# BritDopers (and nosy foreigners) - The general election 2010 **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 6, 2010, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133 "2010-04-06T11:13:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 48
**Author:** ![Happy\_Poster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Happy\_Poster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Poster)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/941 "2010-05-13T13:19:56Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > So who would our BritDopers like to see as the new Labour leader, and why? Anyone but David Milliband, because I am laying him on betfair šŸ™‚ Otherwise I really couldnā€™t care less. Cruddass would be good to ensure they donā€™t hold power again during my lifetime. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/942 "2010-05-13T13:47:40Z")
Maybe they should put John Prescott in charge, if only for the comedy value at PMQs. Seriously - of the candidates under discussion, Johnson is the least objectionable but hardly the man to drive any sort of change in the party. Iā€™m not seeing anyone at the moment that really fills me with hope for the future of the party (and certainly not Harriet Harman). All the really principled ones resigned over the Iraq war and/or are dead. Maybe I should check the expenses scandal reports and see who diddled the taxpayer out of the least moneyā€¦ ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/943 "2010-05-13T14:13:15Z")
> [@SirRay](#): > > Could anyone tell me why so many posters seemed to be flying off the handle about this election? Because the tory Leopard does not change its Thatcherite spots. It always has been the party of privilege and we know that its way of dealing with the crisis will be to make the poor pay and the rich richer. And unlike when New Labour emerged from the wreckage of the original labour party the current conservative party has not ejected its lunatics. Itā€™s the same nasty old party with a nice public schoolboy front-man. We know that their spending cuts will deflate the economy and make things worse. I hope the Lib-democrats in the new Conrat Govt will ameliorate this. The signs arenā€™t good with all major Offices of State in the hands of essentially Neo-cons. There was no enthusiasm for Labour but the last period of Tory rule was brutally destructive from the point of view of Labourā€™s natural constituency. I do welcome the Freedom Bill. New Labour were vile authoritarians after 9/11 and much of what they wrought needs sweeping away. ---
**Author:** ![MJinks](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/da6949/32.png) [@MJinks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MJinks)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/944 "2010-05-13T14:16:21Z")
> [@Angry Lurker](#): > > Iā€™m not sure what you mean about differences with global warming I had to use Google to refresh my memory. > [@The Independant](#): > > The influential website ConservativeHome thought the New Cameron didnā€™t speak for the Party, so last month **[Jan 2010]** they commissioned a poll of the candidates selected to fight the most winnable Tory seats. They were asked to rank nineteen issues facing Britain in order of importance ā€“ and global warming came at the very bottom. (Bolded text added). [Link to article.](http://www.johannhari.com/2010/02/19/ignore-the-propaganda-the-tory-party-hasnt-changed) I know from reading The Independant that Johann Hari hates the Conservatives but hopefully it shows the differences between the different party memberā€™s priorities. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/945 "2010-05-13T14:17:48Z")
> [@Angry Lurker](#): > > But again we come back to the knee-jerk tory-hate, which is what many of them will have felt when this came out. Thereā€™s nothing knee-jerk about opposing the Tories. We oppose them because we know what side their bread is buttered on. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Poster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Happy\_Poster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Poster)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/946 "2010-05-13T14:25:40Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > Because the tory Leopard does not change its Thatcherite spots. > > It always has been the party of privilege and we know that its way of dealing with the crisis will be to make the poor pay and the rich richer. > > And unlike when New Labour emerged from the wreckage of the original labour party the current conservative party has not ejected its lunatics. Itā€™s the same nasty old party with a nice public schoolboy front-man. > [@tagos](#): > > Thereā€™s nothing knee-jerk about opposing the Tories. We oppose them because we know what side their bread is buttered on. This is the sort of thing I was referring to earlier šŸ˜ƒ ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Poster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Happy\_Poster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Poster)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/947 "2010-05-13T14:26:59Z")
> [@MJinks](#): > > I had to use Google to refresh my memory. (Bolded text added). [Link to article.](http://www.johannhari.com/2010/02/19/ignore-the-propaganda-the-tory-party-hasnt-changed) I know from reading The Independant that Johann Hari hates the Conservatives but hopefully it shows the differences between the different party memberā€™s priorities. For sure theyā€™ll have different priorities, but I donā€™t think their actual views are all that different. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/948 "2010-05-13T15:46:36Z")
> [@Angry Lurker](#): > > This is the sort of thing I was referring to earlier šŸ˜ƒ Me too. ---
**Author:** ![Walker\_in\_Eternity](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/46a35a/32.png) [@Walker\_in\_Eternity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walker_in_Eternity)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/949 "2010-05-13T15:49:03Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > Because the tory Leopard does not change its Thatcherite spots. > > It always has been the party of privilege and we know that its way of dealing with the crisis will be to make the poor pay and the rich richer. > > And unlike when New Labour emerged from the wreckage of the original labour party the current conservative party has not ejected its lunatics. Itā€™s the same nasty old party with a nice public schoolboy front-man. Whereas New Labour adopted many ideas that could be classed as Thatcherite. Blair himself stood as a Tory at University IIRC. Iā€™m not a Tory voter, but give Cameron a chance, he may not be as bad as you think and heā€™s certainly better than Blair or Brown. Hopefully this defeat will give the Labour party time to re-organise and re-focus so that next time they gain power they can do it without adopting all the worst traits of the Tories as well as their own authoritarian, big government and spending policies. ---
**Author:** ![Nancarrow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c37758/32.png) [@Nancarrow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nancarrow)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/950 "2010-05-13T16:01:43Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > So who would our BritDopers like to see as the new Labour leader, and why? Ah, who indeed. An excellent question. I have voiced strong opinion on just this subject recently. ---
**Author:** ![Capt.Ridley\_s\_Shooting\_Party](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/cc9497/32.png) [@Capt.Ridley\_s\_Shooting\_Party](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capt.Ridley_s_Shooting_Party)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/951 "2010-05-13T16:05:40Z")
I cannot see a single possible candidate that Iā€™d like to see as a future PM. The idea of a Milliband in the office is terrifying. I cannot stand watching the elder Milliband speak. He manages to take the worst mannerisms of Blair and Cameron and add his own to the diabolical mix. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/952 "2010-05-13T16:49:13Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > It always has been the party of privilege This is simply not true. The couldnā€™t get the votes if they were: there simply arenā€™t that many privileged people. The Tories are rather the party of those who aspire to better themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Nancarrow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c37758/32.png) [@Nancarrow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nancarrow)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/953 "2010-05-13T19:59:46Z")
At least that explains why Iā€™ve never been inclined to vote for them. Aspire to better myself? No thanks, Iā€™m as good as it gets! ---
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/954 "2010-05-13T22:01:50Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Slightly off topic: is there a British Obama on the horizon (ie., a minority other than a female with a real chance of becoming PM in the next 15 years)? Well, thereā€™s already been an Irish PM ([sort of](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Wellesley,_1st_Duke_of_Wellington#Statesman)), a Jewish PM ([sort of](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjamin_Disraeli)) and a female PMā€¦ ([sort of](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Thatcher)). Sorry, I had that joke from ages ago and Iā€™ve been dying to try it out again. Even though it doesnā€™t quite work here. Ah wellā€¦ ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2010, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/955 "2010-05-13T22:07:14Z")
> [@Pushkin](#): > > Well, thereā€™s already been an Irish PM ([sort of](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Wellesley,_1st_Duke_of_Wellington#Statesman)), a Jewish PM ([sort of](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjamin_Disraeli)) and a female PMā€¦ ([sort of](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Thatcher)). > Sorry, I had that joke from ages ago and Iā€™ve been dying to try it out again. Even though it doesnā€™t quite work here. Ah wellā€¦ Actually, [Lord Palmerston](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_John_Temple,_3rd_Viscount_Palmerston) was (Anglo-)Irish, though as an Irish peer he was eligible for election to the House of Commons and was in fact elected from English constituencies. ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2010, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/956 "2010-05-14T00:39:49Z")
About this point that Labour (and some Tory MPs) have been making today, regarding the sudden announcement that it will now require a 55% No Confidence vote in Parliament to bring down the government, rather than 50+%. While Iā€™m sympathetic to the coalition, they do have a point. Not that thereā€™s necessarily anything wrong with the 55% number per se ā€“ other parliaments have much more onerous No Confidence requirements ā€“ but the idea that they can reformulate the constitution on the spot like that, to suit current circumstances, is troubling. Some people, many of them Liberal Democrats, have said that we need a clear written constitution that can not easily be changed. Maybe theyā€™re right. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2010, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/957 "2010-05-14T01:08:59Z")
> [@Ximenean](#): > > About this point that Labour (and some Tory MPs) have been making today, regarding the sudden announcement that it will now require a 55% No Confidence vote in Parliament to bring down the government, rather than 50+%. > > While Iā€™m sympathetic to the coalition, they do have a point. Not that thereā€™s necessarily anything wrong with the 55% number per se ā€“ other parliaments have much more onerous No Confidence requirements ā€“ but the idea that they can reformulate the constitution on the spot like that, to suit current circumstances, is troubling. The finely-tuned 55% threshold power grab will not get through the Commons. Itā€™ll be the old 50% + 1. Oh, itā€™s going to be \* so\* awkward. ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2010, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/958 "2010-05-14T01:31:45Z")
Are there enough dissenters to oppose the 55% change? The coalition has a 70-seat majority, on paper. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2010, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/959 "2010-05-14T02:40:18Z")
> [@Baron\_Greenback](#): > > The finely-tuned 55% threshold power grab will not get through the Commons. Itā€™ll be the old 50% + 1. Oh, itā€™s going to be \* so\* awkward. Hmmm ā€“ is there anything in statute law that requires a government to resign on losing a confidence vote? Otherwise, itā€™s merely a convention ā€“ one of long precedent, to be sure. But for a P.M. to say, ā€œOkay, the vote was 318 No confidence, 316 Confidence, 16 absentees or abstentions ā€“ thatā€™s not necessarily reflective of the nationā€™s lack of confidence in the Governmentā€ does make sense. Now, if he ignored multiple or lopsided no confidence votes, then the Leader of the Opposition would be justified in going to see the Queen and asking that he be dismissed or Parliament dissolved. (And Iā€™m speculating here ā€“ what would happen if Cameron did lose a confidence vote by a slim margin and ignored it? Riots in the streets? Dogs and cats living together?) ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2010, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/960 "2010-05-14T02:43:07Z")
> [@Ximenean](#): > > Are there enough dissenters to oppose the 55% change? The coalition has a 70-seat majority, on paper. Legally, one Parliament cannot bind another. This Parliament could pass a five-year fixed term elections bill. And when elections are held in 2015, the incoming Parliament could repeal it and hold a snap election in six months if they so chose. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133.md?page=47) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133.md?page=49)