# Brits - Explain the English newspapers **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 3, 2010, 8:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501 "2010-01-03T08:26:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2010, 8:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/41 "2010-01-04T08:08:30Z")
At one point during the three years that I lived in the U.K., I asked someone how long I would have to live in the U.K. before the jokes in _Private Eye_ would begin to make sense. He replied, “Wendell, you have to be born here, and your father has to be born here, and your grandfather has to be born here.” ---
**Author:** ![Staggerlee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/staggerlee/32/3134_2.png) [@Staggerlee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Staggerlee)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2010, 11:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/42 "2010-01-04T11:35:50Z")
I don’t think it’s been mentioned that Rupert Murdoch (News Corporation) owns \*\*The Sun \*\*and \*\*The Times \*\* as well as the **Fox** network in the US. ---
**Author:** ![yastobaal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/258eb7/32.png) [@yastobaal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yastobaal)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2010, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/43 "2010-01-04T11:48:13Z")
> [@Uosdwis\_R.Dewoh](#): > > Unfortunately the BBC blocks me from seeing your clip. [Here’s](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_ETfYdPmyg#t=7m36s) a clip of _Mock the week_ where they’re talking about the British baby boom and how different newspapers covered it. Hopefully it’s not the same clip you linked to. Bugger, hopefully as this version of the same clip wasn’t put there by the BBC it should work: ![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/EskEFU_q7u4/maxresdefault.jpg)https://www.youtube.com/embed/EskEFU_q7u4?feature=oembed&wmode=opaque ---
**Author:** ![Mk\_VII](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Mk\_VII](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mk_VII)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2010, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/44 "2010-01-04T12:01:47Z")
> [@Wendell\_Wagner](#): > > At one point during the three years that I lived in the U.K., I asked someone how long I would have to live in the U.K. before the jokes in _Private Eye_ would begin to make sense. He replied, “Wendell, you have to be born here, and your father has to be born here, and your grandfather has to be born here.” Bit like the _Doonesbury_ strip, you have to have been watching it for years to catch all the allusions. A lot of it is nods and winks to the in-crowd, not least because of the libel laws here. They still get sued anyway, of course,and have many times had to pay out. The other side of the coin is that they have broken stories that the mainstream media was afraid to touch. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2010, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/45 "2010-01-04T12:09:58Z")
The [London Gazette](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_Gazette). > [@](#): > > The London Gazette is one of the official journals of record of the British government, and the most important among such official journals in the UK, in which certain statutory notices are required to be published. The London Gazette claims to be the oldest surviving English newspaper and the oldest continuously published newspaper in the United Kingdom, having been first published on 7 November 1665 as the Oxford Gazette.[1] This is also claimed by the Stamford Mercury and the Newcastle Journal, due to that fact that the Gazette is not a conventional newspaper offering general news coverage. It does not have a large circulation. Sorry, this is a reply to **Cardinal** ’s query above. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2010, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/46 "2010-01-04T12:10:03Z")
> [@The\_Great\_Philosopher](#): > > Is the Daily Mail really notorious for “fictitious content”? Loony right wing views maybe, but I wasn’t aware it had a reputation for making things up; no more than any other tabloid anyway. Here are some of Ben Goldacre’s samples of the Mail [distorting the facts to make a nonsensical story](http://www.badscience.net/category/media/papers-mail/). ETA: in fairness there are other papers on his blog, but the Mail does seem to be the worst. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2010, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/47 "2010-01-04T13:12:03Z")
And the Mail has been known to steal outright from blogs. They even stole an article from a policeman’s blog. Oops! ---
**Author:** ![The\_Great\_Philosopher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3ec8ea/32.png) [@The\_Great\_Philosopher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Great_Philosopher)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2010, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/48 "2010-01-04T14:32:51Z")
> [@Cardinal](#): > > Ah, Private Eye. I’ve seen a good number of HIGNFY, and I’m intrigued by Ian’s magazine. I went to the web site and considered subscribing even over here, but decided that most of the allusions I wouldn’t understand. I know about three names of MPs and of course Boris, but all these government officials and footballers and “celebrities” like contestants on Big Brother just sail past me. I like to think for a moment that I’m well informed about Britain because of all the tv I’ve seen, but that’s just compared to average people here. (It’s very hard to find anyone who even knows of Stephen Fry. All of his shows have been on public tv at best, here, and most of them not at all.) Then I remember all the references that go past me even on a show like Top Gear, which I lurve. > > What is PE like? If Ian’s any indication, it’s not afraid to point out the facts that public people are trying to keep quiet. Is this its main point? Private Eye is a very good magazine: it targets politicians and the media, pointing out inconsistencies, mistakes and biases in a satirical way. I think the Jon Stewart show is a fairly good comparison: the way he dug up clips of Glenn Beck advising viewers to invest in gold, then dug up Beck’s connections to a company that sells gold for instance; or when he pointed out the fact that Fox News used incorrect footage of a rally; those are exactly the kind of the things Private Eye tries to do to British politicians or the British media. I don’t think you have to be born here to understand it, in fact I think it’s much more important to follow British politics and the British media - there are lots of British people who wouldn’t have a clue what’s going on in most of Private Eye, half the time I don’t know who the people it targets are: this minister, that political commentator, this advisor, etc, but it doesn’t really matter. If you can follow “Have I Got News For You” then you shouldn’t have too many problems reading Private Eye, and it is very good at holding politicians and the media to account. ---
**Author:** ![Rayne\_Man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/df705f/32.png) [@Rayne\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rayne_Man)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2010, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/49 "2010-01-04T14:33:03Z")
For an excellent analysis of what is bad about many British newspapers I recommend this:- [Tabloid Watch](http://tabloid-watch.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2009-01-01T00%3A00%3A00Z&updated-max=2010-01-01T00%3A00%3A00Z&max-results=50) Just have a look at the “Blog Archive” to get the full picture. ---
**Author:** ![blindboyard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blindboyard/32/2833_2.png) [@blindboyard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blindboyard)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2010, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/50 "2010-01-04T19:18:08Z")
> [@Rayne\_Man](#): > > It was the _Mail_ that ran the headline “Hurrah For The Black Shirts”, not the _Express._. > > Mind you nowadays the _Express_ is very right wing and seems to have an obsession about immigrants. I have a tendency to mix those up. The Express is the one obsessed with Princess Diana’s death, yeah? ---
**Author:** ![blindboyard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blindboyard/32/2833_2.png) [@blindboyard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blindboyard)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2010, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/51 "2010-01-04T19:30:51Z")
> [@Cardinal](#): > > Ah, Private Eye. I’ve seen a good number of HIGNFY, and I’m intrigued by Ian’s magazine. I went to the web site and considered subscribing even over here, but decided that most of the allusions I wouldn’t understand. I know about three names of MPs and of course Boris, but all these government officials and footballers and “celebrities” like contestants on Big Brother just sail past me. I like to think for a moment that I’m well informed about Britain because of all the tv I’ve seen, but that’s just compared to average people here. (It’s very hard to find anyone who even knows of Stephen Fry. All of his shows have been on public tv at best, here, and most of them not at all.) Then I remember all the references that go past me even on a show like Top Gear, which I lurve. > > What is PE like? If Ian’s any indication, it’s not afraid to point out the facts that public people are trying to keep quiet. Is this its main point? It does have a tendency to get sued for libel, yes. You shouldn’t have too much trouble, although it takes a while to pick up slang terms like “discussing ugandan affairs”, “tired and emotional”, “refer them to the case of Arkell vs Pressdram” and so forth. Seconding the love of Top Gear. > [@The\_Great\_Philosopher](#): > > Quite a lot I’d disagree with here. > > The Sun isn’t “known for its right wing views” at all. In fact it supported the left-leaning Labour government at the last 3 elections. Tony Blair, of course, known for his strong adherence to Marxist Leninism. > [@](#): > > The idea that the Guardian is not left-leaning is a bit ridiculous. Depends on your point of view I suppose. I speak as someone extremely left wing. > [@](#): > > How many of these papers do you actually read? Do? None. I’ve read the Times and Independent on a regular basis in the past, I don’t waste my money. ---
**Author:** ![Rayne\_Man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/df705f/32.png) [@Rayne\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rayne_Man)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2010, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/52 "2010-01-04T19:32:48Z")
> [@blindboyard](#): > > I have a tendency to mix those up. The Express is the one obsessed with Princess Diana’s death, yeah? That’s right. This is because the owner of the _Express_ (Dirty Desmond) is great mates with Mohamed ‘Al’ Fayed (the Phoney Pharaoh), whose son was killed in the same crash. Another obsession of the _Express_ is with Madeleine McCann ( the little girl who disappeared in Portugal) The paper printed front-page articles for nearly 100 days running. Most of the “facts” were false and the paper had to shell out substantial libel payments to the girl’s parents and other people involved in the case. ---
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/53 "2010-01-05T00:35:02Z")
> [@An\_Gadai](#): > > So for example, there’s the Scottish Sun, and the Irish Sun, which use much of the editorial from the Sun but also has local content The Irish Mail (sister to the Daily Mail) caught me by surprise. I never realised what it must be like to be on the receiving end of the DM’s diatribes, until the Irish Mail ran a front page on people going to shop up North and had a laugh at the drivers getting stuck in heavy traffic. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/54 "2010-01-05T02:57:06Z")
The Great Philosopher, I don’t think Jon Stewart is a very good analogy for _Private Eye_. To understand _Private Eye_, it isn’t sufficient to understand British politics. It’s also necessary to understand the standard joking ways of referring to various well-known British people and activities in the magazine. That’s not so necessary with Jon Stewart. ---
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 7:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/55 "2010-01-05T07:28:45Z")
> [@Pushkin](#): > > The Irish Mail (sister to the Daily Mail) caught me by surprise. I never realised what it must be like to be on the receiving end of the DM’s diatribes, until the Irish Mail ran a front page on people going to shop up North and had a laugh at the drivers getting stuck in heavy traffic. This is perhaps the only paper I would never buy, ever, and I mean ever. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 9:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/56 "2010-01-05T09:06:54Z")
Just so you know, the main newspapers all have sunday versions that have different editors and a slightly different stance. Someone up above mentioned the News of the World - that’s even more celeb-obsessed than the daily Sun. The Observer is the sunday version of the Guardian, and the others just have ‘Sunday’ added to their titles. The Sport is a weird newspaper. It’s a mixture of sex, bizarre stories (my son was turned into a fishfinger; London bus found on moon; both real stories from the Sport) and the occasional bit of really good reporting. To get the gist of the Daily Mail’s obsessions, have a look at the [Daily Mail headline generator](http://www.qwghlm.co.uk/toys/dailymail/). And yes, the Sun is known for being right wing. I doubt anyone working there would deny it. Perhaps it’s not right-wing by American standards, but it is by British. > [@blindboyard](#): > > I have a tendency to mix those up. The Express is the one obsessed with Princess Diana’s death, yeah? Yup. I have heard that it has a policy of one Diana story every four days; that’s probably apocryphal, but that is about how often they post front page stories about someone who died over a decade ago. Those free London newspapers are based on paying papers. The Metro is a condensed version of the Mail, and the Lite is (or used to be) a condensed version of the Standard - not sure if it is any more now that the Standard itself is free. ---
**Author:** ![Rayne\_Man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/df705f/32.png) [@Rayne\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rayne_Man)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2010, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501/57 "2010-01-05T09:33:47Z")
The bottom-right-hand section of the Express’s front page is nicknamed “dead-blond corner” for usually featuring a picture of either Princess Di or Maddie. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-explain-the-english-newspapers/523501.md?page=2)