# Bring back the battleships? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 14, 2009, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860 "2009-02-14T20:42:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2025, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/321 "2025-12-23T22:29:17Z")
I think the new generation of garbage barges should be called Trump class. ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2025, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/322 "2025-12-23T22:36:55Z")
This class of vessel would be more appropriate. Dubbed USS Mushroom [![](https://p.turbosquid.com/ts-thumb/NZ/cqopHw/4b/boominbeaverusnavyboatmb3dmodel001/jpg/1721262981/600x600/fit_q87/b48c8826247f031587a5f50d2c72ec6586e57a15/boominbeaverusnavyboatmb3dmodel001.jpg) ](https://p.turbosquid.com/ts-thumb/NZ/cqopHw/4b/boominbeaverusnavyboatmb3dmodel001/jpg/1721262981/600x600/fit_q87/b48c8826247f031587a5f50d2c72ec6586e57a15/boominbeaverusnavyboatmb3dmodel001.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2025, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/323 "2025-12-23T22:38:34Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > If the first one is to be named the Defiant, wouldn’t that make this the Defiant-class? Not necessarily. It’s usually the first to be commissioned by Congress that names the class, at least for the last century anyway. This would presumably indeed be the Defiant in this case, if Congress actually approves the line of ships and commissions this particular ship. That said, norms, standards, and Congressional approval are not as indicative of the future as we once assumed. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2025, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/324 "2025-12-24T01:48:04Z")
For the layman, this announcement by TFG is a serious sign of his dementia. According to the [BBC](https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c2084nq2npjo), > Construction on the Trump-class USS Defiant ship, which will be equipped to carry an array of weapons, is expected to begin soon, with Trump saying the first vessels will be operational in two-and-a-half years. For starters, these ships haven’t even been _designed_ yet, a process that will take years assuming it were even possible. The idea that a ship this sized will be operational in two and a half years is patently delusional. For reference, the time between laying down and commissioning a modern carrier is 8 years. This is, of course, ignoring the fact that Congress has to actually authorize these things and allocate the money to build them. Something that TFG frequently forgets about, but until the country is the dictatorship that he wants it to be, TFG decreeing that something will happen means jack and shit until Congress authorizes the spending. And again, in layman’s terms, TFG may as well have been announcing that these ships will be armed with phasers, photon torpedoes and powered by a warp drive. And they’ll be operational starting in two and a half years. That’s the level of delusion and dementia on display from the man who is unfortunately the President of the United States of America. According to [Golden Fleet](https://www.goldenfleet.navy.mil/), they are to be armed with: Surface Launched Cruise Missile - Nuclear (SLCM-N) - these don’t exist. Thay are a project being _considered_. [Report to Congress on Nuclear Sea-Launched Cruise Missile - USNI News](https://news.usni.org/2025/09/24/report-to-congress-on-nuclear-sea-launched-cruise-missile-2) 12 cell CPS - again, these don’t exist. CPS, [Conventional Prompt Strike](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conventional_Prompt_Strike) is a system that is still in development 128 cells Mk41 VLS - this actually does exist. Not a good sign that we’ve had to get this far down the list to find something that exists in reality. 1x32MJ Railgun with HVP - this is along the lines of the Terminator asking for a phased plasma rifle in a 40 watt range from a gun store in California in the 1980s. 2x5" guns with HVP - actually exists. Oh wait, apart from the Hypervelocity Projectile part. They don’t yet, still in trials. 2x 300kW or 2x 600 kW lasers - well at least he’s keeping his options open. Still as non-existent as the 32MJ railgun 2x RAM launcher - they exist 4x30mm guns - again, exists 4x ODIN lasers - actually exists! Nowhere near as impressive as the name sounds though. [Optical Dazzling Interdictor, Navy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Energy_Laser_with_Integrated_Optical-dazzler_and_Surveillance) are ‘soft kill’ weapons to blind or destroy cameras and sensors on UAVs ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2025, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/325 "2025-12-24T22:01:23Z")
> **[The Golden Fleet’s Battleship Will Never Sail](https://www.csis.org/analysis/golden-fleets-battleship-will-never-sail)** > > The recently announced “Trump” class of battleships is cast as the world’s largest and most powerful ships. But these ships will take years to design, cost $9 billion each, and run counter to the Navy's new concept of distributed operations. They... > The ship’s purported characteristics are so extraordinary that the announcement will surely spark immense discussion. However, there is little need for said discussion because this ship will never sail. It will take years to design, cost $9 billion each to build, and contravene the Navy’s new concept of operations, which envisions distributed firepower. A future administration will cancel the program before the first ship hits the water. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2025, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/326 "2025-12-24T22:37:04Z")
What future administration? _Apres moi, le deluge_ is the level of thinking by this regime. ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2025, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/327 "2025-12-24T23:47:04Z")
Pretty much. I mean this is Kim Jong Un level of thinking on display. But at least Kim had the decency to make physically real giant bronze statues of himself, not slap a portrait of himself over AI slop. [![](https://news.usni.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/12/Trump_Battleship-poster-defiant-hi-res-2048x1229-1-1050x630.jpg) ](https://news.usni.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/12/Trump_Battleship-poster-defiant-hi-res-2048x1229-1-1050x630.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2025, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/328 "2025-12-25T01:19:03Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > What future administration? > > _Apres moi, le deluge_ is the level of thinking by this regime. Yeah. If nothing else Trump is a malignant narcissist; to Trump future Administrations by definition don’t matter, because they aren’t _him._ So he doesn’t care about the damage he is doing or the future of any such project because as soon as _he_ dies, the universe has lost the only reason it ever had to exist. It’s notable that he also made absurd claims that the ships would be made within about two years, as that (impossible) date would put it within his Administration and likely lifespan. Because if it took the realistic amount of time then he’d never get the chance to enjoy them, and therefore there’s no point to it. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2025, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/329 "2025-12-25T01:39:36Z")
There’s also the thought that somebody else isn’t the new president after 2028. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2025, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/330 "2025-12-25T06:34:19Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Yeah. If nothing else Trump is a malignant narcissist; to Trump future Administrations by definition don’t matter, because they aren’t _him._ So he doesn’t care about the damage he is doing or the future of any such project because as soon as _he_ dies, the universe has lost the only reason it ever had to exist. That’s how Trump differs from other authoritarians like Hitler or Stalin, or like Putin or Kim. They believed, at some level, that _L’État, c’est moi_ - they are the state and the state is them. That’s why they cared about things like their legacy. Trump, OTOH, is incapable of conceiving of something larger than himself. To him, the state is just another mark. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2025, 7:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/331 "2025-12-25T07:10:01Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > That’s how Trump differs from other authoritarians like Hitler or Stalin, or like Putin or Kim. They believed, at some level, that _L’État, c’est moi_ - they are the state and the state is them. That’s why they cared about things like their legacy. Trump, OTOH, is incapable of conceiving of something larger than himself. To him, the state is just another mark. Yes. I’ve said in the past that while Trump is the standard bearer for American fascism, he’s incapable of being fascist himself because that would require him to care about something other than himself. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2025, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/332 "2025-12-25T12:19:51Z")
Of course that doesn’t prevent him from engaging in behavior, and giving orders, that are indistinguishable from big-F Fascism. A bit Like Putin, there’s just a very large _sub rosa_ looting of the state going on at the same time as the very public aggrandizement of the State over the Little People, and especially over the wrong sort of Little People. ---
**Author:** ![Capn\_Carl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/838e76/32.png) [@Capn\_Carl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capn_Carl)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2025, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/333 "2025-12-25T13:30:43Z")
I was going to vent about these new _Defiant c_lass “battleships”, but others have already done better than I would have. I’ll just add that battleships were dumb by 1942. That we’ve been having arguments about them since then shows it’s an emotional issue, not a rational one. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2025, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/334 "2025-12-25T13:43:49Z")
> [@Capn\_Carl](#): > > _Defiant c_lass “battleships Trump class (fixed that for you). Really. Defiant is supposed to be the first ship but collectively they are designated as the “Trump Class” of ships. And isn’t the usual naming scheme for battleships to name them after a state? I get there is no law that says it has to be that way but it seemed the tradition. And our armed forces are steeped in tradition. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2025, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/335 "2025-12-25T14:07:07Z")
Lots of stuff about our government _were_ steeped in tradition. His Disgustingness has decreed there are now new traditions affecting all branches of our government. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2025, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/336 "2025-12-25T14:39:31Z")
> [@Dissonance](#): > > I assume he’s going to explain why its missiles will need to circle the earth 6 times before hitting their targets. It’s like playing roulette - the ball goes around and around, and you don’t know where it’s going to land! He can fire off a dozen missiles, and no one will know who he’s attacking! It’s brilliant! ---
**Author:** ![OttoDaFe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ottodafe/32/356_2.png) [@OttoDaFe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OttoDaFe)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2025, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/337 "2025-12-25T15:17:54Z")
> [@Dissonance](#): > > … The idea that a ship this sized will be operational in two and a half years is patently delusional. … Especially since the winning ~~briber~~ bidder will be a nonexistent shipyard in Oklahoma. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2025, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/338 "2025-12-25T15:58:56Z")
The 2nd in class will be called the Grift Spree. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2025, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/339 "2025-12-25T16:05:33Z")
Does the US even have any shipyards (not to mention steel mills) capable of building one of these monsters? I’m sure we could get there eventually but likely would take decades before we would even start building the ship. (Getting that ship building capability back probably is worthwhile.) ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2025, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860/340 "2025-12-25T16:09:11Z")
Philly can, they recently did an overhaul of the USS New Jersey BB-62 in fact. Keep in mind, Carriers, Super Tankers and some Containers ships are as big or bigger than the Battleships. There must be at least 1 more US yard capable of building a BB. Newport News, Virginia is the one that builds the Ford Class Carriers, and every Nuclear Powered Carrier in US History. Though they’re in the middle of building CVN-80, The Enterprise. They’re also working on CVN-81 at the same time, the USS _Doris Miller_ if Trump doesn’t decide to override and rename it before launch. The Big “E” is due 2028 and I think the Miller is due in 2031. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bring-back-the-battleships/485860.md?page=18)