# Breaking: Ukrainian 737 Crashes in Iran. Possibly Shot Down. 160-180 Dead. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [January 8, 2020, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111 "2020-01-08T06:33:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/1 "2020-01-08T06:33:13Z")
> [@](#): > > A passenger plane carrying at least 160 people bound for the Ukrainian capital Kiev has crashed a few minutes after taking off from Tehran’s main international airport. > > Iran’s Red Crescent has said there was no chance of finding survivors, and Pir Hossein Kulivand, an Iranian emergency official, later told state TV all those on board were killed in the crash. > **[Iran crash: Ukraine Boeing with 176 onboard comes down near Tehran](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jan/08/iran-plane-crash-ukraine-boeing-180-tehran)** > > Iranians, Canadians, Ukrainians, Swedes, Afghans, Germans and three Britons killed in crash, reports say Pprune Discussion suggests it was shot down, like MH117, with this photo showing possible surface to air missile warhead fragmentation damage: [![](https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1000x750/enu98kpu8amdzka_4cee5d74f48dc8f8292257cc991d85566e6d3ebe.jpg) ](https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1000x750/enu98kpu8amdzka_4cee5d74f48dc8f8292257cc991d85566e6d3ebe.jpg) > **[Ukrainian Aircraft down in Iran - PPRuNe Forums](https://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/628650-ukrainian-aircraft-down-iran.html)** > > Rumours & News - Ukrainian Aircraft down in Iran - ISNA are reporting as per title. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 6:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/2 "2020-01-08T06:52:23Z")
Almost certain it was shot down by nervous Iranian ADA. Way too much of a coincidence. ---
**Author:** ![RioRico](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f04885/32.png) [@RioRico](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RioRico)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 8:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/3 "2020-01-08T08:21:32Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > Almost certain it was shot down by nervous Iranian ADA. Way too much of a coincidence. Okay, I’ll bite. Why would Iranian ADA shoot down a passenger jet LEAVING Tehran? I can understand nervousness about incoming flights, but departing? Not that fuckups don’t happen and yes, they’re likely more common than are deliberately evil acts. But the passenger list might be interesting. Was someone targeted by domestic or foreign foes? ---
**Author:** ![RioRico](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f04885/32.png) [@RioRico](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RioRico)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 8:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/4 "2020-01-08T08:59:57Z")
Followup from Interfax-Ukraine via [Kyiv Post](https://www.kyivpost.com/ukraine-politics/ukrainian-embassy-terror-attack-currently-ruled-out-as-reason-for-boeing-crash.html?cn-reloaded=1). > [@](#): > > **Ukrainian Embassy: Terror attack currently ruled out as reason for Boeing crash** > “According to preliminary information, the plane crashed as a result of an engine failure due to a technical error. A terror attack is currently ruled out,” the Ukrainian Embassy in Iran said on its website on Jan. 8 Technical error. Bad day to be a Boeing stockholder. Worse to have been on the plane, of course. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 11:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/5 "2020-01-08T11:20:55Z")
Some OSINT types are saying that Iranian sources are saying that the plane was told to take off ASAP and that some pre flight procedures might have been skipped. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/6 "2020-01-08T12:17:03Z")
> [@RioRico](#): > > Technical error. Bad day to be a Boeing stockholder. Worse to have been on the plane, of course. Doesn’t “technical error” require weeks of study/investigation to conclude? ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/7 "2020-01-08T12:21:50Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Doesn’t “technical error” require weeks of study/investigation to conclude? I believe that’s when determining if it was pilot error or equipment malfunction. I would expect it to be easier to see if the crash was caused by something internal vs. external. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/8 "2020-01-08T14:10:56Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Some OSINT types are saying that Iranian sources are saying that the plane was told to take off ASAP and that some pre flight procedures might have been skipped. What is OSINT? ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/9 "2020-01-08T14:16:27Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > What is OSINT? [Open Source Intelligence](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open-source_intelligence). ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stainless_steel_rat/32/5727_2.png) [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stainless_Steel_Rat)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/10 "2020-01-08T14:40:27Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Doesn’t “technical error” require weeks of study/investigation to conclude? While speculation that it was shot down can begin before the wreckage is professionally examined (see the OP). I wonder if Boeing reps will be allowed into Iran to help with the investigation, since it was a Boeing aircraft. Maybe Boeing experts from Europe, doubt any US folks would be admitted. Right now we no nothing for certain. Time will tell. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/11 "2020-01-08T15:17:46Z")
Slightly curious (my bolding): > [@the Guardian](#): > > Victims of the crash included 82 Iranians, **63 Canadians** , 11 Ukrainians, 10 Swedes, four Afghans, three Germans and three Britons, according to Ukraine’s foreign minister, Vadym Prystaiko. Seems like a lot of Canadians for one Ukrainian flight. Evacuating Tehran by any available transport, I guess. ---
**Author:** ![Hermitian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hermitian/32/470_2.png) [@Hermitian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hermitian)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/12 "2020-01-08T15:23:13Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Doesn’t “technical error” require weeks of study/investigation to conclude? Only if you are doing a proper investigation. ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@Dead\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Cat)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/13 "2020-01-08T15:30:08Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Doesn’t “technical error” require weeks of study/investigation to conclude? Sure, but that won’t stop markets/traders reacting immediately to what may (or may not) be another Boeing problem. I wouldn’t be at all surprised if Boeing shares [del]crash[/del] [del]dive[/del] [del]fall[/del] er, decrease in value today, and if/when an official investigation is published many weeks/months from now, they stay at a similar level if Boeing hardware is confirmed as the problem (because this is already priced in), or rise sharply if not. This is a highly simplified model, of course. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/14 "2020-01-08T15:33:21Z")
Ukraine has deleted their post about mechanical failure - [https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/iran-plane-crash-missile-strike-ukraine-engine-cause-boeing-a9274721.html](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/iran-plane-crash-missile-strike-ukraine-engine-cause-boeing-a9274721.html) ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/15 "2020-01-08T15:39:08Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > Seems like a lot of Canadians for one Ukrainian flight. Evacuating Tehran by any available transport, I guess. Perhaps, but more likely Iranian-Canadian students on their way back to universities after spending the holiday with their families. ---
**Author:** ![Pedro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/919ad9/32.png) [@Pedro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pedro)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/16 "2020-01-08T15:40:55Z")
I was ready to discount the possibility of attack on the plane until I saw the pictures that appear to show fragmentation damage on almost every picture of the plane’s fuselage. Weird that an official source would be so quick to claim “engine failure” as the cause, mere hours after the accident. Seems they are already rolling back on that statement. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/17 "2020-01-08T15:44:08Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > Slightly curious (my bolding): > > Seems like a lot of Canadians for one Ukrainian flight. Evacuating Tehran by any available transport, I guess. From the Globe and Mail: > [@](#): > > Canada broke off diplomatic relations with Iran in 2012. There are no direct flights between Canada and Iran, which means passengers need to use connecting flights. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stainless_steel_rat/32/5727_2.png) [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stainless_Steel_Rat)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/18 "2020-01-08T15:45:05Z")
The reference in post #14 said it was a 3-year old 737-800. NOT the same as the two crashed Boeing MAX 8 aircraft, but people may jump (nay, leap) to that conclusion. Good time to pick up Boeing stock later in the day, if you have the sensibilities of a stockbroker. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/19 "2020-01-08T15:50:06Z")
> [@RioRico](#): > > Okay, I’ll bite. Why would Iranian ADA shoot down a passenger jet LEAVING Tehran? I can understand nervousness about incoming flights, but departing? Not that fuckups don’t happen and yes, they’re likely more common than are deliberately evil acts. But the passenger list might be interesting. Was someone targeted by domestic or foreign foes? Systems like the CRAM that we use track and fire on threats that are moving too fast for a human to act on. I suspect Iran activated whatever system they had and one guy put his battery on active instead of passive mode. Or something similar. I believe in coincidences but a plane going down just as Iran starts offensive operations plus a not very subtle coverup? > [@AK84](#): > > Some OSINT types are saying that Iranian sources are saying that the plane was told to take off ASAP and that some pre flight procedures might have been skipped. Whatever part of the checklist keeps the plane from plummeting to earth in a fireball should be written in red and circled. “DO NOT SKIP.” ---
**Author:** ![Hermitian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hermitian/32/470_2.png) [@Hermitian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hermitian)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2020, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111/20 "2020-01-08T16:23:58Z")
I am shocked that the first thing out of their lips isn’t “The US did this!” It wouldn’t be hard to believe either. US bases were getting rained on by missiles, us firing at things that are flying is not beyond belief. Besides, it is not like something [like that](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655) has never happened before… [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breaking-ukrainian-737-crashes-in-iran-possibly-shot-down-160-180-dead/846111.md?page=2)