# British English: Pudding, Biscuits, Cookies anyone? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 9, 2002, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995 "2002-05-09T01:15:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 10:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/21 "2002-05-09T10:23:16Z")
England: Pavement - US: Sidewalk And if your “bird” (ladyfriend) asks you to “lay the table”, do watch out for the knives. And less of the ‘supposedly’, mate. It’s called “English” for a reason. ---
**Author:** ![Xerxes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/d2c977/32.png) [@Xerxes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xerxes)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 10:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/22 "2002-05-09T10:29:18Z")
> [@](#): > > _Monty opined_ > And has she asked you to knock her up (come visit) yet I’ve never heard ‘knock her up’ or the more usual ‘knocked up’ to mean anything other than to make (or to be) pregnant. So while in the most literal and lewd sense **come visit** is pidgin-speak for knock her up, I’m not sure it’s what you mean. That said, I’d love to be a fly on the wall when you ask your British gf; do you mind if I knock you up around 8-ish? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stafford_cripps/32/7167_2.png) [@The\_Stafford\_Cripps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stafford_Cripps)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/23 "2002-05-09T11:34:11Z")
I think one of the older uses of “pudding” was to mean foods that involve several ingredients being mixed up and stuffed into something that holds them together while being cooked, such as a cloth or, in the case of haggis, a sheep’s stomach (BWAHAHA!). This could be sweet or savoury, and would explain why fruit dumplings and _delectable_ black puddings are called “puddings”. Presumably at some point the word became more, but not exclusively, associated with desserts in general. By the way, to add to the confusion, in Scottish chip shops you also get savoury red and white puddings (they are shaped like large sausages). ---
**Author:** ![istara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e79b87/32.png) [@istara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/istara)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/24 "2002-05-09T13:03:38Z")
Just to second **Insecta** - “pudding” is a synonym for “desert”, but is now losing popularity to “desert”, as well the excrutiating “sweet” ("What would you like for sweet? _shudder_) however “desert” would be considered a non-U word by many, and “pudding” a posh word by others. Likewise napkin v serviette (napkin being the posh one). In Britain, “biscuit” describes all sweet biscuits, cookies of all types, and savoury biscuits such as cheese biscuits. “Cookie” is an American import word AFAIK, so a “British cookie” might be a british version of a big chewy American-style cookie/biscuit? ---
**Author:** ![istara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e79b87/32.png) [@istara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/istara)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/25 "2002-05-09T13:05:05Z")
_wonders why she spelt dessert wrongly (as desert) every single time, blushes and apologises for it_ ---
**Author:** ![Balor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/45deac/32.png) [@Balor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balor)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/26 "2002-05-09T13:38:10Z")
In Ireland we also have white pudding. It is a kind of sausage, like black pudding, only whiter. Like all sausages, you don’t want to know what is in it. Thick slices of black and white pudding are eaten as part of a fried meal. Oscar Wilde said that the English and Americans were two races divided by the same language. As I said on another thread, without the influence of modern media and communications, there would now be a separate American language. The two languages were moving apart very quickly and would soon have been as different as Swedish/Norwegian or Spanish/Portugese. However, in the twentieth century they drew back together again. As it is, they are still separate dialects of English. The Economist newspaper’s “Style Guide” has several pages of differences between English and American. Curiously, the car seems to produce huge number of differences - gasoline/petrol, hood/bonnet, trunk/boot and so on. I believe that Americans should accept the situation, and cease calling their dialect “English”. They should proudly assert its identity as American. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/27 "2002-05-09T14:36:21Z")
So what are you going to name the English spoken in Ireland then, Balor? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Mentalist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/59ef9b/32.png) [@Mentalist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mentalist)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/28 "2002-05-09T14:51:19Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Monty \* > \*\*You forgot to mention chips (french fries) and crisps (potato chips). And has she asked you to knock her up (come visit) yet, or must you ring (phone) before you can meet? \*\* Yeah and try asking for 20 fags in the USA… ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/29 "2002-05-09T15:10:11Z")
Where can I get a copy of the Economist’s style book? ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/30 "2002-05-09T15:38:03Z")
There are a number of dictionaries of British/American English. A useful one for Americans is _British English: A to Zed_ by Norman Schur and Eugene Ehrlich. It’s a quite extensive (about 400 pages) dictionary of British English terms with definitions in American English. While I won’t swear that it’s on the shelves of every bookstore, you can order it easily. The most recent edition is copyrighted in 2001. I doubt you can easily get _The Economist_’s style book. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/31 "2002-05-09T16:24:55Z")
And if she talks about “eating spotted dick,” she is making no references to oral sex or veneral disease… Do Brits call Fritos “maize crisps?” ---
**Author:** ![scm1001](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c4cdca/32.png) [@scm1001](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scm1001)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/32 "2002-05-09T16:25:13Z")
one suspects the meaty sort of pudding is actually older than the sweet type. “PUDDING, a term, now of rather wide application, for a dish consisting of boiled flour enclosing or containing meat, vegetables or fruit, or of batter, rice, sago or other farinaceous foods boiled or baked with milk and eggs. Properly a pudding should be one boiled in a cloth or bag. There are countless varieties, of which the most familiar are the Christmas plum-pudding, the Yorkshire pudding and the suet pudding. The word was originally and is still so used in Scotland for the entrails of the pig or other animal stuffed with meat, minced, flavoured and mixed with oatmeal and boiled. The etymology is obscure. The French boudin occurs in the Scottish original sense at the same time as poding (I3th century) in English. Boudin has been connected with Italian boldone and Latin botulus, sausage, but the origins of these words are quite doubtful. Attempts have been made to find the origin in a stem pud-, to swell, cf. “podgy,” L. Ger. Pudde-wurst, black-pudding, &c.” from [http://29.1911encyclopedia.org/P/PU/PUDDING.htm](http://29.1911encyclopedia.org/P/PU/PUDDING.htm) ---
**Author:** ![cyberfactotum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/898d66/32.png) [@cyberfactotum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cyberfactotum)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/33 "2002-05-09T16:41:05Z")
dunne u. wurrie writes: \> None of this matters. The first thing you need to learn is JAFFA CAKES! ; ) Jeezus! Now you’re really confusing me. I looked up Jaffa Cakes and found this: > **[h2g2 - Oops.](https://h2g2.com/alabaster/A185104)** > > h2g2, the Unconventional Guide to Life, the Universe and Everything ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/34 "2002-05-09T16:44:22Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Annie-Xmas \* > \*\*Do Brits call Fritos “maize crisps?” \*\* Nah, corn chips as they’re an import. ---
**Author:** ![cyberfactotum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/898d66/32.png) [@cyberfactotum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cyberfactotum)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/35 "2002-05-09T16:44:37Z")
London\_Calling writes: \> Err…no but I wonder if you’re main focus should be in not putting her in the pudding club just yet. This conspiracy goes much deeper than I had thought. Imagine my surprise when I found: [http://www.puddingclub.com/framepclub.htm](http://www.puddingclub.com/framepclub.htm) I think something truly strange has been uncovered here. ---
**Author:** ![Balor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/45deac/32.png) [@Balor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balor)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/36 "2002-05-09T17:25:28Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by jjimm \* > \*\*So what are you going to name the English spoken in Ireland then, Balor? 😉 \*\* The Irish of South Dublin speak the most articulate and mellifluous version of English in the world. Great talkers and writers such as Oscar Wilde and James Joyce are so common, we have to export them to clear out the stocks. So it goes without saying that our version is THE English. Other pale imitations such as as “British English” and American must be carefully distinguished to avoid confusion. acsenray asked - > [@](#): > > Where can I get a copy of the Economist’s style book? I bought it from the Economist a few years ago - I do not know if it is still for sale. It was an excellent guide to good writing. > [@](#): > > Jaffa Cakes Until you have eaten Jaffa Cakes, you do not understand the answer to life, the universe, everything. I ate 42 last time. However there is an Irish invention called Kimberley biscuits, a combination of ginger, marshmallow and sugar. The blessed person who invented them immediately achieved Nirvana. If the Jaffa Cakes run out, try Kimberleys. ---
**Author:** ![ruadh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d2c977/32.png) [@ruadh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ruadh)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/37 "2002-05-09T18:09:12Z")
Typical South Dubliner, claiming some kind of _English_ authenticity. You know this puts that GD thread in a whole new light. 😃 [sub]P.S. Disregard the above if you are actually from Tallaght.[/sub] ---
**Author:** ![robcaro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/df705f/32.png) [@robcaro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robcaro)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/38 "2002-05-09T18:24:35Z")
American Heritage Dictionary defines pudding: > [@](#): > > 1.a. A sweet dessert, usually containing flour or a cereal product, that has been boiled, steamed, or baked. b. A mixture with a soft, puddinglike consistency. 2. A sausagelike preparation made with minced meat or various other ingredients stuffed into a bag or skin and boiled. ---
**Author:** ![Catalina](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Catalina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Catalina)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/39 "2002-05-09T19:07:06Z")
Wait until you find out about crumpets. . . ---
**Author:** ![RedDevil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/3ec8ea/32.png) [@RedDevil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedDevil)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2002, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995/40 "2002-05-09T20:06:44Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Balor \* > \*\* > > However there is an Irish invention called Kimberley biscuits, a combination of ginger, marshmallow and sugar. The blessed person who invented them immediately achieved Nirvana. If the Jaffa Cakes run out, try Kimberleys. \*\* Huh. I did try them years ago and I thought they were rather poor. I remember having a cup of tea and really looking forward to them. And this was after blahing on for ages…“ooh, they look really nice!”…“just the kind of thing I like!”…like some lunatic gameshow contestant. What do Americans call the sitting room? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-english-pudding-biscuits-cookies-anyone/107995.md?page=3)