# British Grammar--whilst vs. while? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 27, 2001, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365 "2001-08-27T18:09:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![shorin-ryu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3d9bf3/32.png) [@shorin-ryu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shorin-ryu)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2001, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/1 "2001-08-27T18:09:50Z")
I’ve noticed that British writers sometimes use the word “whilst,” which to my provincial American eyes looks odd. Is it pronounced with a long or a short “i”? And what rules of grammar govern when you use “whilst” versus when you use “while”? ---
**Author:** ![Crusoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/49beb7/32.png) [@Crusoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crusoe)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2001, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/2 "2001-08-27T18:13:50Z")
I pronounce it ‘wylst’. Some vague details on usage [right here](http://www.lineone.net/dictionaryof/englishusage/d0083042.html). ---
**Author:** ![Francesca](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9fc348/32.png) [@Francesca](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Francesca)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2001, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/3 "2001-08-27T18:42:46Z")
Concurring with **Crusoe**. I didn’t even know it wasn’t used in America. Wylst. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2001, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/4 "2001-08-27T18:45:40Z")
I’ve always been pronouncing it with a long I (rhymes with _nice_). Is this incorrect? ---
**Author:** ![shorin-ryu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3d9bf3/32.png) [@shorin-ryu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shorin-ryu)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2001, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/5 "2001-08-27T18:54:41Z")
Thank you, Crusoe! From that site: > [@](#): > > These are more or less interchangeable in British English would seem to explain why I couldn’t quite figure out the pattern for it. But at least I’ll pronounce it correctly now! ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2001, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/6 "2001-08-27T20:49:04Z")
It’s not in Canadian English either. I never heard it until an Australian/English co-worker used it and I asked her what it meant… ---
**Author:** ![irishgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/8edcca/32.png) [@irishgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/irishgirl)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2001, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/7 "2001-08-28T00:45:08Z")
like while with a “st” sounds. pile, mile, nile sort of noise. not like will with a “st” sound. i think there is some suggestion that the ST at the end makes the meaning more passive. “I was cutting the grass WHILE my wife pruned the roses.” “The grass was being cut WHILST my wife pruned the roses.” but a) i could be wrong… and b) nobody really cares that much. ---
**Author:** ![AwSnappity](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a3d4f5/32.png) [@AwSnappity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AwSnappity)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2001, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/8 "2001-08-28T02:50:35Z")
I just wanted to mention that I used the word “whilst” today. No one says it here (Chicagoish). I think it makes me sound more sophisticated. Whoo! Sophisticated! Awesome! ---
**Author:** ![xanakis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/7bcc69/32.png) [@xanakis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xanakis)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2001, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/9 "2001-08-28T04:14:09Z")
Whilst reading Irishgirl’s post, I decided that, while point a. could be correct or incorrect, point b. was definitely wrong. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2001, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/10 "2001-08-28T04:45:46Z")
I’m an Australian studying at grad school in the US, and when i used ‘whilst’ in a paper my professor told me to use ‘while’ instead. She said that ‘whilst’ was considered somewhat archaic. According to _Fowlers Modern English Usage_ (third edition, 1996), the two are essentially interchangeable, but ‘whilst’ is “not used in AmE.” I like whilst - it has a good sound to it. ---
**Author:** ![Mersavets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/aca169/32.png) [@Mersavets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mersavets)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2001, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/11 "2001-08-28T05:57:34Z")
I use whilst quite a lot too. It is very common here in Australia but I have a linguistics professor who chides anybody for using it as he also says it is archaic. Mind you, he’s English and so much of his language is non-standard for Australians. I always thought he was a little prescriptive considering he teaches linguistics. Like mhendo, I like the way it sounds and could get by without it but why should I?1 ---
**Author:** ![pennylane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@pennylane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pennylane)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2001, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/12 "2001-08-28T12:43:35Z")
I have a question too. For many years now Americans have been using the word “lay” as both present and past tense. For example, “Why don’t you lay down now” and “I was just laying in bed when it happened”. This is incorrect but has been used for so long, I’m wondering if it is now accepted usage in America. Secondly, I’ve noticed that even English people have started (mis-)using this word. Has this ghastly trend crossed the Atlantic? ---
**Author:** ![Fern\_Forest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/71c47a/32.png) [@Fern\_Forest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fern_Forest)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2001, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/13 "2001-08-28T12:58:48Z")
I’ve used it, but incorrectly. For me whilst takes the place of “while I was” so rather then saying while I was going to the park, I would say “whilst going to the park.” But then only to certain people. We Americans do like reinventing the language. It helps keep us from growing into our parents. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2001, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/14 "2001-08-28T16:06:52Z")
**To pennylane:** _Fowler’s Modern English Usage_ says that the only acceptable use of _lay_ in the present tense is as a transitive verb meaning to put something down, or to put it to rest. e.g. please **lay** it on the table As you are aware, the examples which you gave should read: Why don’t you **lie** down now? I was just **lying** in bed when it happened. According to _Fowler’s_, confusion between the verbs _to lay_ and _to lie_ “is taken to be certain evidence of imperfect education or is accepted in regional speech as being a deep-rooted survival from an earlier period.” The _Oxford English Dictionary_ says that _lay_ “is only dialectical or an illiterate substitute for _lie_.” As _Fowler’s_ ponts out, the fact that _lay_ shares an “identity of form with the past tense of _lie_ no doubt largely accounts for the confusion.” Note that both the OED and _Fowler’s_ are English sources, and that an American dictionary or usage book may give a somewhat different interpretation based on the use of the words in the US. ---
**Author:** ![pennylane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@pennylane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pennylane)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2001, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/15 "2001-08-28T17:01:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by mhendo \* > \*\* > > _Fowler’s Modern English Usage_ says that the only acceptable use of _lay_ in the present tense is as a transitive verb meaning to put something down, or to put it to rest. > > e.g. please **lay** it on the table > > According to _Fowler’s_, confusion between the verbs _to lay_ and _to lie_ “is taken to be certain evidence of imperfect education…”\*\* Thank you mhendo; I was aware of the transitive usage of the word, but had no proof until now of the imperfect education of those who use it incorrectly. I shall be flashing a copy of Fowler’s in their faces from now on… ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2001, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/16 "2001-08-28T17:13:46Z")
I first heard _whilst_ while listening to Genesis: _Forever drifting slowly towards a hazy emptiness Whilst water slips into the sea_ and King Crimson: _The gardener plants an evergreen Whilst trampling on a flower_ and realized it was a British usage that I’d never heard from the Allman Brothers or Frank Zappa. Something in the British must prefer longer endings extending the length of words. “Towards” is another example. In British English _towards_ ending with -s is the only form used. While in American English you can say it with or without the -s, and the shorter form _toward_ is preferred. Canadians talk like Americans, they only spell like Brits (and that only aboot half the time). ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2001, 6:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/british-grammar-whilst-vs-while/78365/17 "2001-08-30T06:56:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by FireUnderpantsBoobs \* > \*\*I just wanted to mention that I used the word “whilst” today. No one says it here (Chicagoish). I think it makes me sound more sophisticated. > > \*\* In that case perhaps you should have said: “I think it makes one sound more sophisticated” Using the word “while” can sound a bit on the ordinary side eh? Whilst one can seem a fraction more “la de da” if one should so choose