# Brian Williams Helicopter story: blowhard BS, but not a fireable offense **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 6, 2015, 7:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953 "2015-02-06T07:09:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![MacCat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maccat/32/216_2.png) [@MacCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MacCat)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/161 "2015-02-14T00:09:26Z")
I hadn’t seen this before… > [@](#): > > Meanwhile, CNN Friday also raised questions about another claim Williams – at the time a reporter for CBS/2 – has made, that he was at the Brandenburg Gate when the Berlin Wall came down, on Nov. 9, 1989. From a subscription site… [http://www.newsday.com/entertainment/tv/brian-williams-faces-additional-questions-as-cleams-of-seal-team-6-berlin-wall-under-scrutiny-1.9936596](http://www.newsday.com/entertainment/tv/brian-williams-faces-additional-questions-as-cleams-of-seal-team-6-berlin-wall-under-scrutiny-1.9936596) ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/162 "2015-02-14T00:29:57Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > I remain of the opinion that he did not at any point sit down and decide _'I’ll say [blank] and those idiots will never guess that I’m making it all up!_’ or anything of the kind. I think that in his zeal to seem Important and Special and Admirable, he took too flexible a position on what was the case and what was merely _almost_ the case. Yeah–I’m reminded of [Fflewder Fflam](https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=wFFT-l-6hRE#t=50). Maybe we just need to buy Williams a harp. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/163 "2015-02-14T13:18:49Z")
> [@spifflog](#): > > In the military I’ve have two fairly close brushes with death or at least pretty serious injury. I remember both like they were yesterday. I’ve also arrive on the scene shortly after other incidents. I’ve never “misremembered” or “conflated” the two events. Not even close. I think so. I think the latest revelations about the questionable status of being embedded with SEAL 6 team probably crossed the line for many people. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/164 "2015-02-14T14:35:05Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > …By the way, I do have a bit of shame about being so flippant about Williams and his travails. No doubt he’s going through a terrible time. I guess my lifelong dislike of self-promoters is showing. I was just thinking about this after reading about the Brandenberg gate misremberance. Gotta have a little sympathy for the guy who has fallen SO far SO fast. Two weeks ago he was this well-respected personality holding his head high wherever he went. Now, if has has any self-awareness at all, he’s probably holed up at home. And with each new revelation it’s gotta be harder and harder to look even his family in the eye. You know there’s a “Wow, dad’s actually full of shit.” vibe in that house. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/165 "2015-02-14T17:58:44Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > I was just thinking about this after reading about the Brandenberg gate misremberance. Gotta have a little sympathy for the guy who has fallen SO far SO fast. Two weeks ago he was this well-respected personality holding his head high wherever he went. Now, if has has any self-awareness at all, he’s probably holed up at home. And with each new revelation it’s gotta be harder and harder to look even his family in the eye. You know there’s a “Wow, dad’s actually full of shit.” vibe in that house. Yes. He was the last US newscaster I watched. Even if it dies in 2 weeks I don’t see how he can come back without people CONSTANTLY digging up a new quote to pick apart. His self respect must be in box under the Christmas ornaments by now. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/166 "2015-02-14T18:29:09Z")
US news on TV, cable, print and somewhat radio, is a series of exactly these kinds of exaggerations and lies and propaganda. It’s full of shit. And the pushers don’t even know it except for Sean Hannity who has, three layers deep, a hidden expression of “i-can’t-believe-you-morons-buy-this-crap-but-i-love-the-money-and-have-anti-morals”. The Daily Show (and Colbert) seemed to mock Bullshit Mountain ™ relentlessly, but just when Jon Stewart’s buddy Brian Williams is brought low, Stewart takes that opportunity to announce just how much quit he has been holding back on. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/167 "2015-02-14T18:36:43Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Even if it dies in 2 weeks I don’t see how he can come back without people CONSTANTLY digging up a new quote to pick apart. There might be an odd vibe if he was presenting a story about a political candidate in trouble for lying. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/168 "2015-02-14T19:23:33Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > Presumably Williams has so much money that he doesn’t need to work again…but it’s difficult to come up with plausible ideas for jobs he could be hired to do. If he has talent as a writer, he could go that way, but I can’t see him returning to the airwaves in any capacity. I think Rush Limbaugh nailed it, actually. > [@](#): > > His career as a narrative reader is over, 'cause this stuff’s gonna continue to trickle out. It’s either gonna trickle out or it’s gonna explode, but they’re gonna continue to find more examples of it. It’s gonna end up being so much that this is going to become an alter personality, who he really is, that people are gonna end up laughing at and finding charming, even though this is deeply rooted problematic. > > Given our pop culture today, depending on how he wants to market this, if he does, he could have an entirely new identity, a new routine, a guy who never tells the truth about anything will become his new identity. It will be hilarious and funny, and he will market it and play it for all it’s worth. > … > It’ll be his new identity. For example, Brian Williams will go on a late-night comedy show, and he’ll start talking about how he was in the back of the Bronco and he begged OJ to do it differently, and OJ wouldn’t listen to him. And everybody will applaud and laugh. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/169 "2015-02-14T19:24:45Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > I think Rush Limbaugh nailed it, actually. Absolutely. I look forward next to reading Kim Kardashian’s critique of Paris Hilton for her empty celebrity status. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2015, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/170 "2015-02-14T19:31:49Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Absolutely. I look forward next to reading Kim Kardashian’s critique of Paris Hilton for her empty celebrity status. I wouldn’t need to read it, myself, but I’d have to give credit where due. Hey, the ad she did for the Super Bowl suggests a thread of self-awareness. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/171 "2015-02-15T05:38:09Z")
> [@JimSC](#): > > There is a difference between a false memory and an accurate memory that is mistaken. … Nobody planted a false memory by suggesting to BW that he had been under fire. At some point in his own mind, the story changed. I have no doubt … it was a deliberate act. And I have no doubt it was an unintentional occurrence. Do we cancel out? We have demonstrated that people think in stereotypes, that memory is mutable and an illusion, that you can’t even remember simple important things like how you discovered you were colour-blind at age 20 something. Even the police (God rest their souls) were traditionally expected to use NOTE BOOKS to WRITE THINGS DOWN, not because they were expected to become more racist and biased between the scene of arrest and the court room, but because even then memory was known to be unreliable. The police notebook used to be a cliché of policing. I sometimes wonder if the internet, camera phones, and audio recording hasn’t given people a new illusion that facts can be remembered, because perhaps we rely less on written notes than we once used to. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 10:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/172 "2015-02-15T10:54:46Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > Presumably Williams has so much money that he doesn’t need to work again…but it’s difficult to come up with plausible ideas for jobs he could be hired to do. He has a pretty wicked sense of humor and comedic timing - he could do comedy. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 11:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/173 "2015-02-15T11:04:13Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > Even the police (God rest their souls) were traditionally expected to use NOTE BOOKS to WRITE THINGS DOWN, not because they were expected to become more racist and biased between the scene of arrest and the court room, but because even then memory was known to be unreliable. The police notebook used to be a cliché of policing. > > I sometimes wonder if the internet, camera phones, and audio recording hasn’t given people a new illusion that facts can be remembered, because perhaps we rely less on written notes than we once used to. Perhaps this idea of writing down or recording one’s observations should have been introduced to Brian Williams, before he was given a job in journalism? ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 11:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/174 "2015-02-15T11:19:51Z")
Seems the problem wasn’t Williams reading a prepared text, it was him going off script and ad libbing. ---
**Author:** ![MacCat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maccat/32/216_2.png) [@MacCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MacCat)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/175 "2015-02-15T16:54:13Z")
> [@](#): > > His career as a narrative reader is over, 'cause this stuff’s **gonna** continue to trickle out. It’s either **gonna** trickle out or it’s **gonna** explode, but they’re **gonna** continue to find more examples of it. It’s **gonna** end up being so much that this is _going to_ become an alter personality, who he really is, that people are **gonna** end up laughing at and finding charming, even though this is deeply rooted problematic. As I don’t listen to Rush Limbaugh, I never realized how erudite he actually is. Had only that one “_going to_” agreed with the six “ **gonna** ’s” it would have been some classic oratory. ---
**Author:** ![JimSC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3d9bf3/32.png) [@JimSC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JimSC)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2015, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/176 "2015-02-15T20:41:20Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > And I have no doubt it was an unintentional occurrence. Do we cancel out? > > We have demonstrated that people think in stereotypes, that memory is mutable and an illusion, that you can’t even remember simple important things like how you discovered you were colour-blind at age 20 something. > > Even the police (God rest their souls) were traditionally expected to use NOTE BOOKS to WRITE THINGS DOWN, not because they were expected to become more racist and biased between the scene of arrest and the court room, but because even then memory was known to be unreliable. The police notebook used to be a cliché of policing. > > I sometimes wonder if the internet, camera phones, and audio recording hasn’t given people a new illusion that facts can be remembered, because perhaps we rely less on written notes than we once used to. I agree that memory is much less reliable than most people believe. Everyone acknowledges that there are some things that they can’t remember, but few understand that a lot of what they do remember is wrong. The last sentence of my post (that your quote shortened with the ellipsis) reads, “I have no doubt that re-remembering and re-telling the story has formed a solid false memory, but when the story first changed in his head from that of observer to participant, it was a deliberate act.” I believe that BW is not lying about what he remembers, his memory is just wrong. The act that I believe to be deliberate was the initial transition of the story in his mind. In other words, at some point he was thinking about or telling the story with details that he knew to be false, and subsequently came to believe the alternate version. Having said that, new information about multiple embellishments by BW might suggest a more complicated issue. It may be that BW’s standard approach to a news story has been to start with the core facts (helicopters were attacked, people died during Katrina, the Berlin Wall came down) and build a story around those facts that would get and hold people’s attention. The objective being to convey the impact of these events, and if a fictional back story does that better than the truth, then fiction becomes truth. He may rationalize the self-aggrandizements as attempts to help his audience better understand the issues by making the stories more personal. As long as people come away with the correct understanding of the issues, the truth doesn’t matter. ---
**Author:** ![GreenElf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/9de053/32.png) [@GreenElf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreenElf)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2015, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/177 "2015-02-16T03:09:50Z")
I don’t see what the big controversy is. I long ago accepted that American TV news is entertainment. If you want more factual TV news, watch the BBC news and miss out on the commercial breaks every 5 minutes too. ---
**Author:** ![drewtwo99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d07c76/32.png) [@drewtwo99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewtwo99)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2015, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/178 "2015-02-16T08:01:17Z")
Brian Williams is a hack and has tarnished the mainstream media’s reputation. Network news will never be the same. I hope you are happy Brian. You disgust me. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2015, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/179 "2015-02-16T17:41:23Z")
Once again, [Tom Tomorrow nails it](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/02/16/1364355/-Cartoon-The-unreliable-narrator?detail=hide). ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2015, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953/180 "2015-02-16T17:42:59Z")
And so does [Ruben Bolling](http://www.gocomics.com/tomthedancingbug/2015/02/13). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brian-williams-helicopter-story-blowhard-bs-but-not-a-fireable-offense/711953.md?page=10)