# Bundy's and ilk go free. Damn them **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 25, 2017, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617 "2017-08-25T00:29:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/41 "2017-08-25T18:07:59Z")
> [@JackieLikesVariety](#): > > that sums them up, alright That one prick with the foster kids was not just taking the money, he was also using them as “forced labor” on his poor excuse for a ranch. He was using them as his own personal welfare system. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/42 "2017-08-25T18:17:10Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > They are criminals, conspirators, and terrorists as far as I’m concerned. > > But, since they are white and wear cowboy hats, they are made out to be fuckin’ heroes. IIUC there was a mistake made when the charges concentrated on conspiracies (that I think were valid, but as we can see not very useful to convict) instead of concentrating on property damage and trespassing. Yeah, not bound to get one longer jail terms there, but IMHO and AFAIK the whole book was not thrown at them because it was thought that the more serious charges would stick. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/43 "2017-08-25T19:27:16Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Do you feel the same way about the Native Americans who forcibly occupied Alcatraz for two years? The government didn’t prosecute any of them. > > There should be a single policy to deal with anyone who occupies federal land illegally. Nice example of “Whataboutism” if I ever saw one. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/44 "2017-08-25T19:29:06Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > IIUC there was a mistake made when the charges concentrated on conspiracies (that I think were valid, but as we can see not very useful to convict) instead of concentrating on property damage and trespassing. Yeah, not bound to get one longer jail terms there, but IMHO and AFAIK the whole book was not thrown at them because it was thought that the more serious charges would stick. They blew it. Conspiracy is HARD to prove. However, it would be easy to prove they destroyed federal property, trespassed, vandalized, made threats, etc etc etc. They blew it. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/45 "2017-08-25T19:35:05Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > They blew it. > > Conspiracy is HARD to prove. However, it would be easy to prove they destroyed federal property, trespassed, vandalized, made threats, etc etc etc. > > They blew it. They blew it, and not only did they blow it, I think that they have enabled and encouraged this type of behavior. Now, I think Obama was far softer on them than he should have been, but he was always walking on eggshells, and just about everything he did was a politically calculated half measure that never really solved the problem. I wonder if Trump would even send a squad car to ask them to leave, or if he would just go ahead and sign the sanctuary right on over. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/46 "2017-08-25T19:42:55Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > They blew it, and not only did they blow it, I think that they have enabled and encouraged this type of behavior. > > Now, I think Obama was far softer on them than he should have been, but he was always walking on eggshells, and just about everything he did was a politically calculated half measure that never really solved the problem. > > I wonder if Trump would even send a squad car to ask them to leave, or if he would just go ahead and sign the sanctuary right on over. They’re his kind of people. He’d enable them and make some “both sides good people” bullshit tweet. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/47 "2017-08-25T20:23:45Z")
A legal system where charging for a higher crime gets you off for a lower crime you do have enough evidence for is a bad one. If it’s the lawyers’ fault for not including lesser charges, then that should be considered incompetence and there should be a remedy for their misconduct, like maybe allowing the state to sue them. I am thus not satisfied with any explanation about overcharging. That should not be a method by which people can go free. It’s still an indication that there is something wrong in the system that this can happen. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/48 "2017-08-25T20:53:50Z")
Is it double jeopardy to charge them a second time for a different brace of crimes? To go back and make up for leaving part of the book on the table? ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/49 "2017-08-25T22:14:40Z")
Welcome to Trump’s White Trash Nation. Armed white men get off and unarmed black men get a bullet. Praise Jesus. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/50 "2017-08-25T22:18:41Z")
I bet it’s just a matter of time, before Dead Eye Cliven Bundy and his gang that couldn’t shoot straight get into another “situation”. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/51 "2017-08-25T22:26:17Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > I bet it’s just a matter of time, before Dead Eye Cliven Bundy and his gang that couldn’t shoot straight get into another “situation”. If they do, hopefully the proper authorities will spare them having to go through a new trial. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/52 "2017-08-25T22:27:36Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > If they do, hopefully the proper authorities will spare them having to go through a new trial. Well last time ONE did manage to commit “suicide by cop”. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/53 "2017-08-25T22:41:51Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > If they do, hopefully the proper authorities will spare them having to go through a new trial. I think it’s abhorrent to suggest that cops should take extralegal action to eliminate criminals. Here’s hoping the dipshits accidentally shoot _themselves_. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/54 "2017-08-25T22:48:46Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > Well last time ONE did manage to commit “suicide by cop”. Yep. Poor guy never got to live out [his dream of lynching a woman](https://www.buzzfeed.com/jimdalrympleii/oregon-militia-members-post-apocalyptic-book-bears-striking?utm_term=.neomoNYeq#.glwQqzZDP). ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/55 "2017-08-25T22:56:41Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > Yep. Poor guy never got to live out [his dream of lynching a woman](https://www.buzzfeed.com/jimdalrympleii/oregon-militia-members-post-apocalyptic-book-bears-striking?utm_term=.neomoNYeq#.glwQqzZDP). The wheel’s spinning, but the hamster’s dead Couldn’t pour water out of a boot with instructions on the heel Nuttier than squirrel shit ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2017, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/56 "2017-08-25T23:26:27Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > If they do, hopefully the proper authorities will spare them having to go through a new trial. Why do you want them killed? Who else would you like to see killed by “the proper authorities?” ---
**Author:** ![Fubaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@Fubaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fubaya)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/57 "2017-08-26T03:52:30Z")
It’s maybe worth noting that all the Bundys are still in jail awaiting trial. Every last one of them are in jail and have been for a year and a half. The people found not guilty were 4 lesser assholes. Two people have been found guilty already, with one getting 68 years. The other hasn’t been sentenced yet. This gets confusing because the trials are all mixed up. Some defendants opted to sever their case and one group had their trial a few months ago which led to the two convictions and a mistrial for the other four. This was the retrial of the mistrial. I get it. I have almost lost hope that justice will be served, but remember that the big assholes still haven’t gone to court and the biggest one that’s gone to court so far got 68 years. And he is 53 years old, blind, has seizures and is in a wheelchair. And the judge _reduced_ his sentence to 68 years. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/58 "2017-08-26T04:25:39Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > Why do you want them killed? That’s the attitude inevitably created when it’s made obvious that a group is above the law. If the law of the state no longer applies then we are reduced to the law of the jungle; brute force, enforcing behavior by simply killing violators. If these right wing militias are allowed to run wild occupying, looting places and attacking people and the government refuses to stop them, eventually their victims will form their own gangs and fight back. Of course since\* those \*groups won’t be a bunch of white right wingers, I expect the government will massacre them. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 10:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/59 "2017-08-26T10:48:03Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > That’s the attitude inevitably created when it’s made obvious that a group is above the law. If the law of the state no longer applies then we are reduced to the law of the jungle; brute force, enforcing behavior by simply killing violators. > > If these right wing militias are allowed to run wild occupying, looting places and attacking people and the government refuses to stop them, eventually their victims will form their own gangs and fight back. Of course since\* those \*groups won’t be a bunch of white right wingers, I expect the government will massacre them. Does the law of the state not apply to them? They were arrested and stood trial. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2017, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617/60 "2017-08-26T11:12:49Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > Does the law of the state not apply to them? They were arrested and stood trial. Meaningless; they were treated with kid gloves in the original confrontation, and will go free for no better reason than the fact that they are white and right wing. If they’d been black, left wing or Muslim they’d have been unlikely to have survived long enough for a trial, much less have gone unpunished. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bundys-and-ilk-go-free-damn-them/794617.md?page=4)