# Buah and the Pope **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 11, 2007, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604 "2007-06-11T19:26:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2007, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/1 "2007-06-11T19:26:42Z")
I missed this one, but someone came chortling into my office with it just now. apparently on Saturday, Bush addressed the Pope as “Sir”, rather than the expected “Your Holiness”. It’s not a big thing, but I think previous presidents have used the title “Holiness”. Bush was certainly being polite, but this makes it look as if he needs to brush up on his protocol: [http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070609/od\_afp/vaticanpopebushgaffe](http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070609/od_afp/vaticanpopebushgaffe) ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2007, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/2 "2007-06-11T19:43:36Z")
I wonder what crossing your legs “Texan-style” means? ---
**Author:** ![Lamar\_Mundane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Lamar\_Mundane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamar_Mundane)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2007, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/3 "2007-06-11T19:49:45Z")
At least he didn’t say **Bu-yah!** ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2007, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/4 "2007-06-11T19:56:58Z")
Pfft. I say good for him. It’s about time we get rid of these barbaric forms of address like “your holiness” and “your majesty” and “el duderino,” (if you’re not into the whole brevity thing.) ---
**Author:** ![Quiddity\_Glomfuster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/c4cdca/32.png) [@Quiddity\_Glomfuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quiddity_Glomfuster)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2007, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/5 "2007-06-11T19:57:14Z")
[QUOTE=CalMeacham] I missed this one, but someone came chortling into my office with it just now. apparently on Saturday, Bush addressed the Pope as “Sir”, rather than the expected “Your Holiness”. It’s not a big thing, but I think previous presidents have used the title “Holiness”. Bush was certainly being polite, but this makes it look as if he needs to brush up on his protocol: [http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070609/od\_afp/vaticanpopebushgaffe](http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070609/od_afp/vaticanpopebushgaffe) [/QUOTE] You mean him chewing with his mouth open and talking to Blair with his mouth full wasn’t a clue already? No, I don’t have the link and can’t be bothered to find it but it was at some high-end event where he made some bumbleheaded remark to Blair - I think about the war. Or the YouTube clip recently where he horks up a loogey and spits it across the WH lawn while making his way to his helicopter? Oh yeah, he’s class personified, that one. ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2007, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/6 "2007-06-11T20:31:48Z")
Wait a minute. Step back for some perspective. Here in the US, we like to play at being egalitarian. We don’t bow to kings, because they’re only human. We don’t kiss the ring of the top Methodist, and I see no reason to call Pope Benedict “your holiness.” He’s just a man, a man who dresses rather oddly. Our dimwitted president is a protestant Christian, not a Catholic. There’s no reason for him to act like Benedict rules over him. GWB routinely first-names heads of state. The pontiff is technically a head of state, but the Vatican is smaller than some college campuses. I’m surprised our George didn’t call him Benny or Joe. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2007, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/7 "2007-06-11T21:00:33Z")
[QUOTE=Quiddity Glomfuster] You mean him chewing with his mouth open and talking to Blair with his mouth full wasn’t a clue already? No, I don’t have the link and can’t be bothered to find it but it was at some high-end event where he made some bumbleheaded remark to Blair - I think about the war. Or the YouTube clip recently where he horks up a loogey and spits it across the WH lawn while making his way to his helicopter? Oh yeah, he’s class personified, that one. [/QUOTE] “How ya Doin’, Popey?” ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2007, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/8 "2007-06-11T21:02:29Z")
Was this before or after he gave him a relaxing backrub? ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2007, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/9 "2007-06-11T23:35:00Z")
[QUOTE=CalMeacham] Bush addressed the Pope as “Sir”, rather than the expected “Your Holiness”. It’s not a big thing, but I think previous presidents have used the title “Holiness”. Bush was certainly being polite, but this makes it look as if he needs to brush up on his protocol: [/QUOTE] Jesus God Man! GW Bush actually addressed a world leader in a respectful tone! That alone should have been headline news. Screw the exact words some ponce in a dress demands to be called. GW called him “Sir!” :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Blaster\_Master](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/cab0a1/32.png) [@Blaster\_Master](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blaster_Master)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2007, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/10 "2007-06-11T23:45:23Z")
[QUOTE=friedo] Pfft. I say good for him. It’s about time we get rid of these barbaric forms of address like “your holiness” and “your majesty” and “el duderino,” (if you’re not into the whole brevity thing.) [/QUOTE] I would tend to agree. I am not a British subject, so I will not call the queen “Your Highness” were I to meet her. She deserves my respect, so I would call her “Ma’am” or “Queen”, but not “Your Highness”. Similarly, I am not Catholic. I respect the pope, so I will call him “Sir” or “Pope”, but not “Your Holiness”. Also, just because someone is a Captain or a doctor or professor, unless they’re my commanding officer (as a part of my job as a contractor) or my doctor/professor, I don’t see the need to address them with a special title. However, anyone who goes by “el duderino”, probably should, just so they get the attention they deserve. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2007, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/11 "2007-06-12T00:25:42Z")
> [@](#): > > Jesus God Man! GW Bush actually addressed a world leader in a respectful tone! That alone should have been headline news. Screw the exact words some ponce in a dress demands to be called. GW called him “Sir!” Yep, and he gets credit for being polite. But he loses points for not knowing the protocol that every other president knew, and he should have. ---
**Author:** ![dangermom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e274bd/32.png) [@dangermom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dangermom)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2007, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/12 "2007-06-12T00:32:29Z")
Maybe he knows the protocol and chose to address the Pope in the ‘wrong’ way. Personally, I would not be able to call the Pope “His Holiness,” any more than I would call the Queen of Denmark “Your Majesty.” It doesn’t strike me as a very _good_ protocol, and perhaps it should be changed for us non-Catholics. I have nothing against the Pope, but he’s not my religious leader. ---
**Author:** ![Quiddity\_Glomfuster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/c4cdca/32.png) [@Quiddity\_Glomfuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quiddity_Glomfuster)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2007, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/13 "2007-06-12T00:37:49Z")
Um. They’re titles. It doesn’t mean that you feel ‘ruled’ by them. It’s a matter of good manners. Which, apparently, quite a few people are lacking. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2007, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/14 "2007-06-12T01:01:17Z")
[QUOTE=Quiddity Glomfuster] Um. They’re titles. It doesn’t mean that you feel ‘ruled’ by them. It’s a matter of good manners. Which, apparently, quite a few people are lacking. [/QUOTE] Not to mention that Bush is a _guest_ in a foreign country, yet decides to ignore the protocol of that country in addresing it’s leader. It is rude. ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2007, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/15 "2007-06-12T02:03:03Z")
[QUOTE=Quiddity Glomfuster] Um. They’re titles. It doesn’t mean that you feel ‘ruled’ by them. It’s a matter of good manners. Which, apparently, quite a few people are lacking. [/QUOTE] I’d personally feel more disrespectful if I called the Pope “Your Holiness” than if I called him “sir” or something; after all, I don’t think he’s holy. Calling him by a title I don’t believe he holds shows no respect for him at all. Wheras “sir” does, since I genuinely believe he is entitled to some sort of respect. Same for the Queen; Ma’am’s ok, but I don’t think she’s “higher” than me. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2007, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/16 "2007-06-12T02:08:21Z")
Yeeesh! You guys can’t even get your rudeness right. You need to refuse to call the **queen** “your majesty”; a **princess** would (not) be “highness.” 😃 ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2007, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/17 "2007-06-12T02:13:41Z")
[QUOTE=Quiddity Glomfuster] Um. They’re titles. It doesn’t mean that you feel ‘ruled’ by them. It’s a matter of good manners. Which, apparently, quite a few people are lacking. [/QUOTE] It’s not a matter of good manners. It’s a matter of submitting oneself to “traditions” born of centuries of relentless savagery. Monarchy in any form is a disgusting evil which I dearly hope I will live to see ended, and no one should feel obligated to participate in such disgusting ritual no matter how quaint it may be. ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2007, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/18 "2007-06-12T02:14:48Z")
Meh – I think the _more_ titles there are, the more interesting it is. And if you use _everybody_’s title, it doesn’t mean you owe allegiance to any of them, now does it? Besides, it gives me an ironic little thrill to write Amnesty International letters to sanguinary dictators and address them as “your excellency.” ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2007, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/19 "2007-06-12T02:57:18Z")
[QUOTE=Quiddity Glomfuster] Um. They’re titles. It doesn’t mean that you feel ‘ruled’ by them. It’s a matter of good manners. Which, apparently, quite a few people are lacking. [/QUOTE] So if I decide that the proper address for me is “Your Amazing Magnificence”, you would expect the Pope and the President of the US to address me this way? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2007, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604/20 "2007-06-12T03:10:13Z")
Hey, I like the Daily Show’s idea. I think more Popes should be called The Popenator. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buah-and-the-pope/407604.md?page=2)