# Bush admin found involved in illegal 'covert propaganda'; what can be the penalty? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 3, 2005, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-admin-found-involved-in-illegal-covert-propaganda-what-can-be-the-penalty/324518 "2005-10-03T03:14:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2005, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-admin-found-involved-in-illegal-covert-propaganda-what-can-be-the-penalty/324518/1 "2005-10-03T03:14:13Z")
**Bush administration found involved in illegal 'covert propaganda’** [http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20051001/pl\_afp/usmediapropaganda\_051001201306;\_ylt=ApTE68x0pkzf4knT6Ce9V.kKO7gF;\_ylu=X3oDMTA5bGVna3NhBHNlYwNzc3JlbA--](http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20051001/pl_afp/usmediapropaganda_051001201306;_ylt=ApTE68x0pkzf4knT6Ce9V.kKO7gF;_ylu=X3oDMTA5bGVna3NhBHNlYwNzc3JlbA--) > [@](#): > > Sat Oct 1, 4:13 PM ET > > WASHINGTON (AFP) - The administration of President George W. Bush broke the law as it resorted to illegal “covert propaganda” in trying to sell its key education initiative to the public, US congressional investigators have found. Previous threads on the subject: > **[S.266 "A bill to stop taxpayer funded Government propaganda"](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=321589)** > > Looking at the text of S.266 : “A bill to stop taxpayer funded Government propaganda”, it says: the Government Accountability Office (GAO) rules that there were several violations of publicity and propaganda prohibitions (bullet items 2-9) The... > **[White House caught planting a stooge in the press corps](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=301591)** > > Fake reporter planted by WH The Globe story is an entertaining read. Apparently, Shrub uses this guy regularly to bail himself out of tough spots and Gannon is not above lying like a sack: Then there’s these lowball attacks on Kerry diguised as... > **[U.S. government's fake-news propaganda is even more extensive than it appeared](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=306928)** > > The Bush Administration already has egg on its face from a few particular incidents of bribing journalists or columnists, or planting fake “journalists,” to propagate its views under the cover of serious journalism. We’ve had several recent GD... > **[Should the Bush Disclose All the Journalists on the Payroll?](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=299010)** > > First Armstrong Williams, now Maggie Gallagher, are discovered to be paid mouthpieces for Bush policy. Should the Bush Administration now disclose all remaining journalists who have been paid off, or will it be less damaging to let the sordid... > **[Bush Administration Disguises Political Ad as News Reporting at Public Expense](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=280189)** > > Bush Ad Surfaces As News Story on Schools View an excerpt from the “news report” here This is just more evidence that this administration believes it is accountable to no one, and can employ whatever sleazy, dishonest methods it wants to to... My primary question here is, what penalties can/should there be for this? The first thread from the list above is one I previously started referring to a new bill, but asked what the existing penalties there are for covert propaganda. The thread didn’t get very far, though. And the new article is also no help. ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2005, 10:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-admin-found-involved-in-illegal-covert-propaganda-what-can-be-the-penalty/324518/2 "2005-10-03T10:45:27Z")
Make them give $1M to John Stewart to make counter-ads. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2005, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-admin-found-involved-in-illegal-covert-propaganda-what-can-be-the-penalty/324518/3 "2005-10-03T12:47:01Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > **Bush administration found involved in illegal 'covert propaganda’** > [http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20051001/pl\_afp/usmediapropaganda\_051001201306;\_ylt=ApTE68x0pkzf4knT6Ce9V.kKO7gF;\_ylu=X3oDMTA5bGVna3NhBHNlYwNzc3JlbA--Previous](http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20051001/pl_afp/usmediapropaganda_051001201306;_ylt=ApTE68x0pkzf4knT6Ce9V.kKO7gF;_ylu=X3oDMTA5bGVna3NhBHNlYwNzc3JlbA--Previous) threads on the subject: > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=321589](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=321589) > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=301591](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=301591) > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=306928](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=306928) > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=299010](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=299010) > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=280189](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=280189) > > My primary question here is, what penalties can/should there be for this? The first thread from the list above is one I previously started referring to a new bill, but asked what the existing penalties there are for covert propaganda. The thread didn’t get very far, though. And the new article is also no help. I think the issue is using government funds for political purposes. I’m not sure if this is a criminal offense. Maybe a violation of laws regarding how government funds are spent? ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2005, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-admin-found-involved-in-illegal-covert-propaganda-what-can-be-the-penalty/324518/4 "2005-10-03T13:24:17Z")
Here’s a NYTimes article about it (registration required) [http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/01/politics/01educ.html?oref=login](http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/01/politics/01educ.html?oref=login) that also makes no mention of any penalities. The article ends with > [@](#): > > Congress tried to clarify the ban on “covert propaganda” in a bill signed by Mr. Bush in May. The law says that no federal money may be used to produce or distribute a news story unless the government’s role is openly acknowledged. which sounds like a reference to [S.266](http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=s109-266) : “A bill to stop taxpayer funded Government propaganda”, discussed a bit in the first previous thread I linked to in the OP. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2005, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-admin-found-involved-in-illegal-covert-propaganda-what-can-be-the-penalty/324518/5 "2005-10-03T22:11:26Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > My primary question here is, what penalties can/should there be for this? Well, there can’t be any penalties levied, legally, on the “Administration” as such. Maybe particular officials could be indicted. Impeaching the president, of course, is a political, not a legal decision, and one Congress as now constituted will never make. If the Dems gain strength in 2006 – then they still won’t do it, because then we would have President . . . I can’t even type it! :eek: ---
**Author:** ![SmackFu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/53a042/32.png) [@SmackFu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmackFu)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2005, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-admin-found-involved-in-illegal-covert-propaganda-what-can-be-the-penalty/324518/6 "2005-10-04T03:21:51Z")
Here’s the law: [Public Law 108-7](http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=108_cong_public_laws&docid=f:publ007.108). Section 626 (search for propaganda). It’s a really huge appropriations bill so watch out. Good luck trying to figure out what the penalties are. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2005, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-admin-found-involved-in-illegal-covert-propaganda-what-can-be-the-penalty/324518/7 "2005-10-04T12:48:53Z")
Thanks **SmackFu**. It’ll be some time before I get a chance to search that, though. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2005, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-admin-found-involved-in-illegal-covert-propaganda-what-can-be-the-penalty/324518/8 "2005-10-04T17:31:04Z")
Well, I read all the parts that mention ‘propaganda’, and it just seems to say that using the money for propaganda is prohibited, but makes no mention of any penalties for doing so. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2005, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-admin-found-involved-in-illegal-covert-propaganda-what-can-be-the-penalty/324518/9 "2005-10-06T13:19:14Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Well, there can’t be any penalties levied, legally, on the “Administration” as such. Maybe particular officials could be indicted. Impeaching the president, of course, is a political, not a legal decision, and one Congress as now constituted will never make. If the Dems gain strength in 2006 – then they still won’t do it, because then we would have President . . . I can’t even type it! :eek: Yeah, I seriously doubt this would get up to the level of president. I’d like to see whoever did this stuff get punished, though. It’s deceptive and immoral, and it galls me that my tax money was used for it. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2005, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-admin-found-involved-in-illegal-covert-propaganda-what-can-be-the-penalty/324518/10 "2005-10-06T13:50:32Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > My primary question here is, what penalties can/should there be for this? I’m not clear from the article when the violation occured. It appears that the report of those ads came out recently, but if the ads were produced before the antipropaganda law went into effect, I’m not sure that any law was violated. However, if the ads were produced while the antipropaganda law was in effect, it would be a violation of the Antideficiency Act. 31 USC 1350 says that a government official who knowingly and willfully spent funds on something for which the Congress has prohibited expenditures is subject to criminal penalties, namely fines up to $5,000 and up to 2 years in the slammer.