# Brits and linguists: What is "Vodker" and "Canader" all about? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 16, 2006, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603 "2006-11-16T00:23:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Tristan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tristan/32/18058_2.png) [@Tristan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tristan)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/41 "2006-11-17T03:41:03Z")
[QUOTE=levdrakon] I grew up mainly in Wisconsin and for the most part, Wisconinites don’t stick extra r’s on too many words. I was used to people from the New York/New England areas of the country adding r’s to words like pizzer instead of pizza. But I was a bit surprised when I went to college in Minnesota and discovered Minnesotans not only do that but like r’s so much they’ll stick them on your first name if they like you. If your name is Steve you become Stever, or if your name is Keith you become Keither. [/QUOTE] Good Jorb there, **levdrakon** ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/42 "2006-11-17T05:37:09Z")
[QUOTE=Themenin] Not sure I completely agree with your definition of _compare_, an old-fashioned word for companion, or peer. Maybe you’re referring to a dialect variant ? Godfather is _padrino_ (like the movie). Otherwise I agree that the ‘accent’ sounds like Neapolitan, where the penultimate vowel sound of a word is often ‘stretched out’ (vowel raising ?), and the last syllable dropped completely (consonant lenification ?). The softening of the ‘C’ sound to a ‘G’ also sounds like Neapolitan. [/QUOTE] _Padrino_ (literally ‘little father’) is the godfather in relation to his godchild. Originally, the words _compare_ (literally ‘co-father’) and _commare_ (‘co-mother’) refer to people you choose as your child’s baptismal sponsors. Traditionally you would choose your closest friends for this honor. The relationship between friends is considered to develop a sacred bond, like being part of the family, when they act as baptismal sponsors for each other’s children. So when the word is used loosely instead of literally – like “homie” – calling a friend _commare_ or _compare_ is like saying you feel so close to them that you would ask them to sponsor your child’s baptism. Anyway, this is the Sicilian culture I grew up in, I’m not sure about your part of Italy. Back when the English were following the Pope, the origin of the word _gossip_ was the same concept, ‘god-sibling’. Vowel raising refers to the shifts of e\>i and o\>u. This is an especially prominent feature in Sicilian. Consonant lenition can mean various things, in this case I meant the voicing of originally unvoiced consonants, k\>g, p\>b, t\>d. I heard a speaker of Neapolitan dialect call it “Nabulidàn.” ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/43 "2006-11-17T06:59:35Z")
Forget the extra “rs”-why do you Brits say : alumINIUM? Its ALU-MIN-UM! :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 7:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/44 "2006-11-17T07:14:52Z")
[QUOTE=ralph124c] Forget the extra “rs”-why do you Brits say : alumINIUM? Its ALU-MIN-UM! :rolleyes: [/QUOTE] We pronounce ‘aluminium’ as it’s spelt. It’s not our fault you spell it wrong, too. (FWIW, 'twas originally ‘alumium’) [QUOTE=Valteron] I know it is an old song, but listen to Elton John’s “Yellow Brick Road” and tell me if he says “A couple of **vodker** and tonics to get you on your feet again.” Believe me, he does say “vodker”. [/QUOTE] Nope, he says ‘vodka’. I just can’t hear it. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/45 "2006-11-17T07:20:45Z")
Forget aluminium, what’s with “spelt?” ---
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 9:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/46 "2006-11-17T09:29:12Z")
[QUOTE=Dominic Mulligan] It isn’t a Cockney thing. Most Northern accents have it, too. [/QUOTE] Do the Scots? I’m trying to think if us Northern Irish types do it too, I don’t think I do, but then I’m guilty of the “fillum” instead of “film” mistake and seem to have difficulty pronouncing “sexual” and “issues” 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 9:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/47 "2006-11-17T09:30:31Z")
Sorry, had to double post, the Freudian aspect of that last post only came to me as I hit submit! ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 10:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/48 "2006-11-17T10:23:07Z")
[QUOTE=GorillaMan] We pronounce ‘aluminium’ as it’s spelt. It’s not our fault you spell it wrong, too. (FWIW, 'twas originally ‘alumium’) Nope, he says ‘vodka’. I just can’t hear it. [/QUOTE] I guess you can’t hear it, then. There’s clearly and “r”, at least in [this You Tube recording](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CX-tgX8xh4) (1:57 into the song). If you don’t hear it there, then I can’t help you. I only heard it in the way **Colophon** described it, in an elisive manner when a word teminating in a vowel sound goes into a word beginning with a vowel sound. Like “vodka[r] and tonic” but not “vodka martini.” I’ve never heard an “r” in “bra” on its own–only in a phrase like “take off your bra[r] and panties” but not in the simple “take off your bra.” ---
**Author:** ![Themenin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ee59a6/32.png) [@Themenin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Themenin)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/49 "2006-11-17T11:05:37Z")
[QUOTE=Johanna] Anyway, this is the Sicilian culture I grew up in, I’m not sure about your part of Italy… I heard a speaker of Neapolitan dialect call it “Nabulidàn.” [/QUOTE] Thanks for the info. I’ve lived with southern Italians but I learned the language as an adult living in Milano and Florence, so there’s a lot of southern stuff I’m not conversant with. Just to stay on topic, I’ve definitely noticed the ‘extra r syndrome’ in some British accents. I met a girl from Newcastle who seemed to be called Linder. ---
**Author:** ![Martha\_Medea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/43a26b/32.png) [@Martha\_Medea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martha_Medea)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/50 "2006-11-17T12:30:47Z")
In Bristol (UK) they’d say “vodkal” and “Canadal”. It’s supposedly how Bristol itself got its name. (Bristow?) This is a city where it might not be such a great idea to name your daughter Eva, but Norma, OTOH… ---
**Author:** ![Arch\_Trout](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9f8e36/32.png) [@Arch\_Trout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arch_Trout)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/51 "2006-11-17T13:01:27Z")
[QUOTE=Pushkin] Do the Scots? I’m trying to think if us Northern Irish types do it too, I don’t think I do, but then I’m guilty of the “fillum” instead of “film” mistake [/QUOTE] I’m pretty sure us Scots don’t pronounce a phantom R. I do, however, find myself saying “fillum” as well, much to the disgust of my wife. While watching the Weakest Link the other day everyone voted off a girl called Summer. Only the Scottish contestant pronounced the R at the end of her name. Who is the weakest link? Summa Summa Summa Aaaargh, drove me mad hearing person after person miss off the R. ---
**Author:** ![fortytwo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/f9ae1b/32.png) [@fortytwo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fortytwo)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/52 "2006-11-17T13:55:42Z")
[QUOTE=Monty] Forget aluminium, what’s with “spelt?” [/QUOTE] Makes sense to me, spelt, dreamt, learnt, spoilt etc. These irregular verbs can have alternative forms of usage, fortunately it’s not compulsory to always follow the American way. It was bended out of shape. No thanks, I prefer our way. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/53 "2006-11-17T15:13:29Z")
[QUOTE=Johanna] Originally, the words _compare_ (literally ‘co-father’) and _commare_ (‘co-mother’) [/quote] And it’s interesting how these words have become slangified: compare –\> goombah (hale-and-hearty fellow thug!); commare –\> goomar (my little bit on the side). [QUOTE=Themenin] where the penultimate vowel sound of a word is often ‘stretched out’ (vowel raising ?), and the last syllable dropped completely (consonant lenification ?). [/QUOTE] As per **Johanna** ’s post. ---
**Author:** ![elmwood](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmwood/32/3060_2.png) [@elmwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elmwood)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/54 "2006-11-17T18:42:24Z")
[QUOTE=rocking chair] gorillaman, just listen to any of kennedy’s speaches. esp. the ones that involved cubar and the missiles there. [/QUOTE] In casual speaking, did any of the Kennedys frequently use “erah” as a filler word? Erah, do any, erah, New Englanders, erah erah, say it? ---
**Author:** ![Celyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9dc877/32.png) [@Celyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Celyn)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/55 "2006-11-17T19:32:45Z")
[QUOTE=Pushkin] Do the Scots? … [/QUOTE] I don’t think we do. Actually I tend to think of it as a nasty southern English habit. 😃 Before I gave up watching television, I was always shouting at the poor machine when some idiot said thing like “Lawr and Order” ---
**Author:** ![Valteron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f17d59/32.png) [@Valteron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Valteron)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/56 "2006-11-17T19:51:19Z")
Wow, I did not think my post would generate over 55 replies! Lots of good material in the postings, but the theory that makes the most sense is that the R is added to create a smooth flow between a word ending in a vowel and the next word beginning in one. So Captain Picard (Patrick Stewart) says “Dater and I” but “Data can handle it.” In fact, French not only takes measures to prevent problems arising from adjacent vowels in the spoken language; it also incorporates these measures in written French. French people say “le mur” or “la porte” but they say “l’enfant” or “l’ouverture”. But they also write it that way. It would be universally considered a spelling mistake to write “le enfant”. Similarly, the letter “t” is stuck into places to keep two vowels from “bumping together. “Il va” mean he goes. To turn it into a question (goes he?) you do not say or write “va-il” but rather"va-t-il”. What does the “t” stand for? Absolutely nothing. It is just there because “va-il” is hard to say. So who knows? Maybe this phantom Brit “r” that they add is the beginning of a similar development that could become standard English someday. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2006, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/57 "2006-11-17T19:56:36Z")
[QUOTE=pulykamell] I guess you can’t hear it, then. There’s clearly and “r”, at least in [this You Tube recording](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CX-tgX8xh4) (1:57 into the song). If you don’t hear it there, then I can’t help you. [/QUOTE] Ah. I hear it now, although Elton seems to be heavily exaggerating it in that example. Time for a non-scientific test - I’m going to go and sit at the bar of my local, and see how many people who order a vodka-and-something have an ‘r’ I can hear. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2006, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/58 "2006-11-18T00:49:53Z")
elmwood, teddy is noted for it. comedians love it. jack and bobby, i really can’t say. the recordings are mostly practiced speeches. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2006, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/59 "2006-11-18T00:56:22Z")
[QUOTE=Valteron] Similarly, the letter “t” is stuck into places to keep two vowels from “bumping together. “Il va” mean he goes. To turn it into a question (goes he?) you do not say or write “va-il” but rather"va-t-il”. What does the “t” stand for? Absolutely nothing. It is just there because “va-il” is hard to say. [/QUOTE] It’s the ghost of the dead Latin third-person singular verb ending in _-t_. It reappears when its position occurs between two vowels. A _revenant_, to use another French word. Its reappearance between vowels is like conjuring a spirit at a crossroads. The French _va_, with or without the _-t-_, comes from Latin _vadet_ ‘he goes’. ---
**Author:** ![Sevastopol](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cdc98d/32.png) [@Sevastopol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sevastopol)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2006, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603/60 "2006-11-18T04:54:43Z")
[QUOTE=Monty] Forget aluminium, what’s with “spelt?” [/QUOTE] Piece of cake, [forget aluminium](http://www.alzheimers.org.uk/Facts_about_dementia/Risk_factors/info_aluminium.htm), whereby the ways and means are dealt with. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-and-linguists-what-is-vodker-and-canader-all-about/380603.md?page=4)