# Breaking news: Essex truck deaths \[was: Can Bulgarians Freely Enter the UK\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [October 23, 2019, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185 "2019-10-23T14:39:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2019, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/41 "2019-10-25T00:54:32Z")
> [@zimaane](#): > > I would speculate that the human smuggler fees would be at least as much as a plane ticket. Airlines are required to pay for the deportation of illegal immigrants they bring in, and the aircraft (or ship) is subject to confiscation if it brings in illegal immigrants. Smuggler fees are typically much higher than an airplane ticket. Immigrants would much rather pay the cheaper airfare and get the safer travel if they could, but no-one will permit them to board an airplane without entry papers. ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2019, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/42 "2019-10-25T01:16:25Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > But why take the additional risk to get into the UK if they were already in relatively safe and prosperous Belgium? There’s a near slave-trading sector of the people-smuggling trade which has a lot of Chinese victims. As pointed out in DPRK’s post, it can cost up to £10000 to be smuggled from China to the UK. Where does an unskilled Chinese labourer find that kind of money? He doesn’t. So he signs up to a package deal in which an, um, entrepreneur fronts up the cost of the smuggling, and organises it, and the worker commits to working for him or at his direction. This commitment is secured by the entrepreneur retaining the worker’s identity papers and knowing where his family/dependents in China live. The worker has no choice about where he goes; the entrepreneur supplies gangs of cheap undocumented unfree labour to do dirty, dangerous and unskilled work, and arranges the smuggling, the accommodation, etc, etc. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2019, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/43 "2019-10-25T04:17:29Z")
China and plenty of other countries (Vietnam, Albania, Moldova). Debt slavery is used to traffic people into illegal cannabis farms, nail bars and sex work. They don’t all come in such brutal conditions, particularly not girls from the European fringes who are to be bullied into sex work. The authorities have their hands full tracking down such cases, though there have been a fair few successful prosecutions. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2019, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/44 "2019-10-25T04:38:07Z")
[The occupants of the truck may have been Chinese.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/british-police-39-bodies-found-inside-truck-believed-to-be-chinese-nationals/2019/10/24/15de357e-f644-11e9-ad8b-85e2aa00b5ce_story.html) (Might be behind a paywall, sorry) Latest story says 39 dead, none alive. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2019, 8:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/45 "2019-10-25T08:32:13Z")
Rather more detailed update (and not paywalled): > **[Essex lorry victims were trapped before reaching Belgian coast, officials say](https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/oct/24/lorry-victims-were-trapped-before-reaching-belgian-coast-officials-say)** > > Chinese nationals would have been locked in refrigerated trailer for at least 10 hours ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2019, 10:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/46 "2019-10-25T10:27:18Z")
As we suspected, the immigrants were put into the trailer somewhere in Belgium (probably) before the trailer was delivered to Zeebrugge docks to be loaded onto the ferry. No doubt the Belgian police are concentrating on the route that trailer took and who was hauling it. Many many hours of CCTV to trawl though I guess. Trailers like this are routinely rented and it seems entirely plausible that the owners of the trailer were totally ignorant of the use it was to be put to. The company that employed the driver, however…? It’s not clear who owned the tractor unit; it may be that firm, or it may be the driver himself, or someone else entirely. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2019, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/47 "2019-10-25T11:51:11Z")
Seems unlikely that the 25 year old driver is the mastermind behind this, he could even have been completely oblivious until after the pickup. He is certainly in some way an accessory to this though and you can imagine the amount of pressure being put on him at this moment to cough up some bigger names. ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2019, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/48 "2019-10-25T13:36:52Z")
Latest from the BBC: > [@](#): > > Two people have been arrested on suspicion of the manslaughter of 39 people found dead in a refrigerated lorry in Essex. > > The man and woman, both 38, from Warrington, Cheshire, were also held on suspicion of conspiracy to traffic. Definition of conspiracy to traffic: > [@](#): > > Arranging or facilitating the travel of another person with a view to exploitation - Section 2 Modern Slavery Act 2015 > A person commits an offence if the person arranges or facilitates the travel of another person (V) with a view to V being exploited. > > It is irrelevant whether the victim consents to the travel (whether V is an adult or child). > > A person may in particular arrange or facilitate V’s travel by recruiting V, transporting or transferring V, harbouring or receiving V, or transferring or exchanging control over V. > > A person arranges or a person arranges or facilitates V’s travel with a view to V being exploited only if > the person intends to exploit V in any part of the world during or after travel; or > the person knows or ought to know that another person is likely to exploit V in any part of the world during or after travel. > > Travel is defined as: > Arriving in, or entering, any country > Departing from any country, or > Travelling within any country. > > A person who is a United Kingdom (UK) national commits an offence regardless of where the arranging or facilitating takes place, or where the travel takes place. > > A person who is not a UK national commits an offence if any part of the arranging or facilitating takes place in the UK, or the travel consists of arrival or entry into, departure from, or travel within the UK. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2019, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/49 "2019-10-25T20:25:48Z")
> [@UDS](#): > > There’s a near slave-trading sector of the people-smuggling trade which has a lot of Chinese victims. > > As pointed out in DPRK’s post, it can cost up to £10000 to be smuggled from China to the UK. Where does an unskilled Chinese labourer find that kind of money? He doesn’t. So he signs up to a package deal in which an, um, entrepreneur fronts up the cost of the smuggling, and organises it, and the worker commits to working for him or at his direction. This commitment is secured by the entrepreneur retaining the worker’s identity papers and knowing where his family/dependents in China live. The worker has no choice about where he goes; the entrepreneur supplies gangs of cheap undocumented unfree labour to do dirty, dangerous and unskilled work, and arranges the smuggling, the accommodation, etc, etc. Heard an interview with a British economist saying this exact thing. Estimates are there are about 13,000 undocumented workers, many Chinese, working in assorted enterprises in Britain as slave labour. He said they most likely would be stuck in that situation for years or decades and basically held prisoner. I suspect Chinese are common because there’s a huge pool to draw from, and the people running the slave shops have the connections to run large businesses and speak the same language and understand what motivates their “employees”. ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2019, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/50 "2019-10-25T21:51:26Z")
It now seems that at least one of the victims was a Vietnamese girl whose relatives had paid a Chines gang to smuggle in. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2019, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/51 "2019-10-27T21:53:18Z")
> [@bob\_2](#): > > It now seems that at least one of the victims was a Vietnamese girl whose relatives had paid a Chines gang to smuggle in. Or, possibly, an ethnic Chinese girl from Vietnam? I haven’t seen her name yet, but it’s not inherently unlikely. ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2019, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/52 "2019-10-27T23:06:53Z")
It seems that a number of them were Vietnamese. From the BBC: > [@](#): > > For Vietnamese migrants, the UK is probably the most popular destination in Europe, says Dr Tamsin Barber, a lecturer in political sociology at Oxford-Brookes University, who specialises in migration and the British-Vietnamese population. > > They know if they come to the UK they’re likely to be able to secure work and possibly quite a lot of money to send back to their families in Vietnam, she says. > > There’s also a wide network of Vietnamese people who are already in the UK who can help newcomers with accommodation and employment. > > Once they’re in the UK, there is high demand for low-skilled labour in Vietnamese restaurants, nail salons and the illicit cannabis industry. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2019, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/53 "2019-10-27T23:57:38Z")
The possibility that occurred to me: > [@](#): > > There are about one million Chinese in Vietnam (two percent of the population). There used to be more but many were forced to leave. Many of the so-called Boat People that fled Vietnam during a much-publicized exodus between 1975 and 1980 were Chinese Vietnamese (See Boat People). > **[CHINESE IN VIETNAM (HOA) | Facts and Details](https://factsanddetails.com/southeast-asia/Vietnam/sub5_9d/entry-3402.html)** Does anyone remember reading any articles which give a Vietnamese province for any of those who died? If there was one mentioned you might be able to find information about the percent Chinese living in that province. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2019, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/54 "2019-10-28T06:07:33Z")
More detail on the Vietnam connection here: > **[Essex lorry deaths: Vietnamese families fear relatives among dead](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-50185788)** > > Pham Thi Tra My and Nguyen Dinh Luong are among those who are feared to have died in the trailer. > **[Subscribe to read | Financial Times](https://www.ft.com/content/2ef17130-f8b4-11e9-a354-36acbbb0d9b6)** > > News, analysis and comment from the Financial Times, the worldʼs leading global business publication ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2019, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/55 "2019-10-28T15:41:31Z")
[Another Vietnamese probable victim](https://mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKBN1X50J9). ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2019, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/56 "2019-10-28T16:18:47Z")
[More arrests](https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/oct/26/essex-lorry-deaths-fifth-man-arrested-dublin) ---
**Author:** ![engineer\_comp\_geek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/engineer_comp_geek/32/504_2.png) [@engineer\_comp\_geek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/engineer_comp_geek)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2019, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/57 "2019-10-28T17:12:33Z")
**Moderator Action** Since the conversation has shifted away from the factual question of the OP and is now more of a general discussion about the event in general, I am going to move this to MPSIMS. Please treat the thread as a breaking news thread. ETA: The thread title has also been updated. ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2019, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/58 "2019-10-28T22:29:49Z")
He has been remanded in custody until an appearance at the Old Bailey next month. That won’t be a full trial; he will most likely be remanded again pending a trial next year, when there will surely be some co-defendants. ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2019, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/59 "2019-10-29T16:17:01Z")
The police have named two more men they are looking for: > [@](#): > > Two brothers are wanted on suspicion of manslaughter over 39 people found dead in a lorry in Essex. > > Ronan Hughes, 40, and Christopher Hughes, 34, from Armagh in Northern Ireland, are also wanted by police on suspicion of human trafficking. > > The 39 bodies were found in the lorry trailer on an industrial estate in Grays on Wednesday. > > Police believe the Hughes brothers are in Northern Ireland but say they have links to the Republic of Ireland. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2019, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185/60 "2019-10-29T18:17:59Z")
Why exactly don’t these truck drivers - and the ones who drive migrants into the USA - just open their doors every now and then or find some way to let their passengers breathe? There is nothing for them to gain by having their passengers suffocate or overheat. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-essex-truck-deaths-was-can-bulgarians-freely-enter-the-uk/842185.md?page=4)