# Brian Flores lawsuit **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Tags:** football-nfl\ **Created:** [February 2, 2022, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804 "2022-02-02T16:11:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![StraightTalk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/straighttalk/32/9982_2.png) [@StraightTalk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StraightTalk)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2022, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/1 "2022-02-02T16:11:46Z")
I don’t really follow football but can anyone educate me on if there really is anything to this lawsuit? > **[Flores sues NFL, teams, alleges racism in hiring](https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/33194862/brian-flores-sues-nfl-others-former-miami-dolphins-coach-alleges-racism-hiring-practices)** > > Among Brian Flores' allegations: Dolphins owner Stephen Ross offered him $100K for every loss in 2019 to help with draft position and the Giants conducted a "sham" in-person interview with him to comply with the Rooney Rule after deciding on Brian... ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2022, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/2 "2022-02-02T16:53:24Z")
We’ve been discussing here: [2022 NFL coaching carousel - #116 by Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2022-nfl-coaching-carousel/957096/116) but basis summary is this: 1. Teams are required to interview two minority candidates when hiring a head coach (Rooney Rule) 2. It’s a frequent comment whenever a minority coach is being interviewed that it’s just to meet the Rooney Rule. 3. Flores was going to interview with the Giants 4. He found out two days before the interview that the Giants were set on hiring another coach, meaning his interview was just a sham to meet to the Rooney Rule. ---
**Author:** ![SpacemanSpiff\_II](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e19adc/32.png) [@SpacemanSpiff\_II](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpacemanSpiff_II)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2022, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/3 "2022-02-02T20:23:13Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > We’ve been discussing here: [2022 NFL coaching carousel - #115 by Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/2022-nfl-coaching-carousel/957096/116) but basis summary is this: I don’t see how that could be the legal basis for a lawsuit. The Rooney Rule is an NFL rule binding on the owners, but I don’t see how that would give any potential employees a contractual or legal right to be seriously considered. At most, he could perhaps sue for the team wasting his time by conducting a phony interview, but how much could he get in damages for that? ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2022, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/4 "2022-02-02T20:41:30Z")
> [@SpacemanSpiff\_II](#): > > I don’t see how that could be the legal basis for a lawsuit. There’s more to it than that. The lawsuit also alleges retaliation against him for refusing to tank; in other words, he was fired (in part) for doing his job. I suspect that might be a contract violation of some sort. > [@SpacemanSpiff\_II](#): > > At most, he could perhaps sue for the team wasting his time by conducting a phony interview, but how much could he get in damages for that? I don’t know that he is expecting any money but by including that in the lawsuit he’s publicizing it. After all, **we** are talking about it. > In the lawsuit, Wigdor Law LLP, the firm representing Flores, said the coach hopes to “shine a light on the racial injustices that take place inside the NFL.” Whatever the result of the suit, he is succeeding in that right now. He might be trying to stand up for civil rights, he might be trying to make the NFL better, he might be a pissed-off guy looking for revenge. Probably all three. ---
**Author:** ![SpacemanSpiff\_II](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e19adc/32.png) [@SpacemanSpiff\_II](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpacemanSpiff_II)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2022, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/5 "2022-02-02T20:45:00Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > There’s more to it than that. The lawsuit also alleges retaliation against him for refusing to tank; in other words, he was fired (in part) for doing his job. I suspect that might be a contract violation of some sort. Very possible. (I was aware that there are other issues involved.) The title of this thread is “Brian Flores lawsuit” and the post I responded to said “basis [sic] summary is this”. I was responding to that. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2022, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/6 "2022-02-02T20:49:37Z")
I can’t say that there is legal merit to the suit, but the Giants should be taken to task for transparently violating the Rooney Rule. Frankly, given the closeness of the Mara and Rooney families, John Mara should be personally ashamed for crapping on the legacy of Dan Rooney. What really shouldn’t be an aside is the allegations of tanking. If there’s a sniff of truth to this, actually encouraging someone on the field to lose the game, whomever made that offer needs to be gone, forever. This isn’t putting the scrubs in to give them playing time, it isn’t trading away your best player for future draft picks, it’s trying to lose. Trying to lose is a hard no, an absolutely forbidden concept in my book. You can not care if you win or lose, but you can’t go into a game with the intent to lose. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2022, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/7 "2022-02-02T20:53:16Z")
The bigger issue in this isn’t the Rooney Rule (which is terribly implemented but well-intentioned), it’s the pay-to-lose stuff. If Flores can prove those allegations, the Dolphins should be in a HUGE heap of trouble. Like Pete Rose level trouble where ownership should be forced to sell. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2022, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/8 "2022-02-02T20:54:38Z")
> [@SpacemanSpiff\_II](#): > > The title of this thread is “Brian Flores lawsuit” and the post I responded to said “basis [sic] summary is this”. I was responding to that. True, that summary was only part of the picture. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2022, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/9 "2022-02-02T22:38:18Z")
With Hue Jackson’s allegation that he was offered money to lose by Haslam, if he can prove it as he says, this could destroy the NFL. And this is what happens when gambling becomes pervasive, and why they fought so hard to keep it at arm’s length in all sports before inexplicably jumping in bed with the gambling industry. The end of professional sports is when people no longer believe that the games have integrity. If they think it’s fixed then it becomes professional wrestling, and then it’s no longer sport, it’s a macho soap opera. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2022, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/10 "2022-02-02T22:43:05Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > if he can prove it as he says, this could destroy the NFL. Only if they can connect pay-to-lose with a bookie, or a big payout with someone in the know. But heads need to roll regardless. It’s a BIG deal. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2022, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/11 "2022-02-02T23:13:43Z")
I don’t think the pay-to-lose allegation was related to gambling. It sounded like it was about getting a better draft pick. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2022, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/12 "2022-02-02T23:15:41Z")
Absolutely. But it’s a huge deal even without any gambling implications. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2022, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/13 "2022-02-02T23:15:44Z")
It will be interesting to see if Belichick backs him up. ---
**Author:** ![lum\_s\_husband](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lum_s_husband/32/3698_2.png) [@lum\_s\_husband](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lum_s_husband)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2022, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/14 "2022-02-02T23:47:28Z")
The question is: does the NFL recognize that this can threaten _all_ their money? ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2022, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/15 "2022-02-03T00:16:25Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > I don’t think the pay-to-lose allegation was related to gambling. It sounded like it was about getting a better draft pick. That’s the case with both Jackson and Flores. …then again, isn’t the draft always a gamble? 🕶 ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2022, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/16 "2022-02-03T00:46:37Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > …then again, isn’t the draft always a gamble? 🕶 Yeah, that’s “healthy” gambling, like “will this draft pick pan out,” and “give us all your money through these sports books.” It would be much easier if this was about gambling on games - that leaves a trail that’s impossible to hide. I’d be surprised if either Haslam or Ross was dumb enough to leave a documented trail of payments to tank. Then again, I really shouldn’t be surprised by how dumb rich people can be when they think the rules don’t apply to them. I hope they find something. The old boys’ club could really use a thorough cleaning. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2022, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/17 "2022-02-03T13:53:06Z")
Tanking isn’t prohibited because it’s tied to insiders gambling. Insiders gambling is prohibited because it’s tied to tanking. If he can prove in the court of public opinion that there were payments to lose games, then the NFL is done for. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2022, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/18 "2022-02-03T14:00:47Z")
Yeah, if true, this isn’t just a Pete Rose level scandal. It’s a “Black Sox” level scandal ---
**Author:** ![Uncle\_Jocko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uncle_jocko/32/2932_2.png) [@Uncle\_Jocko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uncle_Jocko)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2022, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/19 "2022-02-03T14:02:40Z")
I realize you can doctor up and fake any image on the internet these days, but I saw screenshots of what was purported to be the text discussion between Flores and Belichick. Basically, Belichick sent a text saying he’d heard good news about the Giants wanting to hire the coach he was texting, which got Flores very excited … until Flores sent back a text saying, “Do you think you’re talking to Brian Flores or Brian Daboll?” And then Belichick realized he was texting the wrong Brian. Even NFL head coaches get confused with their text threads, I guess. And yes, the most earthshaking part of the allegations is about the tanking, and the owner’s offer of cash for losing games. With both Flores and Jackson saying much the same thing about their former teams, this will cause shock waves through the league. Maybe the NFL goes to an NBA-style draft lottery to try to avoid tanking? ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2022, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804/20 "2022-02-03T14:08:17Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > It would be much easier if this was about gambling on games - that leaves a trail that’s impossible to hide. I’d be surprised if either Haslam or Ross was dumb enough to leave a documented trail of payments to tank. This is why the lawsuit is important. It’s one thing for them to dissemble in their public statements, but being put under oath opens them up to potential criminal prosecution if they lie and lets a jury determine the credibility of their testimony. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-flores-lawsuit/958804.md?page=2)