# Bunkers under Washington **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 18, 2018, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bunkers-under-washington/819830 "2018-08-18T14:53:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bunkers-under-washington/819830/21 "2018-08-20T01:11:18Z")
> [@Gray\_Ghost](#): > > I get the feeling that NUKEMAP varies quite a bit in its crater making, and to be true, Gladstone does say that, IIRC. I don’t think the same bomb is carving out quite as big a hole in, e.g., solid granite, as it will in fill or sedimentary soils. I’m sure that in real life the crater for a surface burst of given yield _would_ vary depending on what kind of surface it was bursting on. Playing with NUKEMAP, a 500 kiloton surface burst makes a crater with an inside radius of 150 meters, depth 70 meters, crater lip radius 310 meters, regardless of where you put it. So it’s clearly an approximation. (Wannabe super-villains seeking to construct atomic-bomb-proof underground lairs, take note.) ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2018, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bunkers-under-washington/819830/22 "2018-08-20T01:23:16Z")
> [@SamuelA](#): > > _Secret_ underground bunkers away from other strategic targets would be just fine. Even surface buildings stocked with survival gear would be fine, assuming they are a significant distance from the ground zeroes. The problem is the fallout plume will soon come and if you don’t have a way get enough feet of material between you and the fallout particles, and also filter the air and wash off contaminants from people entering and leaving, you may still die. > > So bunkers that the enemy doesn’t target because they either don’t know they exist or they are too small to bother with are what would make it. Fair enough, but there’s still the issue of what happens if your expensive secret underground bunker [ceases to be secret](https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Kelvedon_Hatch_Nuclear_Bunker#/media/File:Chipping_Ongar_MMB_01.jpg). Once the beans are spilled on something like [the Greenbrier](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Greek_Island) then (at least in the event of a full-scale nuclear war) that location presumably _will_ now be targeted by the Other Side. (The beans could be spilled by your own nosy and loudmouthed journalists, politicians, or taxpayers; by the Other Side spotting the bunker from space, especially during the construction phase; or by old-fashioned spying.) I guess you could build a very large number of bunkers all over the country (and keep it a secret which ones you actually plan on using) so at least the Other Side will have to waste a lot of firepower playing nuclear Whack-A-Mole with your Continuity of Government plans. ---
**Author:** ![busterpickle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/258eb7/32.png) [@busterpickle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/busterpickle)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bunkers-under-washington/819830/23 "2018-08-21T06:04:54Z")
> [@SamuelA](#): > > The PEOC exists, right? There’s at least a few bunkers in DC. Wikipedia says so, and there appear to be official pics of it abound. However, in the classical sense, a bunker need not be underground, nor safe from nuclear blast. I imagine something like the PEOC would be a secure area to make decisions and pass on leadership or continuity of operations to a remote party if need be. I think… it’s safe to say that more than one nuke would be on it’s way to DC. Probably a combination of air, surface, and sub-surface warheads. The whole area and like miles around will become an irradiated crater. We’d have a lake though for sure. ---
**Author:** ![BlueOhio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/439d5e/32.png) [@BlueOhio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlueOhio)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bunkers-under-washington/819830/25 "2018-08-21T12:54:44Z")
The User Name & Location field coupled with the very specific question is sure to trigger a government surveillance response. Good luck Paul. ---
**Author:** ![WreckingCrew](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wreckingcrew/32/4080_2.png) [@WreckingCrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WreckingCrew)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bunkers-under-washington/819830/26 "2018-08-21T13:57:39Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > You can go through one if you set up a tour to do it first. You even get to ride the electric rail that’s been in use there for decades. > > As for tunnels, there is [Site R](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raven_Rock_Mountain_Complex) (the Raven Rock Mountain Complex), located in Pennsylvania. It’s not a secret, as there are people living nearby, but it’s pretty impressive inside (I was able to visit it when my company had a construction project going on there). I can tell you that it has huge blast doors and its own underground bus service. My wife’s uncles owned a small construction company near there, and both of them and her grandfather each drove hundreds of truckloads of concrete in there during an 1970s expansion. The most the one uncle will say about it is “they did some work for the Army.” ---
**Author:** ![Dobbs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Dobbs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dobbs)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2018, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bunkers-under-washington/819830/27 "2018-08-21T18:09:07Z")
> [@electronbee](#): > > DC is also a lot of reclaimed swamp, due to proximity to the Potomac River. So, not only would building a bunker hundreds of feet down be problematic, maintenance would be costly. You’d also have to consider how to pump the water once the utilities are offline after an attack. Probably be OK for a little bit, the exit would have to be built in such a way that it’s waterproofed top to bottom so a water column that’s hundred of feet high doesn’t occur. > > Doing some guesstimating, a four foot diameter by 300 foot shaft would have about a million pounds of water in it. > > Be much better to get outta dodge. Which would be via VF-22 due to its higher top speed and ceiling. Doubt they’d have time to go to DCA, board a larger aircraft, and then take off. No, Washington was not built on a swamp. > **[No, D.C. isn’t really built on a swamp](https://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/08/29/no-dc-isnt-really-built-on-a-swamp/?utm_term=.43f5ce44d897)** > > Putting an urban legend to rest, once and for all. > **[The Myth That Washington Was a Swamp Will Never Go Away](https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/draining-swamp-guide-outsiders-and-career-politicians-180962448/)** > > It makes for a catchy slogan used by politicians of all persuasions, but there's little truth to it Any bunker worthy of the name will have it’s own generators (plural) and fuel tanks to run them for days until they can be resupplied, by military convoy if needed. A hole full of water? It’s called a well, and would be a worthwhile thing to have if you were expecting to spend a few weeks hiding away. It’s not a bug, it’s a design feature. Evac by aircraft? Depending on who you’re talking about, you’re right, DCA is right out. Andrews, on the other hand, has several aircraft of various sizes that belong to the government, all available if need be. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bunkers-under-washington/819830.md?page=1)