# Breast-feeding and Homesexuality. Grow Up! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 22, 2003, 8:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648 "2003-11-22T08:00:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Nobody](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/94ad74/32.png) [@Nobody](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nobody)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2003, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/81 "2003-11-24T13:54:05Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Diogenes the Cynic \* > \*\*If you can’t understand why an attitude is cretinous then I can’t explain it to you. \*\* Oh, so you’re saying that you can’t explain why you feel that way about it, OK, fair enough then. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2003, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/82 "2003-11-24T14:04:50Z")
**Lelevencfr** , let’s hear an explanation of this principle of yours. How many people need to be offended by saomething before it’s officially rude? At what point does your being demonstrably offended itself become rude? I, for example, might be offended by folks with bad skin. Shall I ask such folks not to come to restaurants while I’m eating there? Or I might be offended by women not wearing head scarves, or I might be offended by people who talk about politics at the next table over, or I might be offended about people who eat meat. Surely you’ll agree that nobody needs to take my hypersensitive ass into consideration when deciding whether to wear a head scarf, discuss politics, or eat meat at a restaurant. If I go up to someone who’s ordered a steak at a fancy restaurant and say, “I’m sorry, but I hate watching people eat the flesh of dead, factory-farmed animals; would you mind ordering a salad instead?” they’ve got every right to tell me to fuck off. And if they tell me to fuck off, they’re not being inconsiderate selfish boors; rather, they’re justifiably ignoring a stupid and rude request. Near as I can tell, that’s what a breastfeeding woman does when she ignores someone’s request for her not to breastfeed at a restaurant. The person making the request is being stupid and rude. Even, I’d say, stupider and ruder than the anti-steak person, since the latter is at least motivated (however misguided) by an ethical concern, whereas the anti-breastfeeder is motivated by at best an aesthetic concern. Explain to me what you see as the difference between these two. And try real hard not to be such a self-righteous smarmy prat: your OP makes you sound like an utter ass. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![L11CFR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9f8e36/32.png) [@L11CFR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/L11CFR)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2003, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/83 "2003-11-24T14:58:55Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Left Hand of Dorkness \* > > I, for example, might be offended by folks with bad skin. Now you’re being silly - they can’t change that. > [@](#): > > I might be offended by people who talk about politics at the next table over If I was discussing something really gross and someone asked me to keep my voice down/change the subject - it then falls to me to decide a) if its a valid request and b) how much inconvenience to me would it be to maintain harmony and change the subject even if it isn’t a ‘valid’ request in that I am legally entitled to talk about the autopsy I performed earlier on the body found floating in the river after 6 weeks. If you asked the waiter to come over and ask me that - even if I wasn’t discussing something gross **I sure as hell wouldn’t ask for an apology from the restaurant!!** I wouldn’t bleat on about my rights under (apologies to any Americans/lawyers if I get this next bit wrong) the first Amendment. At the risk of sounding like an utter ass :dubious: I think the woman in this example is the problem. Yes she has every right to breastfeed. Yes she can do it where she wants. No society shouldn’t have a problem with it. But she, like _Equipose_ obviouslt believes its somebody else’s problem™ (Credit to Douglas Adams on this one) and there is no need for her to even consider the fact that it has obviously upset someone and can she reach a compromise. And I’ll bet a $1 to .01c that there were others who were uncomfortable but didn’t say anything. Do something in a public place and you should take into account the views of the public. Some of them aren’t going to like me talking about weighing peoples brains whilst I’m in a restaurant but rather than do it _because legally I can_ I choose not to. > [@](#): > > And if they tell me to fuck off, they’re not being inconsiderate selfish boors; Then they’re being rude. > [@](#): > > rather, they’re justifiably ignoring a stupid and rude request. In _their_ opinion! To the one that asked the question (in this example you) it was a reasonable request. That’s a lot of the problem - people who have different views **must** have stupid views. Since I’m probably not on your Xmas card list anyway - its people like you who dismiss other viewpoints as rude or stupid that help breed the intolerance. Of course I’ll take that back if your post was _purely_ hypothetical 😃 > [@](#): > > Near as I can tell, that’s what a breastfeeding woman does when she ignores someone’s request for her not to breastfeed at a restaurant. The person making the request is being stupid and rude. Why is it stupid and rude? Is it because they don’t agree with you? Did they wander over and shout at her? How was the request phrased to make it rude? > [@](#): > > And try real hard not to be such a self-righteous smarmy prat: your OP makes you sound like an utter ass. > > Daniel \*\* Is that better? ---
**Author:** ![CairaJade](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f04885/32.png) [@CairaJade](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairaJade)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2003, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/84 "2003-11-24T15:50:09Z")
> [@](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > Originally posted by CairaJade > > … The delivery method is different, but they are both food. Whether it’s eaten from a fork or a nipple, neither belong in the bathroom. … > > if that’s the case then BK has the right to ask the mother to take it elsewhere since it would be considered ‘outside food’ Would that apply to feeding a baby formula out of a bottle, or a jar of baby food as well? Fortunatly, even though BK’s policy may be “no outside food,” their policy is overridden by federal law saying that she can. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2003, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/85 "2003-11-24T15:57:35Z")
Better, kiddo, but still not there yet. Note that you changed my hypothetical from discussing politics to discussing brains. Why? Why don’t you answer my question as asked? Is it because when it’s discussing the local city council election you personally don’t consider it “really gross,” and you consider breastfeeding to be “really gross,” and you can’t step outside your own worldview enough to see that other people may have a different aesthetic than you? Obviously, different people have different opinions. Here’s the thing, though: **I’m not required to take everyone’s opinions into consideration**. Or, rather, I’m perfectly justified in ignoring stupid opinions and ridiculous requests. Do I judge what constitutes a stupid opinion and a ridiculous request? Of course I do! Who else could make that judgment for me? Note, however, that I do try to base my judgments on facts, on context, on social mores; nobody has advanced an interesting or sound argument in favor of the idea that requesting private breastfeeding is a non-rude act. Note the weird self-referential aspect of your argument: you say the problem is the idea that “people who have different views must have stupid views.” And yet in your OP, you lambast people whose view is that they needn’t worry about those who dislike public breastfeeding. Their view is different from yours; how do you respond to that difference? By insulting them and being generally nasty to them. Practicing what you preach is a generally wise idea. Daniel ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2003, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/86 "2003-11-24T16:02:17Z")
> [@](#): > > In their opinion! To the one that asked the question (in this example you) it was a reasonable request. That’s a lot of the problem - people who have different views must have stupid views. Since I’m probably not on your Xmas card list anyway - its people like you who dismiss other viewpoints as rude or stupid that help breed the intolerance. Of course I’ll take that back if your post was purely hypothetical Wrong, fucktard. The uptight fuckhead with the titty hangup is being rude by demanding that a mother not feed her baby. The fuckhead’s “views” are completely irrelevant and worthless is this situation. It’s akin to saying that interracial couples should not go out in public because they might offend racists. There is nothing offensive or inappropriate about breastfeeding. Any notion that it _is_ inappropriate comes from maladapative social conditioning and not from any legitimate or rational sensibility. You don’t like seeing a booby? Here’s a clue, moron…DON"T FUCKING STARE AT IT!!! ---
**Author:** ![Nobody](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/94ad74/32.png) [@Nobody](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nobody)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/87 "2003-11-25T00:05:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Farmwoman \* > \*\*Oh, but you _are_. > > There is one thing and only one thing that will normalize breastfeeding again…public and otherwise. Simply put: > more women will have to be willing to suffer the assholes and just do it. \*\* Uhm, sorry but being a total stranger, you **don’t** know me better than myself. When I say that I’m not opposed to breast-feeding becomming more acceptable, I mean it. And apparently you didn’t read much of what I wrote. I said that I would **never** tell a breast-feeding woman to stop or take it elsewhere. I also said that as long as the woman is being descrete, then I don’t see a problem. ---
**Author:** ![Nobody](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/94ad74/32.png) [@Nobody](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nobody)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/88 "2003-11-25T00:08:15Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Dryga\_Yes \* > \*\*Because babies are the cutest thing ever, and breasts are pretty damn cute too, and because I can’t understand any other kind of reaction to seeing someone breastfeeding other than “Aww. That’s sweet.” 🙂 \*\* While I’m not repulsed by a woman descretely breast-feeding her baby, I wouldn’t say that others who do are cretens. I’d say that they’re more, misguided. But that’s just my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Nobody](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/94ad74/32.png) [@Nobody](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nobody)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/89 "2003-11-25T00:11:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Soup\_du\_jour \* > \*\*Oh, and **Joel**. “Res ipsa loquitor” means “The thing speaks for itself,” meaning that the explaination seems self-evident. For instance… > > A: “Joe punched my grandmother in the stomach today for no good reason. What a jerk!” > B: “Why does that make him a jerk?” > A: “Res ipsa loquitor.” \*\* Thanks, but I do know the literal translation, but felt that he was implying that I was one too. Actually, after my reply to him, I thought it over and realized that I may have been reading more into his post than what he ment. My mistake. ---
**Author:** ![Ms2001](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ms2001/32/18463_2.png) [@Ms2001](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ms2001)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/90 "2003-11-25T01:18:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by CairaJade \* > **Fortunatly, even though BK’s policy may be “no outside food,” their policy is overridden by federal law saying that she can. 🙂** _Federal_ law? I must have missed something. What federal law gives her the right to breastfeed in a Burger King? ---
**Author:** ![easy\_e](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/eb8c5e/32.png) [@easy\_e](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/easy_e)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/91 "2003-11-25T01:21:40Z")
I just have a disconnect about the whole thing. Here’s my line of thinking: Toddlers and adults use utensils, hands, and mouths to eat. That’s what they’re there for. People who have one of a variety of heath problems have NG tubes to help them eat. That’s what they’re there for. Women who have recently given birth have these things called breasts that dispense a nutritious substance to their children. Despite their aesthetic value or fun in other ways, their primary purpose is to feed their children. I don’t expect people to wear long veils over their faces to hide their mastication (though it would be nice for the people who haven’t grasped the concept of chewing with their mouths closed). I don’t expect people with NG tubes who are out for a special occasion to be banished to the bathroom. So why should nursing mothers have to do that? My stepmother nursed my brother for quite a while (couple years, I think). I was 11-12 at the time, and although at first I was a bit uncomfortable (mostly 'cause I was a clueless kid who didn’t know what to do), I got over it really quickly. When I see other nursing mothers, it’s no big deal. I just honestly do not understand what is the problem with some of the anti-breastfeeding in public posters. ---
**Author:** ![Lilairen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8491ac/32.png) [@Lilairen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lilairen)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/92 "2003-11-25T01:40:06Z")
I am fairly certain that the vast majority of nursing mothers will have no difficulty being discrete, though I suspect that there will be a few with psychological issues such that they cannot conceptualise themselves as distinct individuals. ---
**Author:** ![whiterabbit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/cab0a1/32.png) [@whiterabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whiterabbit)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/93 "2003-11-25T03:16:47Z")
[hijack] It’s spelled DISCREET! Please, everybody. This one isn’t all that hard. [/hijack] I don’t understand what anti-breastfeeding people are going on about, since babies have to eat. It’s that simple. Whatever other functions a breast has, that’s the main one. ---
**Author:** ![wolfstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d6d6ee/32.png) [@wolfstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfstu)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/94 "2003-11-25T04:05:00Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by whiterabbit \* > **[hijack] It’s spelled DISCREET! Please, everybody. This one isn’t all that hard. [/hijack]** I honestly read the post above yours as **Lilairen** suggesting that certain mothers would separate themselves from the collective, uniform standards of society; that they acted as they did because they behaved independently. "[Discrete"](http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=discrete) But I guess the [other way](http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=discrete) makes sense, too. ---
**Author:** ![wolfstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d6d6ee/32.png) [@wolfstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfstu)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/95 "2003-11-25T04:07:00Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by wolfstu \* > \*\*I honestly read the post above yours as **Lilairen** suggesting that certain mothers would separate themselves from the collective, uniform standards of society; that they acted as they did because they behaved independently. \*\* Then again, stu, maybe that’s _exactly the joke she was making_.:o ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/96 "2003-11-25T05:02:55Z")
> [@](#): > > Wrong, fucktard. The uptight fuckhead with the titty hangup is being rude by demanding that a mother not feed her baby. The fuckhead’s “views” are completely irrelevant and worthless is this situation. It’s akin to saying that interracial couples should not go out in public because they might offend racists. > > There is nothing offensive or inappropriate about breastfeeding. Any notion that it is inappropriate comes from maladapative social conditioning and not from any legitimate or rational sensibility. > > You don’t like seeing a booby? Here’s a clue, moron…DON"T FUCKING STARE AT IT!!! While I’m a strong opponent of the “right not to be offended” I also don’t think that mothers breastfeeding should get special treatment, in some way deciding that one boob display is for a “better” or more virtuous purpose than another. Either topless boobs are okay in public all the time, or not. ---
**Author:** ![calm\_kiwi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9fc348/32.png) [@calm\_kiwi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/calm_kiwi)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/97 "2003-11-25T05:23:38Z")
Breast feeding boobs are not topless! They generaly have a nipple flashed for a minute till baby attaches. The whole boob is not flashed about with gay abandon nor are both boobs flashes at all. ---
**Author:** ![CairaJade](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f04885/32.png) [@CairaJade](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairaJade)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/98 "2003-11-25T05:34:06Z")
(If I knew how to use the smilies, I’d do the one smacking itself in the forhead) Sorry, not federal law. State law in 38 states. Typing too fast and making stupid mistakes, yet again. ---
**Author:** ![whiterabbit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/cab0a1/32.png) [@whiterabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whiterabbit)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/99 "2003-11-25T12:49:57Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by wolfstu \* > \*\*I honestly read the post above yours as **Lilairen** suggesting that certain mothers would separate themselves from the collective, uniform standards of society; that they acted as they did because they behaved independently. "[Discrete"](http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=discrete) > > But I guess the [other way](http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=discrete) makes sense, too. \*\* I’ve seen a couple of other versions of it in this thread. I try not to be a spelling nazi, but occasionally I just can’t stand it. ---
**Author:** ![Hamadryad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/6de8d8/32.png) [@Hamadryad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamadryad)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2003, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648/100 "2003-11-25T13:14:33Z")
When a woman has a baby and elects to breastfeed, in very short order her breast ceases to have erotic connotations for her. I started to call mine “flesh-colored feedbags.” When I’d whip out a tit (read: expose enough of it for the baby to latch on to nipple and not sweatshirt), it never crossed my mind that I was making a public erotic display. I was feeding the baby. This is the best essay I have ever seen on breastfeeding. [www.hipmama.com/features/gwenbreast.html+gwen+breast+trailer+trash+page&hl=en&ie=UTF-8](http://216.239.39.104/search?q=cache:5oxQCpWExjwJ:%5Burl)"]I had to find it cached on Google. > [@](#): > > Say it in your mind. “That is not a sex breast. That is a food breast. That food breast is not for me. There is no need for me to get excited. Now I will turn my face the other way.” Good stuff. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/breast-feeding-and-homesexuality-grow-up/214648.md?page=6)