# Breaking News - SW Flight Engine Failure, 1 Dead **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [April 17, 2018, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600 "2018-04-17T20:54:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2018, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/41 "2018-04-18T20:11:20Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > He also said she became unconscious from the window blast, although I’m not sure how he could be sure if this if she was immediately sucked towards the hole. If her head were outside the airplane, then it stands to reason that the -60 degree temps, lack of breathable oxygen, and 500-mph winds would make her lose consciousness. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2018, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/42 "2018-04-18T20:22:38Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > If her head were outside the airplane, then it stands to reason that the -60 degree temps, lack of breathable oxygen, and 500-mph winds would make her lose consciousness. I’m sure it would, but it’s unclear whether she became unconscious as a result of injury from flying debris, or from having her head potentially out of the window. ---
**Author:** ![TreacherousCretin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/treacherouscretin/32/476_2.png) [@TreacherousCretin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TreacherousCretin)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2018, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/43 "2018-04-18T20:23:34Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > [This eyewitness](http://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappens/this-plane-is-going-down-passenger-describes-moments-leading-up-to-emergency-landing-1.4624088) said she had her seatbelt on, so that would have probably limited how much of her was sucked out the window. He also said she became unconscious from the window blast, although I’m not sure how he could be sure if this if she was immediately sucked towards the hole. (Hypothetical question, with admittedly vague guesses about airspeed and temps) Assuming she somehow escaped injury from the window blast and being pulled through the window opening, wouldn’t the virtually instantaneous exposure to a 500mph freezing hurricane kill her immediately? ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2018, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/44 "2018-04-18T20:31:14Z")
> [@TreacherousCretin](#): > > (Hypothetical question, with admittedly vague guesses about airspeed and temps) > Assuming she somehow escaped injury from the window blast and being pulled through the window opening, wouldn’t the virtually instantaneous exposure to a 500mph freezing hurricane kill her immediately? A British Airways pilot [survived getting sucked out of a cockpit window](https://www.express.co.uk/travel/articles/867958/pilot-sucked-out-plane-british-airways-1990-pictures) in 1990 at 17,400 feet, with 345mph winds and temperatures as low as -17 degrees. He survived, but suffered fractures to his right arm, left thumb and right wrist, a dislocated shoulder, as well as frostbite, shock and post-traumatic stress. ---
**Author:** ![buddha\_david](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ee7513/32.png) [@buddha\_david](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddha_david)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2018, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/45 "2018-04-18T22:51:06Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > Talk about a perfect set-up. > " I flew single engine fighters in the Air Force, but this plane has four engines. It’s an entirely different kind of flying, altogether. " It’s an entirely different kind of flying. (C’mon, people…) ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2018, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/46 "2018-04-18T23:43:42Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > I just saw [an article confirming that the top half of her torso was through the window](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/17/us/southwest-airlines-explosion.html). This is an impossible fit for a healthy adult, but given that cabin pressure during cruise is about 11 psi, and outdoor pressure at 32,000 feet is about 4 psi, that’s a differential of 7 psi, which is more than enough to cause a violent force-fit. Once that window got shattered and blown out, and she got drawn into the outdraft, that’s many hundreds of pounds of force trying to shove her body through that hole. In addition to the flailing-related injuries I described upthread, she probably broke numerous bones in her shoulders, ribs, and upper back (with concomitant internal organ damage) as the outrush of air tried to extrude her through the window hole. Uh yeah. Umm… If the top half of her torso went through the window. I very much doubt that two guys could pull her back in. Not that just her head and perhaps and arm and shoulder didn’t go through. Not that it really matters. People explain things wrong under high :eek: stress situations. And reporters sometimes use the wrong words. ---
**Author:** ![excavating\_for\_a\_mind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e8c25b/32.png) [@excavating\_for\_a\_mind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/excavating_for_a_mind)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2018, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/47 "2018-04-19T00:00:43Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > It’s an entirely different kind of flying. > [@buddha\_david](#): > > It’s an entirely different kind of flying. It’s an entirely different kind of flying. (That’s how its done) ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2018, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/48 "2018-04-19T03:02:22Z")
> [@Jacquernagy](#): > > It sounds like **Broomstick** is maybe bitter because she didn’t cut it in the military? Nope, never had any interest in joining the military. > [@](#): > > Nevertheless, her posts are informative and interesting, so I appreciate what she’s contributed here and I am sure she is a good pilot. Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2018, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/49 "2018-04-19T03:09:40Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > Uh yeah. Umm… If the top half of her torso went through the window. I very much doubt that two guys could pull her back in. Not that just her head and perhaps and arm and shoulder didn’t go through. > > Not that it really matters. People explain things wrong under high :eek: stress situations. And reporters sometimes use the wrong words. Apparently, she was wearing her seatbelt at the time. While the initial difference in pressure might have sucked her (partially) out the window, after a brief time the pressure would equalize and make it easier/possible to pull her back in. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2018, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/50 "2018-04-19T04:50:19Z")
It looks like she died from the shrapnel. [Cite](https://www.yahoo.com/news/woman-partially-sucked-plane-died-234304816.html) > [@](#): > > An airline passenger who was killed Tuesday when an engine explosion caused a window to break died of blunt impact trauma to her head, neck and torso, according to the Philadelphia medical examiner. When they pulled her back in they noted lots of blood. She was just in the wrong place at the wrong time. The universe is so fucking random, isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2018, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/51 "2018-04-19T05:39:57Z")
An airline insider told me today that South West has their maintenance done in Brazil. They also have had at least 3 other engines fail in the same manner in the last six months. There were no injuries so it was not a media event. Many airlines outsource their maintenance to foreign countries. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2018, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/52 "2018-04-19T06:01:46Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > It looks like she died from the shrapnel. > > [Cite](https://www.yahoo.com/news/woman-partially-sucked-plane-died-234304816.html) > When they pulled her back in they noted lots of blood. She was just in the wrong place at the wrong time. > The universe is so fucking random, isn’t it? What a horrific nightmare. I was wondering what the specific cause of death was and had not heard she’s actually been hit. If it were me, I’d be having a heart attack if I suddenly started getting whooshed out of a plamne’s window. ---
**Author:** ![gotpasswords](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c57346/32.png) [@gotpasswords](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gotpasswords)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2018, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/53 "2018-04-19T06:58:36Z")
> [@GusNSpot](#): > > An airline insider told me today that South West has their maintenance done in Brazil. > They also have had at least 3 other engines fail in the same manner in the last six months. There were no injuries so it was not a media event. > > Many airlines outsource their maintenance to foreign countries. General Electric has an MRO facility in Brazil, but Southwest has actually pulled back a lot of its engine maintenance business from there to the US because the logistics of shipping engines many thousands of miles away is challenging and expensive. They don’t have aircraft that can go that distance without a refueling stop or two, so the idea of flying WN airplanes to Brazil for maintenance is a bit loony. They do, however, often fly planes to El Salvador for heavy maintenance where the plane is pretty much stripped down to the last bolt, everything is cleaned and inspected, and a rebuilt airplane emerges. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2018, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/54 "2018-04-19T13:28:47Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > Uh yeah. Umm… If the top half of her torso went through the window. I very much doubt that two guys could pull her back in. Not that just her head and perhaps and arm and shoulder didn’t go through. If she broke most of the bones in the upper 1/3 of her body while being rammed through the window hole, then it would be somewhat easier to bring her back in. As to her cause of death, the ME has indicated blunt impact trauma. This could be from direct impact by engine debris or the polycarbonate window pane - or it could be from when her body was crammed through the window opening by the pressure differential. Thinking of the surface area of the window , that’s hundreds of pounds of force trying to extrude her outward through that hole. There’s also the flail injuries that she probable suffered while being battered against the exterior of the plane by the slipstream. ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2018, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/55 "2018-04-19T14:26:38Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > That’s too bad for the deceased. **Also, Southwest can no longer claim to have never lost a passenger**. I’m just glad the plane landed safely and only a few people were injured. I’m sure that was terrifying. (My bolding) What a horrible thing to say as the first answer on this thread. Was “_ha, ha, you have to change your ads_” the best thing you could say? ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2018, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/56 "2018-04-19T14:43:56Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > O[sub]2[/sub] masks. [You’re doing them wrong.](https://s.yimg.com/lo/api/res/1.2/lJXCe_RL0O_lRKyIV5gNNg--/YXBwaWQ9eW15O3c9NjA4O3E9NzU7c209MTtpbD1wbGFuZQ--/https://s.abcnews.com/images/US/southwest-passengers-masks-ht-ps-180417_hpEmbed_4x3_608.jpg) I think this is a point airlines have to ram into their passengers from now on. I’m surprised at the number of people wearing them incorrectly over their mouths. ([video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F5KSFe9vFdY)) I would’ve never thought about NOT putting them over my nose and mouth. I know people who have flown a lot don’t pay attention to the instructions, but mask-over-nos-and-mouth was never a thing a considered a problem. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2018, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/57 "2018-04-19T14:46:41Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > Uh yeah. Umm… If the top half of her torso went through the window. I very much doubt that two guys could pull her back in. Not that just her head and perhaps and arm and shoulder didn’t go through. > > Not that it really matters. People explain things wrong under high :eek: stress situations. And reporters sometimes use the wrong words. The pressure pulling her out would have decreased rapidly. Both because of the plane itself depressurizing, and because the pilot was descending rapidly to lower altitude. Anyway, [here is a pilot of a 737-800](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EzkfYj6SBxo), a very similar plane, discussing his thoughts. He doesn’t go into much speculation as to the cause of the engine failure, but more talks about the training and how the flight crew would have responded to the emergency. I thought it was interesting (But I’ve also been following his channel for quite a while.) ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2018, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/58 "2018-04-19T15:22:59Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > (My bolding) > What a horrible thing to say as the first answer on this thread. Was “_ha, ha, you have to change your ads_” the best thing you could say? No, it’s more that they were one of the very few airlines in the world who had an impeccable safety record in that area, which is an accomplishment. This was actually broken a few years ago during when a plane overran the end of a runway and killed a kid in a passing car, but now they’ve actually lost a passenger. It’s tragic. It’s the loss of a something that can’t be regained. It’s small against the loss of a human being, a mother, a wife, a daughter, somebody clearly loved and cherished, but it’s still a loss. No one involved in an airline, especially not the front-line flight staff, wants to see anyone hurt, much less killed. It will also make some people wonder if the airline has gotten slack on safety when really it’s just much more likely that it’s the fact that the world isn’t safe and can’t be made 100% safe catching up with them. The _point_ of an airline is to deliver people safely from point A to point B and they failed this time. Doesn’t matter if it was some human at fault or just the sort of unforeseeable stupid shit that happens sometimes, it will still feel like failure to those involved. While the flight crew will not grieve as Riordan’s family is grieving they will still grieve, as will the passengers around her who watched her die, and the passengers who tried to save her, and the pilot herself has stated her feelings about the woman who died on her flight. Sure, Shulz saved over a hundred lives that day, but she also lost one and I’m sure that weighs on her. It’s not about ads. It’s about how human loss affects those around the loss. ---
**Author:** ![WildBlueYonder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ce7236/32.png) [@WildBlueYonder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WildBlueYonder)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2018, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/59 "2018-04-19T17:11:47Z")
Do you suppose that anyone on that flight will ever fly again? I would have PTSD with dreams of being sucked out the window! Does anyone “hear” lawsuit? I read where, of course that info may have changed, that the engine/blade failure (forgot the word they used) that it was not easy to see/inspect the weakness. Um. Yeah. Its way past time to figure out how to inspect the area better! ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2018, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600/60 "2018-04-19T17:21:39Z")
> [@WildBlueYonder](#): > > Do you suppose that anyone on that flight will ever fly again? Yes, I expect they will. Some won’t, but I expect most will. I was on a flight in the 1980’s that had a birdstrike on an engine after take-off, with jerking, banging, bits of the engine falling off, smoke… Yes, it was damn scary. No, I didn’t fly again for awhile. But not only did I fly again I also took flight lessons and earned a pilot’s license. It’s a bit like asking if someone will ever get into a car again after a bad accident. We sort of expect they would, no matter how bad the car crash. > [@](#): > > I read where, of course that info may have changed, that the engine/blade failure (forgot the word they used) that it was not easy to see/inspect the weakness. Um. Yeah. Its way past time to figure out how to inspect the area better! What makes you think no one has been trying to do just that? When visual inspection won’t work there are techniques like x-raying the part to identify weaknesses and damage, and probably all sorts of tests I don’t know about other than such parts are subjected to a lot of testing. Sometimes, even if we want something we don’t get it. Finding fatigue cracks and other damage in a large, complicated machine like a jet engine is not easy or simple. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-news-sw-flight-engine-failure-1-dead/812600.md?page=4)