# Brits: Knighthood no longer involves a ceremony with the queen? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 31, 2007, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-knighthood-no-longer-involves-a-ceremony-with-the-queen/398226 "2007-03-31T18:23:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 4\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2007, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-knighthood-no-longer-involves-a-ceremony-with-the-queen/398226/1 "2007-03-31T18:23:45Z")
Followup on [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=414576) thread. Bono was just made a “Knight Commander of the Most Excellent Order of the British Empire,” but the ceremony did not involve his kneeling to be tapped with a sword, and the queen wasn’t even there. 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Alive\_At\_Both\_Ends](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/73ab20/32.png) [@Alive\_At\_Both\_Ends](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alive_At_Both_Ends)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2007, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-knighthood-no-longer-involves-a-ceremony-with-the-queen/398226/2 "2007-03-31T18:39:29Z")
As far as I’m aware, knighthood still does involve this ceremony. But Bono is not a subject of the Queen and is therefore not eligible to participate in it. Likewise he cannot be referred to as “Sir”. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2007, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-knighthood-no-longer-involves-a-ceremony-with-the-queen/398226/3 "2007-03-31T20:21:33Z")
Couple of points relative to this: 1. Bono, like other people not subjects of QE2 (phrased carefully, because a Canadian or a New Zealander, although not themselves British, would not fall under this), received only an **honorary** recognition as KBE. Not that there’s a huge amount of difference between being honored as a full-fledged (British/Commonwealth) member of the OBE and an honorary (non-British/Commonwealth) member of it. 2. The OBE is a catchall way of honoring people who have in some way contributed to British society, economy, worldwide actions for ideals endorsed by the U.K., etc. Not all members of the OBE are knights (or “dames,” the female equivalent). The order is divided into military and civil divisions, each with five ranks, in ascending order: [ul][li]Member (uses MBE after name)[/li][li]Officer (OBE)[/li][li]Commander (CBE)[/li][li]Knight Commander, or for women: Dame Commander (KBE / DBE)[/li][li]Knight (or Dame) Grand Cross (GBE)[/ul][/li]Only the top two ranks are knighthoods, and then only for subjects of the Queen (excluding honorary knighthoods like Bono’s) > [@](#): > > The Order is limited to 100 Knights and Dames Grand Cross, 845 Knights and Dames Commander, and 8960 Commanders. There are no limits on the total number of members of the fourth and fifth classes, but no more than 858 Officers and 1464 Members may be appointed per year. Appointments are made on the advice of the governments of the United Kingdom and some Commonwealth realms. By convention, female judges of the High Court of England and Wales are created Dames Commander after appointment. Male judges, however, are created Knights Bachelor [i.e., not a part of any order - Poly]. The OBE has almost as exclusive admission requirements as a bus terminal! Source:[Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_the_British_Empire) – but it accords with everything I’ve read over the years about the OBE. ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2007, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/brits-knighthood-no-longer-involves-a-ceremony-with-the-queen/398226/4 "2007-04-01T06:08:41Z")
Wow! I never thought I’d be able to add to **Poly** on a question about British royalty! With regards to the OP’s question, though, I believe that HRH Charles sometimes stands in for HM his mum in doing the whole knighting thing. In other words, he’s a sub dubber.