# Breaking Bad 5.02 "Madrigal" 7/22/2012 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 23, 2012, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089 "2012-07-23T00:09:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/121 "2012-07-23T20:00:49Z")
> [@Yeticus\_Rex](#): > > [Emmy nominations for 2012:](http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/envelope/emmys/la-et-st-emmy-nominations-2012-list-20120718,0,521498.htmlstory) > > Lead Actor in a Drama Series - Bryan Cranston as Walter White in “Breaking Bad” > Supporting Actress in a Drama Series - Anna Gunn as Skyler White in “Breaking Bad” > Supporting Actor in a Drama Series: Aaron Paul as Jesse Pinkman in “Breaking Bad” > Supporting Actor in a Drama Series: Giancarlo Esposito as Gustavo ‘Gus’ Fring in “Breaking Bad” > Guest Actor in a Drama Series: Mark Margolis as Tio Salamanca in “Breaking Bad” > Directing for a Drama Series: Vince Gilligan, “Breaking Bad” Every one absolutely worthy. I read in a magazine (can’t remember which- E.W. probably) that some of Margolis (Hector Salamanca)'s gestures were based on his mother-in-law who spent years as an invalid stroke victim, but some of the tics and other gestures were deliberately written in to mimic the side effects of certain heavy duty anti-psychotic medications. When they did Hector’s flashback scenes (the one at Don Eladio’s pool and one where he was- ahem- playing with\* his twin nephews) he didn’t do these gestures because he was unmedicated then. I love that kind of attention to detail. Margolis got some “booos” on this board and elsehwere for what was apparently a really unbelievable Spanish accent, but he was great in all the wheelchair scenes. \*_playing with_ here meaning _attempting to drown one to teach both a life lesson_ ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/122 "2012-07-23T20:04:19Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > I only asked because when I first noticed the fly I was wondering if there was some symbolism to it other then the dead body since 2 hours seemed a bit soon for flies to show up. Off-topic but totally fascinating: [blowflies will tend to colonize a corpse](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protophormia_terraenovae) almost immediately, and because of this and their consistent development pattern, they can be used as very accurate indicators of the time elapsed since death: > [@Wiki](#): > > Among the first to colonize, Calliphoridae species are found on the body almost immediately. > … > Protophormia terraenovae is forensically important because of its extremely specific developmental time. > … > Because the development of these flies is dependent on temperature, entomologists can use past weather data to estimate the ages of larvae and even pupae discovered on a corpse. > … > When post-feeding larvae venture away from the body to pupate, as is common for most blowflies, displacement behavior becomes the determining factor of age. [21] When a body is discovered, if the larvae are leaving, it is possible to measure the distance they have traveled and, with knowledge of the species’ crawling speed, to calculate when they left the body. Crawling speed is affected by terrain, temperature, and maggot length. These considerations allow forensic entomologists to make precise age estimations. Is that some crazy shit or what? ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/123 "2012-07-23T20:04:28Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > A show needs to air between June 1 and May 31 to be eligible for the Emmy Awards. So if the second half of the fifth season doesn’t air until next summer, they could compete for the Emmys twice more (once for the current eight episodes and again for the last eight). That explains why the decided on a split season aired so far apart. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/124 "2012-07-23T20:10:22Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > That explains why the decided on a split season aired so far apart. In the 501 podcast they said that splitting the season gave them 3 weeks per episode in stead of the normal 2. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/125 "2012-07-23T20:51:17Z")
I wonder if Walt (who I almost feel like calling him Heisenberg now) is going to try and use Mike’s granddaughter as leverage. I think that would end differently than using Jesse’s girlfriend’s son as a pawn since Mike is naturally more suspicious in general and more suspicious of anything Heisenberg does in particular. What I love about _Breaking Bad_ is that on most shows- even pretty good ones- it’d be a foregone conclusion that Walt will do that since he has a history of it and means and motive and all, but on this one you have no idea. I do hope that we learn some more about Gus’s past. Not that it’s likely his original name anyway, but is _Fring_ believable as a Chilean surname? ---
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/126 "2012-07-23T21:03:09Z")
My knowledge of Latin American history is pretty dismal. Do the Germans have a history of business relationships with Chile, like the Dutch do with Guatemala? I’m thinking that Gus and Lydia might go way back together. ---
**Author:** ![Invisible\_Chimp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/f05b48/32.png) [@Invisible\_Chimp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Invisible_Chimp)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/127 "2012-07-23T21:05:23Z")
> [@Yeticus\_Rex](#): > > [Emmy nominations for 2012:](http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/envelope/emmys/la-et-st-emmy-nominations-2012-list-20120718,0,521498.htmlstory) > > Lead Actor in a Drama Series - Bryan Cranston as Walter White in “Breaking Bad” > Supporting Actress in a Drama Series - Anna Gunn as Skyler White in “Breaking Bad” > Supporting Actor in a Drama Series: Aaron Paul as Jesse Pinkman in “Breaking Bad” > Supporting Actor in a Drama Series: Giancarlo Esposito as Gustavo ‘Gus’ Fring in “Breaking Bad” > Guest Actor in a Drama Series: Mark Margolis as Tio Salamanca in “Breaking Bad” > Directing for a Drama Series: Vince Gilligan, “Breaking Bad” This is the episode they submit to get Jonathan Banks a nomination next year. ---
**Author:** ![Yeticus\_Rex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/a698b9/32.png) [@Yeticus\_Rex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yeticus_Rex)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/128 "2012-07-23T21:34:39Z")
So far, I think the Banks (Mike) is getting as much face time if not more than Cranston (Walt)…his character certainly has been getting some of the choicest lines in these first two episodes…and he’s becoming a very deep and complex character. ---
**Author:** ![Yeticus\_Rex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/a698b9/32.png) [@Yeticus\_Rex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yeticus_Rex)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/129 "2012-07-23T21:39:47Z")
> [@Washoe](#): > > My knowledge of Latin American history is pretty dismal. Do the Germans have a history of business relationships with Chile, like the Dutch do with Guatemala? I’m thinking that Gus and Lydia might go way back together. [There could be a connection.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Chilean) “Fring” does sound more German than Hispanic. Could Gus and Lydia have some possible family connection (common ancestry) rather than husband/wife/lovers? ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/130 "2012-07-23T21:51:47Z")
> [@Yeticus\_Rex](#): > > [There could be a connection.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Chilean) “Fring” does sound more German than Hispanic. Could Gus and Lydia have some possible family connection (common ancestry) rather than husband/wife/lovers? You know what? The new dressing should be called _Fringenfranch_ (or _Franchenfring_?) in honor of Gus! Although in all seriousness I think you could be on to something - I did a search for family genealogies with that surname and the majority are German. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/131 "2012-07-23T22:10:20Z")
Remember that Mike was going to be Lydia’s No. 2 victim. The shooter had Chao set Mike up and was waiting for him. So as far as Lydia was concerned, Mike was going to be dead. That’s another reason I don’t doubt Mike was going to kill her. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/132 "2012-07-23T22:16:45Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Remember that Mike was going to be Lydia’s No. 2 victim. The shooter had Chao set Mike up and was waiting for him. So as far as Lydia was concerned, Mike was going to be dead. That’s another reason I don’t doubt Mike was going to kill her. Oh yeah, I was rooting for the bitch to die (kinda knew that she wouldn’t though, due to the fact that she’s obviously emerging as a character of some importance). ---
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/133 "2012-07-23T22:25:59Z")
> [@Yeticus\_Rex](#): > > [There could be a connection.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Chilean) “Fring” does sound more German than Hispanic. Could Gus and Lydia have some possible family connection (common ancestry) rather than husband/wife/lovers? Nice. I’m going to go out on a limb here and say that Lydia is the great-granddaughter of the founder of Madrigal Electromotive, the kid is Fring’s, and Lydia knew Gus when Pinochet was still in power. You heard it here first (of course I’m gonna be wrong on all three counts). ---
**Author:** ![Erdosain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/erdosain/32/7284_2.png) [@Erdosain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erdosain)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/134 "2012-07-23T22:28:03Z")
> [@Washoe](#): > > My knowledge of Latin American history is pretty dismal. Do the Germans have a history of business relationships with Chile, like the Dutch do with Guatemala? I’m thinking that Gus and Lydia might go way back together. Uh, seriously folks? Germans in South America? How could that possibly come about? You heard it here first: his real name is Gustavo Hitler Fring. That’s why Don Eladio didn’t dare kill him with his chicken brother. The Nazi curse! ---
**Author:** ![jrepka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ee59a6/32.png) [@jrepka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jrepka)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/135 "2012-07-23T22:36:14Z")
Speaking of plot holes: this is not a big one, but it may have been something I just missed: In season 3, Hank had his second opportunity to take a higher position in El Paso, but gave it up because of his obsession with Heisenberg and partly because of his PTSD. When they finally give up on him, the promotion goes to his partner Steve Gomez – there was even a little party where Hank congratulates him and presents him with the little idol he was given during his previous stint in El Paso. Did Gomez ever go to El Paso? Did the show ever explain why he didn’t, or why he came back? ---
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/136 "2012-07-23T22:36:32Z")
And Hitler was a tweaker, too! (Serious—look it up.) So Madrigal was born of Nazi design… ---
**Author:** ![jrepka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ee59a6/32.png) [@jrepka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jrepka)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/137 "2012-07-23T22:46:43Z")
> [@Washoe](#): > > Nice. I’m going to go out on a limb here and say that Lydia is the great-granddaughter of the founder of Madrigal Electromotive, the kid is Fring’s, and Lydia knew Gus when Pinochet was still in power. You heard it here first (of course I’m gonna be wrong on all three counts). I’m going to go out on a limb and say that the kid exists **only** to create conditions under which Mike couldn’t just sneak in and shoot Lydia. He had to wait for the nanny to put her to bed and then leave, which gave her a chance to plead and for him to think about the kid (about the same age as his granddaughter), and to realize that he had a chance to make some money to rebuild his gd’s college fund and perhaps pay off the remaining (9?) people on the DEA’s list. Lydia was Fring’s connection to Madrigal’s other divisions, nothing more… ---
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/138 "2012-07-23T22:53:57Z")
You’ll be wrong after I contact Gilligan and sell him on my awesome backstory idea. ---
**Author:** ![interface2x](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c0e974/32.png) [@interface2x](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/interface2x)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/139 "2012-07-23T23:30:36Z")
> [@jrepka](#): > > Did Gomez ever go to El Paso? Did the show ever explain why he didn’t, or why he came back? I don’t remember it being addressed but I assumed that he couldn’t leave once Hank was officially out of the game. ---
**Author:** ![LurkerInNJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ed655f/32.png) [@LurkerInNJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LurkerInNJ)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2012, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089/140 "2012-07-23T23:39:05Z")
Hank or the other DEA agent interviewing Mike mentions 11 people on the list. Picked that up while watching the episode again. Didn’t catch it the first time. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-bad-5-02-madrigal-7-22-2012/629089.md?page=8)