# Bush Administration gives 22 year old guy a $300M arms contract **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 27, 2008, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934 "2008-03-27T17:01:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/1 "2008-03-27T17:01:04Z")
[And he fucks it up, of course.](http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/03/todays_must_read_304.php) > [@](#): > > As the Times found out, AEY fulfilled that contract by dealing with a variety of shady arms dealers (one Czech, one Swiss) to get their hands on ammo stockpiles in the old Eastern bloc. And as far as ensuring the quality of the munitions? Here’s how it went in Albania: > > ``` > Albania offered to sell tens of millions of cartridges manufactured as long ago as 1950. For tests, a 25-year-old AEY representative was given 1,000 cartridges to fire, according to Ylli Pinari, the director of the arms export agency at the time of the sale. > > No ballistic performance was recorded, he said. The rounds were fired by hand. > > ``` > > Not surprisingly, the Afghan army has been unhappy with the product. AEY shipped the decades-old ammo in cardboard boxes – apparently to save money on shipping charges. And the Times reports that the boxes arrived in Afghanistan spilling out of the boxes, “revealing ammunition manufactured in China in 1966.” It’s illegal to deal in Chinese arms. There was apparently little if any evidence that these guys knew jack shit about dealing arms. Apparently any of us could do the same thing tomorrow. ---
**Author:** ![Omegaman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/e480ec/32.png) [@Omegaman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omegaman)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/2 "2008-03-27T17:03:47Z")
[QUOTE=RTFirefly] There was apparently little if any evidence that these guys knew jack shit about dealing arms. Apparently any of us could do the same thing tomorrow. [/QUOTE] Well where do I sign up? I believe I’m just the sort of dickhead who would do well in the arms business. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Scrappy\_Hero\_Pup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ea5d25/32.png) [@Happy\_Scrappy\_Hero\_Pup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Scrappy_Hero_Pup)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/3 "2008-03-27T17:11:36Z")
“and he fucks it up, of course?” Because of his age? I think by now it has become obvious that the young know more about certain things than the old do. Who here would be quick to hire a 50-year-old to set up a bank of servers? Whether this is one of them, I don’t know, but the snide remark that it was age… well, hike up your pants, grandpa, your prejudice is showing. Besides, if the contract had gone to an experienced arms dealer known to the administration, your post would have read, “Bush and Cronies Pad Friends’ Pockets by Granting Them Free License to Kill Afghanis.” And, as far as the meat of the article goes, the kid got by the oversight procedures… how? The only thing I learn from this is that I like guns and I won’t be so enamored by profit that I will jeopardize my free ride by sending the drug lords who are our allies equipment that will not efficiently kill villagers. Thus, I will be happy to assume stewardship of that contract. Tune in next week as **RTFirefly** reviews “Dick Cheney Sings the Veruca Salt Catalog!” ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/4 "2008-03-27T17:17:25Z")
Well, I _did_ stay in a Holiday Inn last night… ETA: **Happy SHP** , as a 25-year old, I’m more than happy to leave bulk arms dealing to old people. Apart from anything else, I just can’t pull off a Ukranian accent. ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/5 "2008-03-27T17:20:02Z")
[QUOTE=Really Not All That Bright] Well, I _did_ stay in a Holiday Inn last night… [/QUOTE] So whadda ya want? $300 million? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/6 "2008-03-27T17:22:07Z")
[QUOTE=Happy Scrappy Hero Pup] “and he fucks it up, of course?” Because of his age? I think by now it has become obvious that the young know more about certain things than the old do. Who here would be quick to hire a 50-year-old to set up a bank of servers? Whether this is one of them, I don’t know, but the snide remark that it was age… well, hike up your pants, grandpa, your prejudice is showing. [/QUOTE] I think the point was that a 22 year old doesn’t have experience, in general. I certainly wouldn’t hire a 22 year old just out of college to set up my servers. I’d hire a 35 year old that’s been doing it for ten years and knows what’s going to fuck up. Otherwise your rant wasn’t worth commenting on. Except for what I just said. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/7 "2008-03-27T17:25:23Z")
[QUOTE=Antinor01] So whadda ya want? $300 million? 😃 [/QUOTE] If anybody needs me I’ll be in the attic looking for illegal Chinese rifle ammunition. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/8 "2008-03-27T17:34:42Z")
[QUOTE=Happy Scrappy Hero Pup] " I think by now it has become obvious that the young know more about certain things than the old do. Who here would be quick to hire a 50-year-old to set up a bank of servers? [/QUOTE] Much of my server team in in their 50s and they are quite competent. It isn’t universal, but it is worth noting that server and sysadmin in their 50s usually made all the STUPID mistakes back with some verison of BSD Unix or Banyan Vines and therefore don’t really need to repeat them. As opposed to a 22 year old kid with a fresh scrubbed MCSE and “what do you mean change control” attitude. I think you’d be shocked how many people would be quick to hire the 50 year old. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/9 "2008-03-27T17:35:45Z")
[QUOTE=Lobohan] I think the point was that a 22 year old doesn’t have experience, in general. I certainly wouldn’t hire a 22 year old just out of college to set up my servers. I’d hire a 35 year old that’s been doing it for ten years and knows what’s going to fuck up. Otherwise your rant wasn’t worth commenting on. Except for what I just said. 😃 [/QUOTE] Seconded. There is **no** substitute for experience. Unfortunately, many don’t realize that (self included) until they actually have experience. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/10 "2008-03-27T18:01:51Z")
I’m 25 and I have a couple of matchbooks. $20 million, please! …while I hate to follow a joke with a serious post, I’m not bothered by any ageism in the OP. Due diligence should have turned up not only that this guy was 22 - and while there are probably some billionaires out there who are younger than that, it would have been fair to wonder “where’s he getting $300 million worth of stuff?” - but that he was a schmuck and an obvious fraud. ---
**Author:** ![Sal\_Ammoniac](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8dc957/32.png) [@Sal\_Ammoniac](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sal_Ammoniac)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/11 "2008-03-27T18:02:59Z")
In all the sorry annals of the war, this episode kind of stands out. This Administration gives out $300 million contracts with about the same amount of oversight as you might get from a person handing out Halloween candy. The only saving grace here is the **RTFirefly** got to this before I did, saving me the effort of crafting an OP. ---
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/12 "2008-03-27T18:05:54Z")
[QUOTE=D\_Odds] Seconded. There is **no** substitute for experience. Unfortunately, many don’t realize that (self included) until they actually have experience. [/QUOTE] Exactly, regardless of his age, you don’t just sign over a $300 M contract to someone who doesn’t have exceptional credentials and experience. If he was the Doogie Howser of the arms trade with 10 years experience and several successful contracts already completed, that would be a different story. That said, the 22-year-old took over his _dad’s_ company at the age of 19. So is it possible that he got awarded the contract based on his father’s crendentials and reputation? I can’t imagine how he’d get past basic oversight procedures otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![Cluricaun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/bb73d2/32.png) [@Cluricaun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cluricaun)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/13 "2008-03-27T18:12:02Z")
Hell, give me $300m and I’ll get you more ammo than you could shake an AK-47 at. Good stuff too. Doesn’t this kid read the Shotgun News? ---
**Author:** ![Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f0a364/32.png) [@Rube\_E.Tewesday](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rube_E.Tewesday)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/14 "2008-03-27T18:25:02Z")
I’m kinda wonderin’, though, where you find the reputable, experienced arms dealers who are bonded, insured, and happy to provide letters of reference from satisfied customers. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/15 "2008-03-27T18:31:31Z")
[QUOTE=Rube E. Tewesday] I’m kinda wonderin’, though, where you find the reputable, experienced arms dealers who are bonded, insured, and happy to provide letters of reference from satisfied customers. [/QUOTE] Google. [Here’s one.](http://www.scaadvisors.com/captainlasnaud.htm) > [@](#): > > I can’t imagine how he’d get past basic oversight procedures otherwise Easy answer: under the Bush admin, there are no basic oversight procedures. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/16 "2008-03-27T18:33:43Z")
Send _Lawyers_, Guns and Money, not **Idiots** , Guns and Money. ---
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/17 "2008-03-27T18:53:44Z")
[QUOTE=Zebra] Send _Lawyers_, Guns and Money, not **Idiots** , Guns and Money. [/QUOTE] LAWYERS?!? :smack: :: scratches “Voyeurs” off his shopping list :: ---
**Author:** ![black\_rabbit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/f19dbf/32.png) [@black\_rabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/black_rabbit)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2008, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/18 "2008-03-27T20:10:04Z")
[QUOTE=Happy Scrappy Hero Pup] “and he fucks it up, of course?” Because of his age? I think by now it has become obvious that the young know more about certain things than the old do. Who here would be quick to hire a 50-year-old to set up a bank of servers? [/QUOTE] Over a 22-year-old? So far as the law allows me, you bet your ass I would. I’m contemplating demoting a 23-year-old who was hired to replace a retiring 65-year-old server admin. The older guy knew his shit backwards and forwards. The younger guy’s arrogance far exceed his abilities, and due to his inexperience and arrogance (did I mention he’s arrogant?), he’s made several mistakes that cost a lot of money. Sure, there are plenty of 22-year-olds who know more than 50-year-olds on many topics. But computers have been with us for sixty years now, and the people who lived through the dot-com bubble are now in their early-to-mid 30s, at the youngest. –black rabbit, 30-year-old IT manager On preview: Yeah, thirded. ---
**Author:** ![Frostillicus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Frostillicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frostillicus)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2008, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/19 "2008-03-28T02:20:28Z")
I am sure this kid will end up being Wolfowitz’s nephew or Cheney’s great-grandchild or some such connection. ---
**Author:** ![DoctorJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctorj/32/2904_2.png) [@DoctorJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DoctorJ)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2008, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934/20 "2008-03-28T05:04:06Z")
Hell, I kind of respect the guy. Ideally the contract would go to experienced and qualified people, but we know that Bushco will pick the incompetent boob 100% of the time. So why not be that boob? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/bush-administration-gives-22-year-old-guy-a-300m-arms-contract/442934.md?page=2)