# Buffy Spinoff **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 21, 2003, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587 "2003-05-21T16:22:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![audit1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ed8c4c/32.png) [@audit1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/audit1)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2003, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/21 "2003-05-23T15:59:18Z")
Of course any spin off has to feature CLEM. ---
**Author:** ![Judith\_Prietht](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b19c9b/32.png) [@Judith\_Prietht](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Judith_Prietht)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2003, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/22 "2003-05-23T16:24:02Z")
Perhaps Clem and Lorne can run some kind of Vegas-like establishment, with kitten poker and demon lounge acts. ---
**Author:** ![Psycho\_Pirate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Psycho\_Pirate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Psycho_Pirate)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2003, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/23 "2003-05-23T16:53:25Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Thea Logica_ > **But maybe Dawn discovering that she really does have powers related to her former Key-ness, maybe an ability to open dimensional portals or something… nah, too Sliders.** See, I think there could have been potential for a Dawn series. Here we have a largely unexplored character with a strange origin. Have there been other Key-like people? Does she have powers? If so, what are they? I’ve always thought that Joss missed a huge opportunity to give Dawn’s character a boost in Once More with Feeling, the great singing episode. I never liked the fact that _Xander_ of all people was the one who summoned Sweet. I would have much preferred the following explanation: Dawn had been stealing things from the Magix Box, and grabbed Sweet’s token. She inadvertantly summoned him by wishing for attention while she was holding it. To me, the episode works MUCH better this way. Sweet’s song makes more sense too. Sweet (singing to Dawn): _’Cause I know what you feel, girl._ and _“I’m here strictly by your invocation”_ and _“You brought me down into this town”_ Giles or Willow could have helped her develop her powers, and she could have been used to summon things, open all kinds of cool portals, stuff like that. At least, that’s how I wish it would have gone in my mind. I can’t be the only one that’s thought of this. If her character had been explored just a _little_ bit more, she might have been able to carry a spin off. Oh well. That’s my two cents. ---
**Author:** ![Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19adc/32.png) [@Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2003, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/24 "2003-05-23T17:47:44Z")
Samm Finn? ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2003, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/25 "2003-05-23T17:48:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Otto \* > \*\*Whoosh! \*\* Are you sure? A lot of people haven’t seen Angel. Wow, I’ve never been officialy wooshed before. 🙂 Oh, and in my previous post, that should have been “widow”, not “widower”. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2003, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/26 "2003-05-23T17:52:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Barbarian \* > \*\*Samm Finn? \*\* The girls I know named Samantha spell their shortened name. Samm. I have no idea why. ---
**Author:** ![spectrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9fc29f/32.png) [@spectrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spectrum)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2003, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/27 "2003-05-23T19:47:43Z")
Actually Psycho, since Dawn had the amulet and had been doing stuff like this before, and Xander was confused by all the singing earlier, I think it’s safe to assume that Xander didn’t call down Sweets, but was trying to cover for Dawn. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2003, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/28 "2003-05-23T19:48:01Z")
Psycho Pirate > [@](#): > > Sweet’s song makes more sense too. Sweet’s song makes sense in context as is. His puppet-guys kidnapped her because she had his talisman. It was reasonable for him to believe she summoned him. Mahaloth > [@](#): > > Are you sure? A lot of people haven’t seen Angel. Well, I’m not _sure_ but given that “Who’s Connor?” was from the AtS finale it seemed likely. ---
**Author:** ![Homebrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Homebrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homebrew)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2003, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/29 "2003-05-23T19:50:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Psycho Pirate \* > **I never liked the fact that _Xander_ of all people was the one who summoned Sweet.** I _still_ maintain that Xander did not summon Sweet. He was just covering for Dawn to save her. When he claimed to have summoned Sweet, watch her grateful reaction. ---
**Author:** ![spectrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9fc29f/32.png) [@spectrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spectrum)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2003, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/30 "2003-05-23T19:53:03Z")
Actually Psycho, since Dawn had the amulet and had been doing stuff like this before, and Xander was confused by all the singing earlier, I think it’s safe to assume that Xander didn’t call down Sweets, but was trying to cover for Dawn. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2003, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/31 "2003-05-23T19:59:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Krokodil \* > I’d love to see a show about Riley and Sam Finn, “Nick and Nora Fury” as Xander called 'em. Call it “The Initiative.” > > As for the other Scoobies–either do a movie, with Buffy, or let it go. If there was ever a show featuring Riley “VampJohn” Finn and his Stepford wife, I think I’d projectile vomit hard enough to hit you in Alexandria, VA, **Krokodil**. No offense, but I am one of those people (and I’m not alone) who thinks Riley is a cretin and his wife is a mouse with a really big gun. As You Were was the worst ep of S6, a season rife with candidates for that title. Boo! Now, Sam a a widow… that I could live with. Then she’d be bitter and sad and not so sickeningly sweet. ---
**Author:** ![FallenAngel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@FallenAngel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FallenAngel)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2003, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/32 "2003-05-23T21:38:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Judith Prietht \* > \*\*Perhaps Clem and Lorne can run some kind of Vegas-like establishment, with kitten poker and demon lounge acts. \*\* Perhaps Clem and Lorne can get sucked, intact, to the 9th Circle of Hell and can replace Cassius and Brutus as Lucifer’s chew toys for the rest of eternity. I really really despise both characters, in case you couldn’t tell. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2003, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/33 "2003-05-23T22:08:06Z")
For those who don’t believe Xander summoned Sweet, I refer you to S7’s all-Anya extravaganza, _Selfless_. We see Xander sleeping in his chair while people are singing outside, and Xander mumbles in his sleep something about how he wanted to be sure he and Anya had a happy ending. The same thing he said when he fessed up in OMWF, before he would have any possible reason to say so to cover for anyone. At least one [episode guide](http://www.tvtome.com/BuffytheVampireSlayer/season7.html) claims that Sweet’s talisman is visible in Xander’s hand while Anya sings “Mrs.” ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2003, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/34 "2003-05-23T22:22:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Otto \* > \*\* > > Mahaloth Well, I’m not _sure_ but given that “Who’s Connor?” was from the AtS finale it seemed likely. \*\* Oh, yeah. I think you’re right. ---
**Author:** ![Psycho\_Pirate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Psycho\_Pirate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Psycho_Pirate)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2003, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/35 "2003-05-24T01:32:43Z")
Thanks to all who pointed out that Dawn was wearing Sweet’s talisman when she was kidnapped, so the context of the song does make sense from that standpoint. However, I still hold my opinion that it was **LAME** that Xander summoned Sweet. I think it would have been more entertaining to have Dawn stumble upon some type of Key-power, where she could open portals and summon things just by concentrating on a specific talisman or object. Not saying that she is the only one that could summon things, just that she could do it easier than others because of her “Key” nature. ---
**Author:** ![Homebrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Homebrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homebrew)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2003, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/36 "2003-05-24T03:43:37Z")
_My_ fantasy world requires that Xander was covering for Dawn. But I can directly address this part: > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Otto \* > \*\* At least one [episode guide](http://www.tvtome.com/BuffytheVampireSlayer/season7.html) claims that Sweet’s talisman is visible in Xander’s hand while Anya sings “Mrs.” \*\* Dawn picks up the talisman at 8:53 into the episode. Anya and Xander’s duo was later at 13:40. All of the regulars were shown in the Magic Box at about 1:30-2:00, so anyone could have had access to the talisman. (Another remarkable part of that episode is that it’s 2 minutes in before anyone says - or sings - anything.) ---
**Author:** ![Homebrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Homebrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homebrew)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2003, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/37 "2003-05-24T03:47:14Z")
Scratch that. The episode guide is claiming that Xander is holding the talisman in the “flashback” in _Selfless_. ---
**Author:** ![Delly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Delly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Delly)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2003, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/38 "2003-05-24T04:00:22Z")
Silly question time, on these boards I’ve seen Angel refered to as AtS, what does that mean exactly? is the show not just called Angel overe there? Im confooosed 😕 ---
**Author:** ![ryoushi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@ryoushi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ryoushi)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2003, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/39 "2003-05-24T04:08:32Z")
We need to have a spinoff about Sweet, searching for his queen… ---
**Author:** ![Fiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e274bd/32.png) [@Fiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiver)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2003, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587/40 "2003-05-24T04:57:22Z")
_Angel the Series_, **Delly**. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/buffy-spinoff/176587.md?page=3)