s methods. He said he can’t “AS OF YET account for the blue color.” There’s no doubt that he quickly came to be able to account for the blue color after working with the methylamine and observing Walt’s methods. Speaking in present terms, (prior to his death, of course) Gale certainly knows why the meth was blue - which is what I (and the person you originally responded to) was talking about. ---
**Author:** ![voltaire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voltaire/32/313_2.png) [@voltaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voltaire)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2011, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/178 "2011-07-23T12:02:33Z")
Gah. perspective=prospective ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2011, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/179 "2011-07-23T14:04:34Z")
> [@Stoid](#): > > Except that the methylamine process almost certainly contributes to the quality. > … I think this is incorrect. As I recall, Walt’s meth was just as pure and just as potent before they stole the methylamine. Remember how much Tuco loved the stuff? Then, later on, when receiving a new batch he said “why is it blue?” and Walt responded that it was every bit as pure and every bit as potent as the previous batches. They changed to the methylamine method only because they couldn’t obtain enough pseudo to manufacture the amount that they had promised to Tuco. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2011, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359/180 "2011-07-23T22:13:51Z")
Yeah, and while I could be wrong I distinctly remember Walt saying not to worry about the change in ingredients because it would result in the same quality. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-4-01-box-cutter-7-17/589359.md?page=10)