# Breaking Bad 5.02 "Madrigal" 7/22/2012 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 23, 2012, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089 "2012-07-23T00:09:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/61 "2012-07-23T15:18:36Z")
> [@Washoe](#): > > I had a weird thought today. Ol’ Gale wasn’t exactly a man’s man himself. Is it possible that all those chemistry scholarships came with a price tag? There are other theories about Gale’s sexuality. [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=14131081#post14131081](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=14131081#post14131081) The karaoke titles where apparently in Thai, and Thailand is a known destination for certain types of sex tourists. Maybe Gale was working as a meth cook because he had a record as a sex offender and couldn’t get any other work. Although I suppose there’s a flaw in that theory in that the police would have discovered such a record pretty quickly and Hank would have mentioned it when talking with Walt. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/62 "2012-07-23T15:28:33Z")
> [@Tarwater](#): > > That final scene, my God. Walt is an irredeemable scumbag now. Between that scene and his manipulation of Jesse, this episode put him full tilt into evil narcissistic villain territory. His treatment of Skyler was the crossing of the Rubicon, I think. No sympathy for the guy anymore. > [@Bytegeist](#): > > Yes, I was cringing during that scene. Almost had to mute it. She looked on the verge of screaming. I’m not understanding this reaction at all. She was scared, he was trying to console her (even if she is beyond the point of being consolable)… what was so “evil” and cringe-worthy about it? ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/63 "2012-07-23T15:28:49Z")
The writers did an excellent job of manipulating the plot to keep Mike in the mix. Since the feds have the assets frozen and Mike has no desire to kill everyone (or be hunted down himself), the only way to keep them loyal is to make them rich again. Good job. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/64 "2012-07-23T15:34:21Z")
> [@Rigamarole](#): > > I’m not understanding this reaction at all. She was scared, he was trying to console her (even if she is beyond the point of being consolable)… what was so “evil” and cringe-worthy about it? She’s scared of _him_ but he doesn’t seem to get that. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/65 "2012-07-23T15:35:43Z")
I think he does seem to get that. That’s what makes it creepy. ---
**Author:** ![Tarwater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9de0a6/32.png) [@Tarwater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tarwater)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/66 "2012-07-23T15:41:02Z")
> [@Rigamarole](#): > > I’m not understanding this reaction at all. She was scared, he was trying to console her (even if she is beyond the point of being consolable)… what was so “evil” and cringe-worthy about it? I’ve had to console people before. At no point in the consolation process did I strip naked and start groping their breasts while they lay rigid and paralyzed next to me. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/67 "2012-07-23T15:52:30Z")
So now we’ve seen that Mike actually isn’t completely soulless, while Walt seems to have gone completely over to the dark side. He’s probably now worse than anyone left alive on the show. He seems to have lost all conscience and all doubt in himself. What did he say to Skyler? Something like: “Those feelings you’re having about Ted. They go away with time. It gets easier.” :eek: Sounds like he’s becoming psychopathic (or at least the Hollywood version of it). ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/68 "2012-07-23T15:53:00Z")
Well at least he’s taking charge. I actually like this Walt a lot more than the whiny, pussy-whipped Walt of seasons past. But I won’t feel sorry for him either when he gets his due. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/69 "2012-07-23T15:54:16Z")
> [@Tarwater](#): > > I’ve had to console people before. At no point in the consolation process did I strip naked and start groping their breasts while they lay rigid and paralyzed next to me. Maybe you’re doing it wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/70 "2012-07-23T15:56:46Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > So now we’ve seen that Mike actually isn’t completely soulless He’s holding her hostage for the Methylmine. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/71 "2012-07-23T15:57:56Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > He’s holding her hostage for the Methylmine. He’s sparing her life for the methylmine. She is the one who paid that other guy $30k to kill him. ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/72 "2012-07-23T15:58:14Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > If she was part of Gus’s cover story—his ex-wife or whatever—she would be under much stronger scrutiny, not just one of many at Madrigal. Why so? Let’s say she’s a whatever to Gus…if she’s at the meeting with the head honcho of Madrigal holding forth who says Shuler is an anomoly but doesn’t know for sure, she could be one of those hiding in plain sight. Gus does have kids. I remember him saying so to Walt that they didn’t like the Chilean dish he was cooking when he had Walt to his home for dinner in season 3. Gay or Bi or whatever have been known to produce biological heirs. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/73 "2012-07-23T16:03:18Z")
Also, I loved Mike’s execution of the hitman. He seemed genuinely sympathetic towards the guy. And he asks him if he’s ready, but rather than make a drawn-out thing of it like every Hollywood movie ever, as soon as he opens his mouth in protest he fires. ---
**Author:** ![newcomer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e5b9ba/32.png) [@newcomer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newcomer)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/74 "2012-07-23T16:05:57Z")
Excellent episode. The writing is superb. This typical story device where early in the Act I someone (Mike) is offered a pretty good offer and he refuses it, and then, the series of actions beyond the control or calculation of the guy who rejected the offer makes him slowly realize that the offer in a new state of the affairs makes sense; in fact, it’s the only way forward. Call that Walt received while doing such a mundane kitchen work is sheer brilliance. It may lead him to think of himself too much and make him overstretch. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/75 "2012-07-23T16:11:47Z")
I was sort of hoping that when Jesse found the cigarette in the roomba, he’d realize something was up because he’d be 100% sure he’d checked it before. But instead what happened was sort of heart wrenching - beating himself up over drawing what was actually the correct conclusion. That’s just some evil manipulative shit there - not only did Walt poison and nearly kill this kid he cared for, but he ended up making Jesse feel like the bad guy over it and that he should be more loyal to Walt. I’m glad they addressed the issue of the cigarette - most TV shows would’ve just let the issue fall away after it served its purpose. This show is spending a lot of time making sure all the loose ends are explicitly tidy. ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/76 "2012-07-23T16:13:24Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > So now we’ve seen that Mike actually isn’t completely soulless, while Walt seems to have gone completely over to the dark side. He’s probably now worse than anyone left alive on the show. > > He seems to have lost all conscience and all doubt in himself. > > What did he say to Skyler? Something like: “Those feelings you’re having about Ted. They go away with time. It gets easier.” :eek: > > Sounds like he’s becoming psychopathic (or at least the Hollywood version of it). Yeah, I think Walt has been a sociopath for a long time. The seeds were planted back when he decided that meth production was the way to provide for his family. I was lulled into that mindset, that he thinks he’s doing this for a noble goal, when the reality is he’s more concerned about the quality of the product than family. His narcissism is overwhelming everything to the point of rationalizing murder. Walt thrives on the power of controlling everything, while Jesse finds it more and more difficult to live with himself. Everything is in neat compartments right down to the horror of the plane crash. He doesn’t let himself or anyone grieve. Doing that would be human. The only time he lets his guard down and his son sees his humanity is when he gets shit kicked by Jesse, and that’s the only time his son gets a real chance to connect with him. ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/77 "2012-07-23T16:20:49Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > I was sort of hoping that when Jesse found the cigarette in the roomba, he’d realize something was up because he’d be 100% sure he’d checked it before. But instead what happened was sort of heart wrenching - beating himself up over drawing what was actually the correct conclusion. That’s just some evil manipulative shit there - not only did Walt poison and nearly kill this kid he cared for, but he ended up making Jesse feel like the bad guy over it and that he should be more loyal to Walt. > > I’m glad they addressed the issue of the cigarette - most TV shows would’ve just let the issue fall away after it served its purpose. This show is spending a lot of time making sure all the loose ends are explicitly tidy. I really hate Walt for doing this to his only truly loyal friend. He is one evil bastard, a true narcissist it’s all about Walt..and I agree, unlike the shitty loose ends on the Sopranos, this show really puts in the effort to take the storylines to a logical conclusion. ---
**Author:** ![Andiethewestie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba9def/32.png) [@Andiethewestie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andiethewestie)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/78 "2012-07-23T16:25:58Z")
> [@Bob Ducca](#): > > Maybe you’re doing it wrong. Maybe. But I sure as hell felt my own skin crawl when Walt was touching her. ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/79 "2012-07-23T16:27:01Z")
> [@Andiethewestie](#): > > I really hate Walt for doing this to his only truly loyal friend. He is one evil bastard, a true narcissist it’s all about Walt..and I agree, unlike the shitty loose ends on the Sopranos, this show really puts in the effort to take the storylines to a logical conclusion. This show is so great at cleaning up loose ends (including why the pizza didn’t fall apart when Walt threw it on the roof… you cut your own pizza!), that if at any point there is a loose thread, you can expect it to come back and be addressed at some point. So… can we think of any loose threads that still need handled? ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/80 "2012-07-23T16:28:46Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > I’m glad they addressed the issue of the cigarette - most TV shows would’ve just let the issue fall away after it served its purpose. This show is spending a lot of time making sure all the loose ends are explicitly tidy. If you listen to the podcast, in almost every episode (of the podcast) they spend at least a minute or two discussing how much time they dedicate to closing up plot holes, dotting i’s, getting rid of loose ends etc. Whether or not Huell physically could have taken the cigarette was about the only thing the internet has ever gotten side tracked on with this show. A few episodes later (probably just due to the lag in when the podcasts were recorded vs when the shows were aired) Vince finally said something to the extent of “Huell took it, just let it go already” The only other time I’ve seen that happen on this show is the Jane thing. Whether or not Vince purposely left that scene open to interpretation or not, I don’t know. Maybe he did, maybe he didn’t and it worked out for the best, but either way, the show still isn’t like, say, True Blood or even Dexter where you can find a plot hole in just about every scene. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089.md?page=5)