# BritDopers (and nosy foreigners) - The general election 2010 **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 6, 2010, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133 "2010-04-06T11:13:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/61 "2010-04-07T13:31:16Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > How significant, if at all, is that in British politics? Does it impose any special obligations, or confer any special privileges? I believe the British system is similar to that in Australia. Political parties are ordinary membership organisations – though the British Labour Party and the Australian Labor Party also have a special relationship with affiliated trade unions. You pay a membership fee, and generally agree to support the party – or, at least, not to oppose the party’s candidates in public. If you do break party rules – the worst possible offence being to run against your party’s candidate in an election – you can be expelled. The selection of candidates is an internal matter for the party, with no governmental involvement. It can be by a poll of the paid-up party members in the constituency, or (more usually) by a committee consisting of delegates from the paid-up members. The candidates from a party have no special privileges about getting on the ballot: they have be nominated by voters living in the electorate, just as independent candidates do, and generally they have to pay a cash deposit, which is forfeited if they don’t get enough votes in the real election. ---
**Author:** ![Racer1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ee59a6/32.png) [@Racer1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Racer1)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/62 "2010-04-07T13:40:48Z")
I’m a life long Labour supporter, but there is no way I’ll ever vote for them again. They have let me down massively on pretty much everything that matters to me, topped off nicely by their failure to act to halt the closure of front line services at my local hospital, meaning thousands of patients will be forced to travel miles in heavy traffic in a vain hope to be seen within any reasonable time at a hospital that is already seeing over double the patients it was designed for and due for cuts itself… **massive continuing rant deleted since this probably isn’t the threat for it** Unless one of the main candidates (excluding the incumbent Labour liar) comes out with something less vague than reviewing the cuts, I will be voting for a local independent or one of the smaller parties. When will we know who is standing in our local constituencies? ---
**Author:** ![Scougs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scougs/32/3158_2.png) [@Scougs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scougs)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/63 "2010-04-07T13:49:15Z")
For me this election is not about who you want to win, but who you **don’t** want to win. And that goes for both individual constituencies as well as overall power. The (perfectly valid, IMO) viewpoint that the big three are all as bad as each other could lead to voter apathy, or extreme protest votes, paving the way for big gains for the likes of the BNP. I really, really hope everyone takes the time to check up on the previous results in their constituency. The BBC web site is a great resource for this. As a life long Labour voter, I would have been tempted to go for the SNP this time round, except for the very real possibility that ex-Labour voters going over to LibDem and SNP in my constituency would just hand the seat to the Tories. And in my opinion, that would be a Bad Thing. I’m in Alistair Darling’s constituency (Edinburgh South West) which looks a fairly safe Labour seat. I would rather help keep it that way. Incidentally, this thread has made me realise there’s a few of us Edinburgh types on the Dope. Didn’t know that before… ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Poster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Happy\_Poster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Poster)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/64 "2010-04-07T14:13:42Z")
> [@Giles](#): > > I believe the British system is similar to that in Australia. Political parties are ordinary membership organisations – though the British Labour Party and the Australian Labor Party also have a special relationship with affiliated trade unions. You pay a membership fee, and generally agree to support the party – or, at least, not to oppose the party’s candidates in public. If you do break party rules – the worst possible offence being to run against your party’s candidate in an election – you can be expelled. > > The selection of candidates is an internal matter for the party, with no governmental involvement. It can be by a poll of the paid-up party members in the constituency, or (more usually) by a committee consisting of delegates from the paid-up members. The candidates from a party have no special privileges about getting on the ballot: they have be nominated by voters living in the electorate, just as independent candidates do, and generally they have to pay a cash deposit, which is forfeited if they don’t get enough votes in the real election. Wrong answer - or more precisely the right answer to the wrong question 🙂 It’s very simple - if you have a credible claim\* to be a member of a household then you can join the elctoral roll at that household. You can vote in local elections at all the households. However, you’re only supposed to vote in one constiuency at the general election\*\*, but which one you choose is up to you. \*No one checks 😉 \*\*No one checks 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/65 "2010-04-07T14:37:06Z")
> [@Angry Lurker](#): > > Wrong answer - or more precisely the right answer to the wrong question 🙂 I think we’re at cross purposes here. I was answering a question from **Elendil’s Heir** about what party membership means in the U.K., as compared to the U.S. Your answer is about how to get onto the electoral roll to vote. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Poster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Happy\_Poster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Poster)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/66 "2010-04-07T15:13:13Z")
My apologies, I forgot how to read some time ago 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Elvis\_Chimney](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/50afbb/32.png) [@Elvis\_Chimney](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elvis_Chimney)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/67 "2010-04-07T15:59:23Z")
The Guardian has a handy little swingometer app which is good for idling away a moment or two: > **[Election map and swingometer](https://www.theguardian.com/politics/interactive/2010/apr/05/general-election-map-swingometer)** > > Browse the 2010 constituencies to see how the country stands, and use the three-way swingometer to see how various scenarios would affect the outcome At first glance it looks as though Scotland is missing but we’re there - just squashed on top. ---
**Author:** ![edinbourgeoise](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ecb155/32.png) [@edinbourgeoise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/edinbourgeoise)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/68 "2010-04-07T16:22:17Z")
Come on, folks, there are actual policies being kicked around to which you can object or not. It isn’t as if anyone talks about them much, but they exist. Like the Tory wheeze for a married couples tax break: [http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/election-2010/7553739/Conservatives-to-announce-600m-marriage-tax-break.html](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/election-2010/7553739/Conservatives-to-announce-600m-marriage-tax-break.html) Yes, I object. I object because people with children already receive Child Benefit. I object because people who aren’t happy to be married aren’t going to be any more cheerful about it a few thousand pounds further down the road. I object because I don’t see why government-led social engineering is suddenly a great idea if it’s a Conservative idea. And I object on behalf of all the single people in the country who are already trying to run a household on one income. Because I happen to be unacquainted with anyone I’d care to marry, I don’t deserve a tax break? Fuck you, Dave. Oh, and I run a business. A rise in National Insurance will not ruin my life. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Poster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Happy\_Poster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Poster)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/69 "2010-04-07T16:29:51Z")
Because you PAYE for 6k and pay yourself in dividends, no doubt 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/70 "2010-04-07T17:11:58Z")
> [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](#): > > That said I will be voting Labour. What a sad statement about our democracy. You’re not even going to bother to consider the other candidates. ---
**Author:** ![One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/838e76/32.png) [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/One_And_Only_Wanderers)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/71 "2010-04-07T17:42:50Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > What a sad statement about our democracy. You’re not even going to bother to consider the other candidates. who said i hadnt considered? The sleeze and scandal across ALL parties has affected my view of politics. However when it comes down to values and policies, I’m a Labour man. ---
**Author:** ![One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/838e76/32.png) [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/One_And_Only_Wanderers)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/72 "2010-04-07T17:55:38Z")
Ah i get your point now. I should be undecided and such until election day. It’s not like we have no prior experience with each of the Parties and what they stand for. Labour for me, don’t trust the Tories. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/73 "2010-04-07T17:58:03Z")
You had prior experience with Labor when you voted for Blair, but I’m willing to bet you weren’t voting for quite what you _thought_ you were voting for. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Poster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Happy\_Poster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Poster)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/74 "2010-04-07T18:05:54Z")
If you want to vote for what Labour should stand for, (can’t think why, but still) then investigate one of the socialist parties. This Labour party is not what old Labour was… it seems to combine some of the worst aspects of pretty much everything. Only the BNP is worst (they are a socialist party, incidentally - I wish people would stop calling them far right, they’re not. They’re far left racists) ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/75 "2010-04-07T18:29:05Z")
> [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](#): > > who said i hadnt considered? The sleeze and scandal across ALL parties has affected my view of politics. However when it comes down to values and policies, I’m a Labour man. They’ve not even published their manifestos yet. And you’re ruling out any worthy independent candidates. It makes me sad. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/76 "2010-04-07T21:31:31Z")
And you’re ignoring the quality of the local party candidates too: would you still vote Labour if the Labour candidate were (say) a convicted embezzler and paedophile? ---
**Author:** ![penultima\_thule](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penultima_thule/32/3833_2.png) [@penultima\_thule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/penultima_thule)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/77 "2010-04-07T22:15:24Z")
Can you explain how you, and presumably others, are on more than one electoral roll? Or does one electorate = one electoral roll not apply? > [@Angry Lurker](#): > > It’s very simple - if you have a credible claim\* to be a member of a household then you can join the elctoral roll at that household. > > You can vote in local elections at all the households. However, you’re only supposed to vote in one constiuency at the general election\*\*, but which one you choose is up to you. > > \*No one checks 😉 > \*\*No one checks 😉 You know Giles, the more you learn about other country’s electoral systems the more amazed I am that there are so many ways of getting it so profoundly and institutionally wrong. Especially when there is a simple, effective model like the Australian Electoral Commission to use as a template. You determine who can vote, and you count those votes. 🆒 Sheesh, it’s democracy, not rocket science. Can you imagine the carnage that the NSW ALP Right wing faction would wreck if eligibility was as laxly defined as above. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/838e76/32.png) [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/One_And_Only_Wanderers)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/78 "2010-04-07T22:41:23Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > And you’re ignoring the quality of the local party candidates too: would you still vote Labour if the Labour candidate were (say) a convicted embezzler and paedophile? ummm no - and of course this situation will never ever arise, so what’s the point of it? ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2010, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/79 "2010-04-07T23:17:23Z")
I was using hyperbole. One only has to look at the likes of Margaret Moran, my erstwhile MP, to see serious lapses of character. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Poster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Happy\_Poster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Poster)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2010, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/80 "2010-04-08T02:22:43Z")
> [@penultima\_thule](#): > > Can you explain how you, and presumably others, are on more than one electoral roll? Or does one electorate = one electoral roll not apply? > > You know Giles, the more you learn about other country’s electoral systems the more amazed I am that there are so many ways of getting it so profoundly and institutionally wrong. Especially when there is a simple, effective model like the Australian Electoral Commission to use as a template. > > You determine who can vote, and you count those votes. 🆒 Sheesh, it’s democracy, not rocket science. > > Can you imagine the carnage that the NSW ALP Right wing faction would wreck if eligibility was as laxly defined as above. :eek: You may also be amused to learn we don’t need any kind of ID to vote either. Just turn up and rattle off yer name and address and they cross it off a paper list. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133.md?page=5)