# Burning books in the US...'Burn Quran Day' **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 20, 2010, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891 "2010-08-20T17:58:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/181 "2010-08-23T18:13:09Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > You implied that extremist actions have been left on the scrap heap of history by Christianity. The fact that Christians continue to blow things up would seem to put the lie to that claim, even if they aren’t very good at it. No, just the interpretation of the writings. If both said kill unbelievers while one is interpreted to be just stories in the past and the other the actual spoken word of god that is as current today as when it was spoken, then it is likely that the latter will be used as a justification more so than the latter. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/182 "2010-08-23T18:13:33Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > > [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > > > Yeah, it’s a good thing modern Christians don’t blow up abortion clinics or anything. > > How many abortion clinics have been blown up? Only a couple but it seems like a handful of them were set on fire or had someone drive their car into through them. > **[Anti-abortion violence](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-abortion_violence)** > > Anti-abortion violence is violence committed against individuals and organizations that perform abortions or provide abortion counseling. Incidents of violence have included destruction of property, including vandalism; crimes against people, including kidnapping, stalking, assault, attempted murder, and murder; and crimes affecting both people and property, as well as arson and terrorism, such as bombings. > Anti-abortion extremists are considered a current domestic terrorist threat by the Unit... [QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] I’m not talking about jail, I’m talking about apartheid. [/QUOTE] What apartheid? [/QUOTE] I think he’s talking about Palestine. Its a crime what is going on over there. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/183 "2010-08-23T18:14:33Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > > [@Uzi](#): > > > > How many abortion clinics have been blown up? > > [41](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-abortion_violence#Arson.2C_bombing.2C_and_property_crime) in the US and Canada since 1977, not including unsuccessful attempts or arson. Why? I stand corrected. I only read the examples I didn’t realize they were only select examples. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/184 "2010-08-23T18:15:43Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > > [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > > > When the fuck can we call out the global Muslim community for these assholes in their midst? We call out the otherwise inoffensive teabaggers for the racists in their midst and attribute some of that racism to all of them, why can’t we call out the muslims for the murdering terrorists that their population seems to generate with such frequency? > > We don’t call out teabaggers. We call out the Tea Party. We don’t call out Muslims. We call out radical Islam. > > Get it? No, what are you trying to get at? ---
**Author:** ![Uzi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/91b2a8/32.png) [@Uzi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uzi)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/185 "2010-08-23T18:16:44Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I think he’s talking about Palestine. See post #170 ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/186 "2010-08-23T18:18:22Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > > [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > > > You implied that extremist actions have been left on the scrap heap of history by Christianity. The fact that Christians continue to blow things up would seem to put the lie to that claim, even if they aren’t very good at it. > > No, just the interpretation of the writings. If both said kill unbelievers while one is interpreted to be just stories in the past and the other the actual spoken word of god that is as current today as when it was spoken, then it is likely that the latter will be used as a justification more so than the latter. Are you under the impression that there aren’t presently Christians who believe the Bible is the inerrant spoken word of god? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/187 "2010-08-23T18:21:52Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > > [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > > > Where do I vilify all muslims? I am asking why does islam produce so much terrorism. > > Which is a perfectly valid question. It’s a question with an unsupported premise. I could just as easily as why Catholicism produced so many terrorsist in ireland, or why Serbian Orthodox Church produced so many mass murderes and rapists. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/188 "2010-08-23T18:22:41Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > > > OK, so what percentage of acts of terrorism in the last 10, 20, 30, 40 or 50 years do you think were committed by Muslims? I’m not saying that any appreciable percentage of mulsims are terrorists but I am saying that a significant percentage of terrorists are muslims. > > The population in US prisons is disproprtionately black. What does that say about black people? Prison population might mean a lot of things, but if you told me that most crimes were committed by blacks, I would say that it probably means that the black community has a problem with crime. That no matter how badly we can feel about the raw deal they have gotten in this country we cannot excuse that we crime or pussyfoot around the fact that the crime exists in an effort to spare the feelings of the majority of blacks who are not criminals. We have to say: WTF is causing all this crime in the black community. What we shouldn’t do is pretend that there isn’t a crime problem in the black community and say “well white people commit crime too” Now I think a large part of the prison population in the black community (to the extent that it is not explained by socioeconmic forces) boil down to federal drug sentencing guidelines and rap music but that’s just me. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/189 "2010-08-23T18:24:35Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > There are just as many things in the Bible that call for extremist action. > > Yeah but a lot more terrorist seem to be quoting stuff from the Quran than from Leviticus. And most Christian terrorsist quote from the Bible. > [@](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > For the vast majority of Muslims, yes they have. > > Absolutely. The vast VAST majority of Muslims (especially Muslims in America) are regular folks but when you look at terroism around the world these days most terrorists seem to be associated with islam. I disagree. I think we’re just very selective about what we want to label as “terrorism.” ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/190 "2010-08-23T18:29:20Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > The US actually has some of the least problems and violence in the world from native and transpalnted Muslims because we don’t ghettoize them as in some other parts of the world, but give them the same rights and opportunities we have. > > You could also translate this as long as you keep them from gathering into sufficient numbers you have no problems with them. No you couldn’t. We have not done that, and in fact, trying to STOP them from gathering is what’s going to cause problems (aside from just being ethcally wrong). ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/191 "2010-08-23T18:32:11Z")
> [@Uzi](#): > > > [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > > > You implied that extremist actions have been left on the scrap heap of history by Christianity. The fact that Christians continue to blow things up would seem to put the lie to that claim, even if they aren’t very good at it. > > No, just the interpretation of the writings. If both said kill unbelievers while one is interpreted to be just stories in the past and the other the actual spoken word of god that is as current today as when it was spoken, then it is likely that the latter will be used as a justification more so than the latter. The Qur’an doesn’t say to kill unbelievers. That is a myth. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/192 "2010-08-23T18:33:43Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > The population in US prisons is disproprtionately black. What does that say about black people? > > Prison population might mean a lot of things, but if you told me that most crimes were committed by blacks, I would say that it probably means that the black community has a problem with crime. That would not be a supportable conclusion. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/193 "2010-08-23T18:47:34Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > > > OK I guess you are right but I did see a lot of “this pastor is an asshole for wanting to burn books” with percious few “that imam is an asshole for wanting to build a mosque so close to the twin towers” > > Because there is absolutely zero equivalency there. Building a mosque is not offensive and not an insult. It’s offensive to say it’s offensive. Hey its not offensive to me but I can certainly see how it would be offensive to others. If your brother or daughter or lover was killed on 9/11 by people who were citing the Quran as the authority under which they committed that crime, you don’t think there is anything offensive about building a mosque right there? OK, let me try this analogy (although I’m sure there will be someone who will point out why it is totally inapposite without even trying to get the point I am trying to make): In 1950, 9 years after the attack on Pearl Harbor, the some japanese folks in Hawaii decide to build a Shinto temple and Japanese cultural center across the street from Pearl Harbor, don’t you think it would be understandable that some people would get upset? Some people seem to bend over backwards and go out of their way to try and understand why terrorists and could give fuck all about the sensitivities of the folks who lost loved ones on 9/11. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/194 "2010-08-23T18:50:21Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > > > what percentage of terrorism is commtted by muslims? > > Who’s killed more civilians in the past 20 years, Muslims or the US? > > Incidentally, are you familiar with the ethnic cleansing (i.e genocide and mass rape) of Muslims by Christians that occurred in Bosnia in very recent memory? Why don’t the Islamaphobes ever bring that up? By terrorism? I’m pretty sure the answer is islamic terrorists. If you want to include civilian casualties in Iraq and stuff like that I guess I’d have to say Islamic terrorists/insurgents but that’s kind fo besides the point. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/195 "2010-08-23T18:58:32Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > Because there is absolutely zero equivalency there. Building a mosque is not offensive and not an insult. It’s offensive to say it’s offensive. > > Hey its not offensive to me but I can certainly see how it would be offensive to others. If your brother or daughter or lover was killed on 9/11 by people who were citing the Quran as the authority under which they committed that crime, you don’t think there is anything offensive about building a mosque right there? No. There’s nothing remotely offensive about it. If you had a loved one killed by an abortion bomber, would you be offended if someone built a church nearby? > [@](#): > > In 1950, 9 years after the attack on Pearl Harbor, the some japanese folks in Hawaii decide to build a Shinto temple and Japanese cultural center across the street from Pearl Harbor, don’t you think it would be understandable that some people would get upset? No I don’t think it would be understandable at all. The Shinto religion had nothing to do with pearl harbor. Do you think it would be offensive to build a Christian church in Tokyo or Hiroshima? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/196 "2010-08-23T19:01:55Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > Who’s killed more civilians in the past 20 years, Muslims or the US? > > > > Incidentally, are you familiar with the ethnic cleansing (i.e genocide and mass rape) of Muslims by Christians that occurred in Bosnia in very recent memory? Why don’t the Islamaphobes ever bring that up? > > By terrorism? I’m pretty sure the answer is islamic terrorists. “Terrorism” is in the eye of the beholder. Killing civilians is, by definition, terrorim as far as I’m concerned. > [@](#): > > If you want to include civilian casualties in Iraq and stuff like that I guess I’d have to say Islamic terrorists/insurgents but that’s kind for besides the point. You would be quite wrong on that. American bombing killed hundreds of thousands. ---
**Author:** ![qpw3141](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/6bbea6/32.png) [@qpw3141](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/qpw3141)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/197 "2010-08-23T19:09:35Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > “Terrorism” is in the eye of the beholder. Killing civilians is, by definition, terrorim as far as I’m concerned. > > You would be quite wrong on that. American bombing killed hundreds of thousands. I doubt if you will get anywhere on that tack. Damuri Ajashi is quite obviously one of those people who has a mindset that whatever one prefered ‘tribe’ does is naturally right and can never be likened to what another ‘tribe’ does which must be naturally wrong. If you ask which grouping has flown more things into more other countries and killed more people than anyone else during the last 50 years the answer, by a **vast** margin, is the US. And yet you have people obsessing about one act that was performed by some people who are not even representative of the group to which they are being primarily assigned. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/198 "2010-08-23T19:10:37Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > > [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > > > Where do I vilify all muslims? I am asking why does islam produce so much terrorism. > > Which is a perfectly valid question. It doesn’t go down well here, because the answer is, the Koran. And, oh..oogie-boogie…how dare anyone judge another’s religion? :eek: I don’t think its a religion problem and unlike you, I don’t think Muslims deserve special scrutiny but why is there so much hesitancy to admit that islam seems to breeding the vast majority of today’s terrorists. I think there is hesitancy among some muslims to entirely condemn terrorism AND THOSE ASSOCIATED WITH IT in light of what is going on in Palestine. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/199 "2010-08-23T19:26:17Z")
That last point is busllshit. The vast majority of mainstream mosques and Muslim leaders constantly and consistently condemn terrorism. There is no “hesitancy.” That’s completely false. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2010, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891/200 "2010-08-23T19:29:13Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > > [@magellan01](#): > > > > Which is a perfectly valid question. It doesn’t go down well here, because the answer is, the Koran. And, oh..oogie-boogie…how dare anyone judge another’s religion? :eek: > > I don’t think its a religion problem and unlike you, I don’t think Muslims deserve special scrutiny but why is there so much hesitancy to admit that islam seems to breeding the vast majority of today’s terrorists. I don’t think there’s any such hesitancy. There _is_ a question about whether we can, or should, do anything about it. In other words, literalist Christian churches don’t get singled out for special attention because they breed naughty people. Why should Islam? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-books-in-the-us-burn-quran-day/550891.md?page=11)