# BritDopers (and nosy foreigners) - The general election 2010 **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 6, 2010, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133 "2010-04-06T11:13:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/161 "2010-04-12T02:28:16Z")
Might come as a surprise to most Britons to find their country is currently on its knees. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/162 "2010-04-12T02:31:23Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Might come as a surprise to most Britons to find their country is currently on its knees. Not to the public-school boys, it won’t! [rimshot] ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/163 "2010-04-12T02:35:19Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Actually England’s the only part of the UK without it’s own parliament and England is not oppressive to Scotland or Wales. Not today, perhaps. But historically England **has** been oppressive to Scotland and Wales – and Ireland – and the Brits have very long historical memories. “An Englishman thinks a hundred miles is a long way and an American thinks a hundred years is a long time.” Besides, a federation, if that’s what the UK should shape up to be, is unstable and dysfunctional if one member state overwhelms the others by size or anything else, the way Bismarck’s German Empire was really a Prussian Empire. For that reason alone, it would make more sense for each of the [nine Regions of England](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regions_of_england) to have its own local parliament than for England-as-a-whole to have one. Then the UK would be a federation of 12 more-or-less-equal provinces – the English regions, Wales, Scotland, and Northern Ireland. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/164 "2010-04-12T02:45:25Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Not today, perhaps. But historically England **has** been oppressive to Scotland and Wales – and Ireland – and the Brits have very long historical memories. “An Englishman thinks a hundred miles is a long way and an American thinks a hundred years is a long time.” Besides, a federation, if that’s what the UK should shape up to be, is unstable and dysfunctional if one member state overwhelms the others by size or anything else, the way Bismarck’s German Empire was really a Prussian Empire. Well if one component of a confederation or federation has the majority of the population and economy it should be natural that it has the most political power. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/165 "2010-04-12T02:49:54Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Well if one component of a confederation or federation has the majority of the population and economy it should be natural that it has the most political power. And that is **exactly** why, in such a situation, that component should be politically subdivided. Germany is a much healthier federation now that the megastate of Prussia no longer exists. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/166 "2010-04-12T03:06:02Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > And that is **exactly** why, in such a situation, that component should be politically subdivided. Germany is a much healthier federation now that the megastate of Prussia no longer exists. Not really. Germany’s instabliity during the Second Reich and the Weimar Republic had many reasons but the existence of Prussia wasn’t a particularly an important one. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/167 "2010-04-12T03:12:26Z")
> [@Curtis LeMay](#): > > Not really. Germany’s instabliity during the Second Reich and the Weimar Republic had many reasons but the existence of Prussia wasn’t a particularly an important one. A German state without a dominant Prussia would never have entered WWI. ---
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 10:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/168 "2010-04-12T10:23:56Z")
> [@Dick\_Dastardly](#): > > He won a whole series of elections over a couple of decades as part of two different political parties. How does a fringe crackpot win elections in multiple constituencies for multiple parties over a couple of decades? Being a Labour candidate in a Glasgow constituency does not require any great personal popular appeal. You would basically have to donkey punch the Pope in order to lose. Less facetiously, winning under the aegis of a major political party which has been the incumbent in the region since before you were born is easy. Galloway toed the party line, wore the rosette and got the votes that would have gone to any Labour candidate. He was not at that point a fringe crackpot, which is a reflection on the political evolution of both George Galloway and the Labour party. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Kobayashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4af34b/32.png) [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 10:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/169 "2010-04-12T10:42:35Z")
> [@Dick\_Dastardly](#): > > He won a whole series of elections over a couple of decades as part of two different political parties. How does a fringe crackpot win elections in multiple constituencies for multiple parties over a couple of decades? On top of what **amrussell** said, the ability to win elections doesn’t necessarily speak to the quality of his character or policies, he is a capable rabble-rouser and feverish demagogue. ---
**Author:** ![Lust4Life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lust4Life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lust4Life)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/170 "2010-04-12T11:05:02Z")
I arrive late to this thread but heres my two pennor’th. I am a floating voter because you should be voting for a partys policies of the time, not out of some misguided loyalty for what a particular party did in the thirties or the seventies or whatever. Once when Labour and the Conservatives seemed like Siamese twins I wanted to vote Monster Raving Looney as a protest vote but we didn’t have a candidate locally so I voted for the Greens instead. It would be nice if the Lib Dems got in and broke the stranglehold that the other two have held for so long but I think that its unlikely that’ll they’ll get in.(A self fulfilling prophecy most likely). Labour IMO is finished in any real political sense for the time being even without the disasterous G.Brown element. Labour have been in power a good many years and have had more then enough time to rectify some of the countries problems but have failed to do so. I would guess that the publics perception is that giving them a few more years wouldn’t allow them to magically overcome these problems. I will probably vote Tory though to be quite honest they don’t seem to have any radically new policies to change things. Unfortunately when politicians try to change things they offend a lot of people and usually give up trying. IMO the two things that actually affect the average voter where they feel it are crime and unemployment and THEN its the N.H.S., education etc.etc. ---
**Author:** ![Dick\_Dastardly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c4cdca/32.png) [@Dick\_Dastardly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dick_Dastardly)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/171 "2010-04-12T11:05:53Z")
> [@amrussell](#): > > Being a Labour candidate in a Glasgow constituency does not require any great personal popular appeal. You would basically have to donkey punch the Pope in order to lose. > > Less facetiously, winning under the aegis of a major political party which has been the incumbent in the region since before you were born is easy. Galloway toed the party line, wore the rosette and got the votes that would have gone to any Labour candidate. He was not at that point a fringe crackpot, which is a reflection on the political evolution of both George Galloway and the Labour party. At what point did he become a fringe crackpot? ---
**Author:** ![Dick\_Dastardly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c4cdca/32.png) [@Dick\_Dastardly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dick_Dastardly)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 11:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/172 "2010-04-12T11:08:23Z")
> [@Mr.Kobayashi](#): > > On top of what **amrussell** said, the ability to win elections doesn’t necessarily speak to the quality of his character or policies, he is a capable rabble-rouser and feverish demagogue. He’s done pretty well for a fringe crackpot. He had a national radio show for years during his crackpot years and is a regular guest on national political programs like Question Time. That doesn’t sound like fringe crackpottery to me. ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/173 "2010-04-12T11:22:57Z")
I did that online test and landed myself squarely in the middle of Labour and the LibDems, which I would’ve guessed anyway. I could never vote Tory for the simple reason that their record even in recent times on gay rights is disgusting - reading their voting records is truly depressing. I am by no means a single issue voter, but for me it would be like a black person voting for the BNP. ---
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/174 "2010-04-12T11:51:18Z")
> [@Dick\_Dastardly](#): > > At what point did he become a fringe crackpot? I’ll see if I can dig up the video, but for me it was about the time that he announced that anyone voting for Labour was committing a sin against the Lord and would literally burn in hell. [Got it.](http://humanistsforlabour.typepad.com/labour_humanists/2007/05/george_galloway.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheLabourHumanist+(The+Labour+Humanist)) More recently, of course, he’s donated [£25,000 of his own money to Hamas.](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7939480.stm) ---
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/175 "2010-04-12T11:53:20Z")
On a more general note, I scored 64% Green, 61% Lib Dem and 58% Labour. And 14% Conservative. Which pretty much makes me the irrepressible lefty I alway thought I was. It shows a flaw in the website though - I’m in favour of nuclear power and the Greens aren’t, so even though Environmentalism isn’t a key issue for me, there’s no way I should be lined up with them. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 12:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/176 "2010-04-12T12:04:17Z")
[Cameron fucks up really really badly](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UToKt6PxJCQ) over Tory MEPs voting for homophobic legislation in Europe. God how embarrassing. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/177 "2010-04-12T12:29:08Z")
> [@Dick\_Dastardly](#): > > He’s done pretty well for a fringe crackpot. He had a national radio show for years during his crackpot years and is a regular guest on national political programs like Question Time. That doesn’t sound like fringe crackpottery to me. He’s only a crackpot to those who disagree with his views. Time-old smear tactics from people who aren’t fit to lace his boots. ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/178 "2010-04-12T12:31:40Z")
> [@jjimm](#): > > [Cameron fucks up really really badly](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UToKt6PxJCQ) over Tory MEPs voting for homophobic legislation in Europe. > > God how embarrassing. It very rare to see a leader of a major party that confused about an issue. You can bet the next time he’s asked he’ll have a statement rehearsed and ready to go. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 12:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/179 "2010-04-12T12:32:00Z")
> [@amrussell](#): > > I’ll see if I can dig up the video, but for me it was about the time that he announced that anyone voting for Labour was committing a sin against the Lord and would literally burn in hell. > > [Got it.](http://humanistsforlabour.typepad.com/labour_humanists/2007/05/george_galloway.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+TheLabourHumanist+(The+Labour+Humanist)) Wow, political type uses hyperbolic language aimed at his specific audience newsflash! ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2010, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133/180 "2010-04-12T12:34:36Z")
> [@amrussell](#): > > Being a Labour candidate in a Glasgow constituency does not require any great personal popular appeal. You would basically have to donkey punch the Pope in order to lose. In general this is true. However, Galloway’s Hillhead constituency was an odd one - it had been with the Conservatives from 1918 until 1982 when Roy Jenkins took it for the SDP. Galloway then held it for Labour from 1987 until the seat boundaries were redrawn in 1997. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/britdopers-and-nosy-foreigners-the-general-election-2010/535133.md?page=10)