# Burning calories--beer & icewater **URL:** \ **Category:** Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports\ **Created:** [January 30, 2001, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346 "2001-01-30T02:40:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2003, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/81 "2003-02-20T05:26:41Z")
I provided a quote from the same page earlier that suggested that temperature control above 20C by change in metabolism was insignificant. If you can find something on the page that contradicts that, quote it please. It is not a question of level of proof, it is a question of level of accuracy. And given that it appears that above 20C there is little increase in metabolism, Cecil’s answer is not trivially wrong, it is grossly wrong. And don’t bother even trying to let Cec off the hook by suggesting he was only giving a rough approximation: he gives his answer to what would appear to be the nearest 10ml for goodness sake. ---
**Author:** ![RM\_Mentock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e274bd/32.png) [@RM\_Mentock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RM_Mentock)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2003, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/82 "2003-02-20T05:55:05Z")
The graphs on that page don’t line up so well. The text says one thing, the graphs another. The graph 21.8 seems to show metabolism climbing even at 26 degrees. And 20 degrees is room temperature–that’s where I usually drink my dietetic water. So I don’t think you can say that. I wasn’t talking about Cecil’s answer being a rough approximation–I meant the whole of dietary info is a rough approximation. You take a given number of grams of fat and multiply by a constant and viola you get calorie (big) content. The accuracy is misleading, true, but that’s the nature of the field, it’s not just fiddling around. It gives you a ballpark figure that you can use in planning. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2003, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/83 "2003-02-20T06:04:45Z")
20C is pretty cool for room temp nude. Don’t forget that aspect. And yes, as I said, metabolism climbs from 26 degrees but not much. ---
**Author:** ![t-keela](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a3d4f5/32.png) [@t-keela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/t-keela)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2003, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/84 "2003-02-22T14:37:33Z")
Y-J 25 it’s time to stop ---
**Author:** ![t-keela](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a3d4f5/32.png) [@t-keela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/t-keela)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2003, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/85 "2003-02-22T14:42:13Z")
pretty good timing, huh! I guess it’s time to start deleting links. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2003, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/86 "2003-03-05T12:02:41Z")
Ummmm. What? You’ve lost me, t-keela. ---
**Author:** ![t-keela](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a3d4f5/32.png) [@t-keela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/t-keela)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2003, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/87 "2003-03-06T17:31:54Z")
Sorry Princhester…the morning I posted this I was trying to stop a poster running the boards. Yummy-juice/25 was linking porn sites to all the threads. I notified the mods and webmaster and was running interference and posting behind YJ25 to get the links off the frontpage. I already apologized formally (for any improper posts on my part)and asked the mods to delete any posts I made that morning. They (the Mods) have already cleaned up the mess made that morning and did a damned good and quick job of it. There’s a couple of threads about this event. (I would link it but the Hamster’s are angry right now.) Again, I apologize for interfering w/ your debate. Peace ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2003, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/88 "2003-03-08T12:56:15Z")
Gotcha, thanks t-keela ---
**Author:** ![swansont](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5fc32e/32.png) [@swansont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/swansont)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2003, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/89 "2003-12-12T12:50:22Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Princhester \* > I don’t know why you think my analogy doesn’t hold up. It does. It does with beans too. If you drive a car from A to B, and then you drive your car from A to B with a can of cold beans on the engine, at the end of the trip the beans will have been warmed, but the engine will have used to the same fuel to get from A to B. That is true only if you don’t require that the engine be maintained at a particular temperature (and assumes that fuel efficiency does not change with engine temperature) ---
**Author:** ![maverik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc348/32.png) [@maverik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maverik)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2003, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/90 "2003-12-16T22:46:06Z")
Has anyone taken into account that alcohol as a chemical is a depressant? I would have thought as such it would slow the bodies metabolism down. Or at the least inhibit its ability to increase the speed of metabolism… ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2003, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/91 "2003-12-18T01:21:14Z")
Although alcohol is a depressant, one of the things it depresses most is self-control. It also causes blood vessels to dilate, causing an increase in heat loss that has to be made up. Therefore, although it is a depressant, it paradoxically has some of the same results as a stimulant. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2003, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/92 "2003-12-24T04:30:51Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by swansont \* > \*\*That is true only if you don’t require that the engine be maintained at a particular temperature (and assumes that fuel efficiency does not change with engine temperature) \*\* No, because engines produce more heat than they require, and control how much they therefore get rid of using a thermostat. If the cold beans affect engine temp, the thermostat will close down a little and voila, same engine temp as before, no more fuel used. ---
**Author:** ![RM\_Mentock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e274bd/32.png) [@RM\_Mentock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RM_Mentock)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2003, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/93 "2003-12-24T11:21:56Z")
Still, it will take longer to get to that point. You eventually have to take it into account somehow. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2003, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/94 "2003-12-24T11:32:32Z")
As usual, your posts are more cryptic than enlightening, RM. ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2003, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/95 "2003-12-24T16:27:47Z")
The can of beans is a red herring because an RPIC engine produces waste heat willy-nilly. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2003, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/96 "2003-12-24T20:50:52Z")
As do humans, which is why it is not a red herring. I’ve provided cites, I’ve provided calculations (after you continually berated me for not being quantitative). Now put up or shut up, John. ---
**Author:** ![John\_W.Kennedy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_w.kennedy/32/1031_2.png) [@John\_W.Kennedy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_W.Kennedy)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2003, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/97 "2003-12-24T22:48:06Z")
No, humans expend energy to maintain homeothermy. RPIC engines do not. ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2003, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/98 "2003-12-24T23:51:29Z")
I can’t believe this thread is still active. As to the “waste heat”, let’s assume that there is X amount of waste heat available just from basic metabolism. To loose weight, you’d have to consume enough cold fluid to represent a heat loss of more than X in order to force the body to begin burning calories. (Whether this results in shivering or not does not matter. I’ve heard rumors of ‘brown fat’ which burns regular lipids and produces heat, but not shivering. That would result in calorie loss, too.) The existance of X does not mean that you can’t drive the body into burning calories to make up for heat loss, it just means that there is a certain threshold value of heat loss that has to be surpassed first. Anyone want to argue that the amount of zero degree water you’d have to drink to surpass the basal heat loss X will also damage you due to dilution of electrolytes? ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [December 25, 2003, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/99 "2003-12-25T02:06:50Z")
Yes they sometimes do, John. But not usually. Usually they use by-product heat generated by other activity to maintain heat. I’ve provided cites, if you want to argue, do the same. ---
**Author:** ![RM\_Mentock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e274bd/32.png) [@RM\_Mentock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RM_Mentock)\ **Post date:** [December 26, 2003, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346/100 "2003-12-26T20:44:33Z")
I went back (ouch! almost three years of posts) to look through your cites, besides the links to Cecil’s columns: [this](http://kirtland.cc.mi.us/~balbachl/calorie.htm) at [01-13-2003 03:15 AM](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?postid=2843304#post2843304), and [this site originally cited by Truth Seeker](http://www.mfi.ku.dk/ppaulev/chapter21/kap%2021.htm) in your post of [01-30-2003 10:32 PM](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?postid=2918845#post2918845). Are there others? It appears that they can be interpretted differently, as we’ve discussed already. We just disagree that “[Cecil’s answer is not trivially wrong, it is grossly wrong](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?postid=3020116#post3020116).” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/burning-calories-beer-icewater/52346.md?page=6)